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New to Digital and Having Problems with the learning curve
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Sep 5, 2017 15:10:05   #
toxdoc42
 
That would make sense, however, looking at the photos, the exposure was just fine, but I had to use f/w.x and 1/60 with the flash bounced off of the ceiling using ttl setting. I guess I should not have used ttl and perhaps the flash would have provided enough to stop down?

This new technology is indeed challenging.

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Sep 5, 2017 15:15:04   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
What is f/w.x???

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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Sep 5, 2017 16:43:28   #
toxdoc42
 
Sorry, f/1.8, on my BlackBerry, yes I am a dinosaur, you have to hold down the alt key to get numbers and special characters.

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Sep 5, 2017 16:48:13   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
toxdoc42 wrote:
Sorry, f/1.8, on my BlackBerry, yes I am a dinosaur, you have to hold down the alt key to get numbers and special characters.


OK, give my suggestions a try as stated above earlier. Do you have any listing of a Guide Number for your off camera flash. That is one measure of its power, and may help us guide you more.

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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Sep 5, 2017 17:11:26   #
toxdoc42
 
Yes, I am old enough to remember having to set the aperture at a setting of the guide number divided by the distance. I thought we were well beyond those days. With an ASA of 1600 using the 1.8 would have cause total over-exposure at 5-8 feet that I shot at!

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Sep 5, 2017 17:25:03   #
toxdoc42
 
I am using a YN56828 electronic flas by Yongnuo.

The GN for ISO 100 is 58.

BTW, I found it interesting that the instructions state that the D3400 allegedly is compatible with this flash to a shutter speed up to 1/8000!

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Sep 5, 2017 17:25:19   #
frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.
 
toxdoc42 wrote:
Thanks to everyone for allowing me to ask so many questions. The learning curve for me is steep.

I was shooting photos with my new Nikon D3400, recently converted from film and sold my Nikon F2 and Nikormat and all of the lenses I owned, for the weekend celebrations of my mother in law who turned 100 years of age at the time. Lucky for me that most of the photos turned out just fine, for, sadly, she ended up dying a week later.

I was most often using a 50 mm f/1.8 AF-S lens on my Nikon D3400, Here is what the Nikon website states about the lens:


So far I have been very pleased with the lens. Photographing the party, I was fooled by the "autofocus" on several occasions and need to figure out what is the best for my use. I shot a "portrait" of 4 people using back focus to be sure one of them was in focus and the result was that only that one person was in fact in sharp focus, they seemed to be all in line to me through the view finder, and all in focus, so I thought. I shot at ISO 1600, hand held at 1/60 and f 1.8 from about 8 feet from them, flash pointed up for bounce effect. I am going to fool around with using different ISOs and see how high I can push it without getting too much noise, I wish that I had done that with this particular shot to enable me to close down the lens and gotten a little more depth of field. The camera finder and even the LCD doesn't really give you the feeling that any of the photo was out of focus.
Thanks to everyone for allowing me to ask so many ... (show quote)


Your f-stop is to open. With that lens and f-stop, your depth of field is only about from 7.7 feet to 8.2 feet, f/4 would give you just over a foot, which still might be shallow. Drop your iso to 100 or 200 when using flash that close and use a softbox diffuser and maybe cut the flash 1/2 power or less, if you already have light and shutter 1/125.. someone already put a link to an online DOF calculator.....I have one on my phone, HyperFocal Pro. It is a Very good one. Good camera, just remember, small f-stops (large opening) give very shallow DOF. The flash will also blur the background a little, unless too high a power.


(Download)

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Sep 5, 2017 17:43:06   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
I use Pentax, not Nikon, but that should be irrelevant in this setting. I've been using an old Canon 550EX, a reasonably powerful flash recently - but because of the brand mis-match I have to use it in manual mode. Partly because of my experience long-ago as a film photographer, I still tend to use shutter speeds like 1/30 (*) {which used to be needed to get flash and shutter to sync properly}. I found that I've been using ISO=100 when flash is aimed at subjects and IS=400 when I bounce off ceiling. Aperture settings have been in range f/4 to f/8. Remember that digital has the incredible advantage of allowing you to inspect your work immediately. Start off with settings in reasonable ranges, then adjust based on whether results in LCD seem to be in the right ballpark.


(*) as long as body and flash sync properly, shutter speed is typically not very important, because most of "speed" comes from short duration of electronic flash.

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Sep 5, 2017 18:13:54   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
toxdoc42 wrote:
I am using a YN56828 electronic flas by Yongnuo.

The GN for ISO 100 is 58.

BTW, I found it interesting that the instructions state that the D3400 allegedly is compatible with this flash to a shutter speed up to 1/8000!


That would be high speed sync, but in doing so you dramatically cut back power.

The guide number is in meters with a 105mm lens. With a normal lens (50mm angle of view on a full frame camera), the GN is 137 (in ft) for ISO 100.

I suggest that you had it mostly correct, but somehow got the idea that you needed ISO 1600 and F1.8 to take the picture when in fact, even with bouncing - which worked well for you as far as the quality of light is concerned - you would have been able to shoot with F5.6 to F8 and ISO 400 with that flash.

The image below was taken at F5.6 and ISO 400 with the speedlight set to 1/2 power. The 1/30 shutter speed was to allow a little of the ambient light to mix in a little bit. I used a ColorChecker Passport to create a camera color profile to remove the yellow cast that was contributed by the yellow walls and the halogen lighting. The GN on my speedlight is 120 at full power for normal lens at ISO 100, btw.

Bounce lighting when done correctly provides very natural and flattering light. Download the image to see the correct color, the thumbnail or preview image is usually off - overly contrasty and too saturated.
.
.


(Download)

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Sep 5, 2017 18:29:30   #
davidrb Loc: Half way there on the 45th Parallel
 
toxdoc42 wrote:
Thanks to everyone for allowing me to ask so many questions. The learning curve for me is steep.

I was shooting photos with my new Nikon D3400, recently converted from film and sold my Nikon F2 and Nikormat and all of the lenses I owned, for the weekend celebrations of my mother in law who turned 100 years of age at the time. Lucky for me that most of the photos turned out just fine, for, sadly, she ended up dying a week later.

I was most often using a 50 mm f/1.8 AF-S lens on my Nikon D3400, Here is what the Nikon website states about the lens:

"A must-have for standard portraits and everyday use, the AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.8G is a lens that will absolutely surprise you. The 50mm focal length (75mm equivalent on DX format cameras) with a fast f/1.8 aperture allows you to capture stunning images with a shallow depth-of-field, letting your subjects stand out from their backgrounds. The AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.8G may soon become your new favorite lens."

That is why I purchased this lens. On my F2 I used a 50 mm 1.4 as my "go to" lens, a 28 mm as my wide angle, my 85 for portraits and I had a 300 mm for telephoto work. It does seem that when I upgrade to a full frame sensor, the 50mm f/1.8 lens will work fine, since they claim it is optimized for that, claim its format is Fx35mm which probably is Nikon's way of saying it is formatted for full frame sensor, it says compatible with Fx, Dx and Fx in Dx mode.

So far I have been very pleased with the lens. Photographing the party, I was fooled by the "autofocus" on several occasions and need to figure out what is the best for my use. I shot a "portrait" of 4 people using back focus to be sure one of them was in focus and the result was that only that one person was in fact in sharp focus, they seemed to be all in line to me through the view finder, and all in focus, so I thought. I shot at ISO 1600, hand held at 1/60 and f 1.8 from about 8 feet from them, flash pointed up for bounce effect. I am going to fool around with using different ISOs and see how high I can push it without getting too much noise, I wish that I had done that with this particular shot to enable me to close down the lens and gotten a little more depth of field. The camera finder and even the LCD doesn't really give you the feeling that any of the photo was out of focus.

I don't have any pp software yet, but I assume none would help with this problem anyway.

Any thoughts? Suggestions?
Thanks to everyone for allowing me to ask so many ... (show quote)


Tame the learning curve by going to creativelive.com. Purchase a course titled Fundamentals of Photography by John Greengo. It is a long series of video lessons that covers everything you are trying to learn. Greengo is very good in his presentations, the lessons are easy to understand, and you can either download them or watch via streaming. They also make for a great refresher any time you want.

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Sep 5, 2017 18:43:14   #
frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.
 
Bill_de wrote:
You should be more than intrigued, you should be flabbergasted. Like many things you will read on any forum, it makes no sense.

Just like bouncing flash off a ceiling will give a yellow cast. That could be true in a house full of smokers with a nicotine stained ceiling. Bouncing flash off a white ceiling should be fine.

I think President Reagan was referring to UHH when he said. "Trust - but verify"

--
You should be more than intrigued, you should be f... (show quote)


Bounced light from a white ceiling should be ok......but bounced light can take on any prominent color......


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Sep 5, 2017 18:50:00   #
CaptainC Loc: Colorado, south of Denver
 
Here is something to make you think about your aperture when doing groups - The aperture should equal the number of people in the group and then close down one more.

So for four, think AT LEAST F/4.0 +1 or F/5.6. This is not THE aperture you need - it is a memory jog to get you to think about what aperture you do need. Two people side by side MIGHT allow you to shoot at f/2.8, but if one is behind the other, f/5.6 would probably be better.

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Sep 5, 2017 19:24:55   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
toxdoc42 wrote:
Yes, I am old enough to remember having to set the aperture at a setting of the guide number divided by the distance. I thought we were well beyond those days. With an ASA of 1600 using the 1.8 would have cause total over-exposure at 5-8 feet that I shot at!


I am also old enough to remember having to do that too. My Sekonic meter tells me a proper exposure at ISO 1600 is 1/50 or 1/60 at f1.8 with the usual evening light in my family room. So, you should have enough power with your 58 GN flash to cut the ISO to 400-800 range and close down the aperture to 5.6 or so. I would be interested to see what you get at ISO 200 or 400 at 1/125 at f5.6 and you flash at 1/2 or full power. my Canon Speedlites have a GN of about 190 at ISO 100 so they are more powerful by a fair margin. That is similar to the GN the Speedlites Bob Harrington uses in his videos...GN 150 to 190.

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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Sep 5, 2017 19:30:24   #
Notorious T.O.D. Loc: Harrisburg, North Carolina
 
frankraney wrote:
Bounced light from a white ceiling should be ok......but bounced light can take on any prominent color......



Not a problem if you shoot RAW as you can adjust in PP easily enough. I shoot white balance with Flash setting or Daylight setting as they are pretty close in color tempfor Canon. A lot of my flash stuff I will completely kill the ambient light and the flash provides all the light. I also have a ColorChecker Passport profile set up for full flash use. Makes it easy to correct any WB or tint issues.

Best,
Todd Ferguson

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Sep 5, 2017 19:37:57   #
frankraney Loc: Clovis, Ca.
 
Notorious T.O.D. wrote:
Not a problem if you shoot RAW as you can adjust in PP easily enough. I shoot white balance with Flash setting or Daylight setting as they are pretty close in color tempfor Canon. A lot of my flash stuff I will completely kill the ambient light and the flash provides all the light. I also have a ColorChecker Passport profile set up for full flash use. Makes it easy to correct any WB or tint issues.

Best,
Todd Ferguson


What you say is true. I'm just saying, it "can" take on the color.

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