Ugly Hedgehog - Photography Forum
Home Active Topics Newest Pictures Search Login Register
Main Photography Discussion
Which Sharpening Tools
Page 1 of 3 next> last>>
May 24, 2017 11:49:59   #
kenArchi Loc: Seal Beach, CA
 
There are a variety of sharpening tools.
I only have elements 11.
Unsharp mask, auto sharpen, adjust sharpness and (high pass?).

Reply
May 24, 2017 12:03:07   #
Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI
 
The best tool for sharpening, in my humble opinion, is buying the sharpest lenses one can afford and working on a good shooting technique.

Other than that, I use a combination of LR, colorefex 4 and photoshop.

Reply
May 24, 2017 12:04:14   #
big-guy Loc: Peterborough Ontario Canada
 
Yup, those are the ones.

Reply
 
 
May 24, 2017 12:06:53   #
ggttc Loc: TN
 
After wading thru several 30 day free trials finally decided on piccure.

Reply
May 24, 2017 12:10:34   #
rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona
 
I prefer the ones developed by Jeff Schewe and available in ACR. My opinion is there are none better.
--Bob

kenArchi wrote:
There are a variety of sharpening tools.
I only have elements 11.
Unsharp mask, auto sharpen, adjust sharpness and (high pass?).

Reply
May 24, 2017 13:23:06   #
bsprague Loc: Lacey, WA, USA
 
I'm pretty sure Elements 13 would open any file in ACR. Maybe 11 too. ACR (Adobe Camera Raw) has very good sharpening tools.

http://blogs.adobe.com/pselements/open-jpeg-files-in-adobe-camera-raw-in-photoshop-elements/

Reply
May 24, 2017 13:46:52   #
MichaelH Loc: NorCal via Lansing, MI
 
rmalarz wrote:
I prefer the ones developed by Jeff Schewe and available in ACR. My opinion is there are none better.
--Bob

Thank you!

Reply
 
 
May 24, 2017 17:13:12   #
Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska
 
Cdouthitt wrote:
The best tool for sharpening, in my humble opinion, is buying the sharpest lenses one can afford and working on a good shooting technique.

Thats a recipe for a really good apple pie, but the question is about orange marmalade! There is no connection between the resolving power of a lens, assisted by good technique, and what is done with a "sharpen" tool in software! None. Two different things.

Software sharpening is always useful on an image produced by a camera using a Bayer Color Filter Array (almost all DSLR's). The reason is because each image pixel is defined from a matrix of sensor locations. Because a matrix is used the shortest pixel distance that is possible for a tone transition is about 6 pixels, but is more commonly about 12. Ideally it would be 1 pixel from pure black to pure white, but that is impossible with a Bayer CFA.

Sharpening reduces the number of pixels needed for a tone transition.

However, there are three common ways to do that, each with slightly different effects. What is called a high pass sharpen tool, or just "Sharpen", looks for multiple consecutive tone transitions and makes them have higher contrast. It has less effect on a single tone transition, but a technique called "Unsharp Mask", or USM, looks for just one transition (and averages multiple transitions to just one tone) adds contrast to single tone transitions. Obviously those two techniques can produce very different results. USM can be adjusted to see each transition in a sequence as if it is just one single transition, and can in effect do almost the same thing as a Sharpen tool. One significant difference is that USM cannot be reversed, while a high pass filter can be adjusted to reverse the effects of a low pass filter.

One other technique, for those who get really serious, is deconvolution. The best example is the Richardson-Lucy technique (used to adjust for the error in the original Hubble telescope). Unlike the other two methods that do not really increase resolving power, and merely add visual acuity with increased contrast, deconvolution can actually increase resolution. It just is not easy to use though...

Another variation of USM and/or Sharpen should be mentioned too. "Smart Sharpen" is a technique to find the significant edges in an image and apply sharpen only where it is most useful. That has the advantage of not sharpening noise, for example.

What's it all mean though, and how do you use that information? Realize that if an image has been reduced in size from the original, USM will probably have more effect. If the image as been enlarged Sharpen will probably have more effect. Also there are different filters that can be used, and a sharper filter works best on images that have been reduced in size, while a smooth filter works best for enlarged images.

Any particular image will benefit from either USM or Sharpen, and using both is probably the best solution.

Reply
May 24, 2017 17:36:29   #
kenArchi Loc: Seal Beach, CA
 
Well Apaflo, that's quit an ear full. My education only goes as high as HS algebra and physics.

So, it looks like for archtectural high pass gives me clearer lines versus usm.

Reply
May 24, 2017 17:37:36   #
Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI
 
Apaflo wrote:
Thats a recipe for a really good apple pie, but the question is about orange marmalade! There is no connection between the resolving power of a lens, assisted by good technique, and what is done with a "sharpen" tool in software! None. Two different things.

Software sharpening is always useful on an image produced by a camera using a Bayer Color Filter Array (almost all DSLR's). The reason is because each image pixel is defined from a matrix of sensor locations. Because a matrix is used the shortest pixel distance that is possible for a tone transition is about 6 pixels, but is more commonly about 12. Ideally it would be 1 pixel from pure black to pure white, but that is impossible with a Bayer CFA.

Sharpening reduces the number of pixels needed for a tone transition.

However, there are three common ways to do that, each with slightly different effects. What is called a high pass sharpen tool, or just "Sharpen", looks for multiple consecutive tone transitions and makes them have higher contrast. It has less effect on a single tone transition, but a technique called "Unsharp Mask", or USM, looks for just one transition (and averages multiple transitions to just one tone) adds contrast to single tone transitions. Obviously those two techniques can produce very different results. USM can be adjusted to see each transition in a sequence as if it is just one single transition, and can in effect do almost the same thing as a Sharpen tool. One significant difference is that USM cannot be reversed, while a high pass filter can be adjusted to reverse the effects of a low pass filter.

One other technique, for those who get really serious, is deconvolution. The best example is the Richardson-Lucy technique (used to adjust for the error in the original Hubble telescope). Unlike the other two methods that do not really increase resolving power, and merely add visual acuity with increased contrast, deconvolution can actually increase resolution. It just is not easy to use though...

Another variation of USM and/or Sharpen should be mentioned too. "Smart Sharpen" is a technique to find the significant edges in an image and apply sharpen only where it is most useful. That has the advantage of not sharpening noise, for example.

What's it all mean though, and how do you use that information? Realize that if an image has been reduced in size from the original, USM will probably have more effect. If the image as been enlarged Sharpen will probably have more effect. Also there are different filters that can be used, and a sharper filter works best on images that have been reduced in size, while a smooth filter works best for enlarged images.

Any particular image will benefit from either USM or Sharpen, and using both is probably the best solution.
Thats a recipe for a really good apple pie, but th... (show quote)


Cutting food with a dull knife turns it into mush no matter how careful you are. Start with sharp tools and know how to use them.

Reply
May 24, 2017 18:07:19   #
boberic Loc: Quiet Corner, Connecticut. Ex long Islander
 
Cdouthitt wrote:
Cutting food with a dull knife turns it into mush no matter how careful you are. Start with sharp tools and know how to use them.


I use a stone and a steel

Reply
 
 
May 24, 2017 19:47:12   #
Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska
 
Cdouthitt wrote:
Cutting food with a dull knife turns it into mush no matter how careful you are. Start with sharp tools and know how to use them.

No matter how you cut it, resolving power of the lens is very very different than the sharpness of edge transitions from a Bayer sensor.

You need both, and neither compensates for lack of the other.

Reply
May 24, 2017 19:55:12   #
Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska
 
kenArchi wrote:
Well Apaflo, that's quit an ear full. My education only goes as high as HS algebra and physics.

So, it looks like for archtectural high pass gives me clearer lines versus usm.

What I said doesn't use HS algebra or physics!

Nor did anything in that article say that you necessarily get clearer lines from either USM or Sharpen. In general, but not always, USM will have more effect on images that have been down sized. And Sharpen will have more effect on images that have been up size. But in most cases it is best to use a little bit of each.

Also note that it is best done "by inspection". View a section of the image at 100 percent to judge how much can be applied.

Reply
May 24, 2017 20:06:50   #
Apaflo Loc: Anchorage, Alaska
 
Cdouthitt wrote:
Cutting food with a dull knife turns it into mush no matter how careful you are. Start with sharp tools and know how to use them.

Picking the right tool for the job is equally important. A sharp cleaver used to cut off a frozen roast for the oven (similar to the lens on a camera) is not even close to the right carving knife to slice off servings from the cooked roast (the same as sharpening an image out of the camera).

Until you knuckle down and learn the technology involved in the processes of photography it will not be possible to do your best. Have fun, yes; but not your best. This is, and it cannot be escaped with fantasy flights into the world of Ludditism, a very technical field of endeavor.

Reply
May 24, 2017 20:45:25   #
Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI
 
boberic wrote:
I use a stone and a steel


To keep them sharp. Same here...it keeps my WMF knives in tip top shape.

Reply
Page 1 of 3 next> last>>
If you want to reply, then register here. Registration is free and your account is created instantly, so you can post right away.
Main Photography Discussion
UglyHedgehog.com - Forum
Copyright 2011-2024 Ugly Hedgehog, Inc.