Another Look at Men's Beards
May 19, 2017 12:45:28 #
Don't take this too seriously. A while back there was a long, protracted discussion, with a variety of opinions, about men's beards. The discussion went on for a couple of days.
As I was reading my NY Times (digital) today, I noticed a lengthy article on the same topic, "Are Men With Beards More Desirable?. After reading, I felt it was the definitive study and opinion on the topic. So, let the games begin! I hope you are listening, Jerry!!! What do you think Samantha? (a more valued opinion)
I quote (and rest my case for my own beard of more than 50 years)
Mark
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Are Men With Beards More Desirable?
In the past few years, a number of predictions have declared the end of the beard. “Sorry guys, beards are over,” said the website Mashable. “Beards Aren’t Cool Anymore,” said Vice.
But beards are still here — at the Oscars, parading down catwalks and on regular guys. Could it be that beards are more than a fashion statement?
Science suggests that facial hair — from scruffy day-old stubble to full Grizzly Adams — is imbued with social messages, and can play a significant role in a man’s love life.
Last year, researchers from the University of Queensland in Australia decided to explore male facial hair to determine what role, if any, beards play in sexual attractiveness, masculinity and short- and long-term relationships.
The team gathered data from 8,520 women, who were divided among three groups. Each group of women was shown pictures of men with varying degrees of facial hair. The images, which had been manipulated by the research team to show the same men more or less bearded, showed the men with clean shaven faces, light stubble (five days of growth) heavy stubble (10 days of growth) and a thick beard representing about one month of growth.
Next, each group of women was asked to mull a different question about the man’s sex appeal.
The first group rated the men’s beardless-to-bearded faces for overall sexual attractiveness.
The second group also rated the photos, but this time they were asked to score the pictures based on short-term attractiveness: Which of the men seemed most desirable for a fling or a one-night stand?
The third group rated the men in the photos as long-term prospects: Which of the men had a face that suggested he might be a good candidate for marriage and commitment?
The answers, which were published in the Journal of Evolutionary Biology, varied depending on what the woman was looking for. Overall, the women said the sexiest men were those sporting heavy stubble, followed by short stubble. Men with full beards and clean-shaven men were rated the lowest on the overall sexiness scale.
What kind of man is most attractive to a woman looking for a short-term fling or one-night stand? Men with light stubble won that contest, closely followed by men with heavier stubble, suggesting that the scruffy look appeals to women looking for fun, but not commitment.
But when it came to choosing a long-term partner, a guy with whom a woman could have babies or settle in for the duration, the more facial hair the better. Men with heavy stubble and full beards were the clear winners on this question, suggesting that men who are ready to commit might do better if they shave less often.
The authors of the study theorize that for women who are looking for a long-term mate, beardedness may be more attractive as it “indicates a male’s
Barnaby Dixson, a human behavioral ecologist at the University of Queensland and a co-author of the beard length study, has been researching mate preferences for a decade. He explains that both sexes judge men with beards as older and more masculine, and describe them as generous, sincere, industrious and self-confident.
But Dr. Dixson, who sports a full beard, says research has also found that facial hair is associated with some antisocial traits, such as aggression and social dominance. While these traits might not be pleasant if you’re looking for a fun fling, they might be alluring if you want an alpha male to support your family and fend off predators.
It’s not just women who prefer bearded alpha males — men also prefer men with facial hair.
Dr. Dixson and colleagues asked 1,577 men and women from Brazil and the Czech Republic about facial hair. Compared to heterosexual women, gay men had stronger preferences for men with more facial hair.
“Homosexual men preferred hairier stimuli than heterosexual women, supporting past findings that homosexual men have strong preferences for masculine traits,” the authors reported.
Brazilians preferred bigger beards than Czechs. Homosexual men preferred men with beards similar to their own. Czech women preferred men with beards that were similar to the beards their fathers had during their childhood.
The study, published in March in the journal Evolution and Human Behavior, also found that men often preferred thicker facial hair than their real partners actually had. The authors noted that the fact that people don’t end up with their “ideal” — at least in terms of his beard — may be because their ideal is not readily available, so they “compromise.”
Not every man can grow a beard naturally. More men with hairless faces have begun seeking hair transplants, according to the International Society of Hair Restoration Surgery. In 2014, the latest year for which data are available, 13,956 men around the world had hair transplants to enhance their beards, up from 4,707 in 2012. More than 3,100 of the men were in the United States. Beard transplants are most popular in Asian countries, where nearly 4,200 men had the treatment in 2014.
Whether men choose to grow beards may also depend on the context in which they live. A 2016 study found that beards are more common in crowded cities where average incomes are lower. In this environment, where money is scarce and there is more competition for mates, men may feel they need to ramp up their masculinity. On the flip side, “when competition in the social environment is reduced and the need to signal dominance is of less importance, men may dial down their masculinity through shaving or grooming their beards,” Dr. Dixson wrote in an email. Which may be why beards seem to be less common in the less populated suburbs.
Another factor that influences whether men decide to grow some stubble is the frequency of beardedness around them. “When beardedness becomes too common, it is less attractive than when it is rare,” Dr. Dixson wrote. “This may explain why fashions and trends in beardedness fluctuate over time.”
Christopher Oldstone-Moore, author of the 2015 book “Of Beards and Men: The Revealing History of Facial Hair,” maintains that history more than biology establishes meanings for facial hair. “I wonder if the positive effects of beards are a matter of the current cultural preference for beards, and perhaps the idea that bearded men are more mature, confident and reliable is because that is what we are tending to associate with beards these days,” Dr. Oldstone-Moore, a senior lecturer at Wright State University in Dayton, Ohio, wrote in an email. “Whenever masculinity is redefined facial hairstyles change to suit.”
As I was reading my NY Times (digital) today, I noticed a lengthy article on the same topic, "Are Men With Beards More Desirable?. After reading, I felt it was the definitive study and opinion on the topic. So, let the games begin! I hope you are listening, Jerry!!! What do you think Samantha? (a more valued opinion)
I quote (and rest my case for my own beard of more than 50 years)
Mark
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Are Men With Beards More Desirable?
In the past few years, a number of predictions have declared the end of the beard. “Sorry guys, beards are over,” said the website Mashable. “Beards Aren’t Cool Anymore,” said Vice.
But beards are still here — at the Oscars, parading down catwalks and on regular guys. Could it be that beards are more than a fashion statement?
Science suggests that facial hair — from scruffy day-old stubble to full Grizzly Adams — is imbued with social messages, and can play a significant role in a man’s love life.
Last year, researchers from the University of Queensland in Australia decided to explore male facial hair to determine what role, if any, beards play in sexual attractiveness, masculinity and short- and long-term relationships.
The team gathered data from 8,520 women, who were divided among three groups. Each group of women was shown pictures of men with varying degrees of facial hair. The images, which had been manipulated by the research team to show the same men more or less bearded, showed the men with clean shaven faces, light stubble (five days of growth) heavy stubble (10 days of growth) and a thick beard representing about one month of growth.
Next, each group of women was asked to mull a different question about the man’s sex appeal.
The first group rated the men’s beardless-to-bearded faces for overall sexual attractiveness.
The second group also rated the photos, but this time they were asked to score the pictures based on short-term attractiveness: Which of the men seemed most desirable for a fling or a one-night stand?
The third group rated the men in the photos as long-term prospects: Which of the men had a face that suggested he might be a good candidate for marriage and commitment?
The answers, which were published in the Journal of Evolutionary Biology, varied depending on what the woman was looking for. Overall, the women said the sexiest men were those sporting heavy stubble, followed by short stubble. Men with full beards and clean-shaven men were rated the lowest on the overall sexiness scale.
What kind of man is most attractive to a woman looking for a short-term fling or one-night stand? Men with light stubble won that contest, closely followed by men with heavier stubble, suggesting that the scruffy look appeals to women looking for fun, but not commitment.
But when it came to choosing a long-term partner, a guy with whom a woman could have babies or settle in for the duration, the more facial hair the better. Men with heavy stubble and full beards were the clear winners on this question, suggesting that men who are ready to commit might do better if they shave less often.
The authors of the study theorize that for women who are looking for a long-term mate, beardedness may be more attractive as it “indicates a male’s
Barnaby Dixson, a human behavioral ecologist at the University of Queensland and a co-author of the beard length study, has been researching mate preferences for a decade. He explains that both sexes judge men with beards as older and more masculine, and describe them as generous, sincere, industrious and self-confident.
But Dr. Dixson, who sports a full beard, says research has also found that facial hair is associated with some antisocial traits, such as aggression and social dominance. While these traits might not be pleasant if you’re looking for a fun fling, they might be alluring if you want an alpha male to support your family and fend off predators.
It’s not just women who prefer bearded alpha males — men also prefer men with facial hair.
Dr. Dixson and colleagues asked 1,577 men and women from Brazil and the Czech Republic about facial hair. Compared to heterosexual women, gay men had stronger preferences for men with more facial hair.
“Homosexual men preferred hairier stimuli than heterosexual women, supporting past findings that homosexual men have strong preferences for masculine traits,” the authors reported.
Brazilians preferred bigger beards than Czechs. Homosexual men preferred men with beards similar to their own. Czech women preferred men with beards that were similar to the beards their fathers had during their childhood.
The study, published in March in the journal Evolution and Human Behavior, also found that men often preferred thicker facial hair than their real partners actually had. The authors noted that the fact that people don’t end up with their “ideal” — at least in terms of his beard — may be because their ideal is not readily available, so they “compromise.”
Not every man can grow a beard naturally. More men with hairless faces have begun seeking hair transplants, according to the International Society of Hair Restoration Surgery. In 2014, the latest year for which data are available, 13,956 men around the world had hair transplants to enhance their beards, up from 4,707 in 2012. More than 3,100 of the men were in the United States. Beard transplants are most popular in Asian countries, where nearly 4,200 men had the treatment in 2014.
Whether men choose to grow beards may also depend on the context in which they live. A 2016 study found that beards are more common in crowded cities where average incomes are lower. In this environment, where money is scarce and there is more competition for mates, men may feel they need to ramp up their masculinity. On the flip side, “when competition in the social environment is reduced and the need to signal dominance is of less importance, men may dial down their masculinity through shaving or grooming their beards,” Dr. Dixson wrote in an email. Which may be why beards seem to be less common in the less populated suburbs.
Another factor that influences whether men decide to grow some stubble is the frequency of beardedness around them. “When beardedness becomes too common, it is less attractive than when it is rare,” Dr. Dixson wrote. “This may explain why fashions and trends in beardedness fluctuate over time.”
Christopher Oldstone-Moore, author of the 2015 book “Of Beards and Men: The Revealing History of Facial Hair,” maintains that history more than biology establishes meanings for facial hair. “I wonder if the positive effects of beards are a matter of the current cultural preference for beards, and perhaps the idea that bearded men are more mature, confident and reliable is because that is what we are tending to associate with beards these days,” Dr. Oldstone-Moore, a senior lecturer at Wright State University in Dayton, Ohio, wrote in an email. “Whenever masculinity is redefined facial hairstyles change to suit.”
May 19, 2017 12:50:19 #
May 19, 2017 12:56:22 #
May 19, 2017 13:08:08 #
Tom G
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Both.
Not your post, but the lengthy one from the NYT.
Articles like this one should be relegated to "Ego Pumpers" like Men's Health, Esquire, Playboy, that are published for men (boys) who can't get laid with regularity or who enjoy sex with themselves.
Nobody gives a healthy Sh*t.
And, even commenting on it as I am is a Waste of Time... So I'll stop.
Not your post, but the lengthy one from the NYT.
Articles like this one should be relegated to "Ego Pumpers" like Men's Health, Esquire, Playboy, that are published for men (boys) who can't get laid with regularity or who enjoy sex with themselves.
Nobody gives a healthy Sh*t.
And, even commenting on it as I am is a Waste of Time... So I'll stop.
May 19, 2017 13:29:42 #
I posted it to have some fun. Sorry you cannot indulge.
Thanks for viewing.
Mark
Thanks for viewing.
Mark
May 19, 2017 13:34:19 #
I go back and forth between having a beard and not and there's just a whole different group of women that like bearded men and a whole different group of women that like none bearded men
May 19, 2017 13:36:34 #
romanticf16
Loc: Commerce Twp, MI
markngolf wrote:
Don't take this too seriously. A while back there ... (show quote)
Just finished some severe Chemotherapy. My wife came home to find me clean shaven- she's never seen my face without a beard in 38years! When she chided me of "no warning" I reminded her of the morning she came home a Redhead- I guess we had about the same thought- give me time to get used to it. Now she says it makes me look younger!
May 19, 2017 13:41:32 #
Tom G wrote:
Both.
Not your post, but the lengthy one from the NYT.
Articles like this one should be relegated to "Ego Pumpers" like Men's Health, Esquire, Playboy, that are published for men (boys) who can't get laid with regularity or who enjoy sex with themselves.
Nobody gives a healthy Sh*t.
And, even commenting on it as I am is a Waste of Time... So I'll stop.
Not your post, but the lengthy one from the NYT.
Articles like this one should be relegated to "Ego Pumpers" like Men's Health, Esquire, Playboy, that are published for men (boys) who can't get laid with regularity or who enjoy sex with themselves.
Nobody gives a healthy Sh*t.
And, even commenting on it as I am is a Waste of Time... So I'll stop.
Yes.
Reminds me of a conversation I had with my middle aged fellow bicycle racers a few years back. What kind of facial hair should we grow, mustache, goatee, whatever?
Do we all remember why we started doing this when we were eighteen? We all remembered, the debate was suddenly finished, we didn't grow beards. Now 64, I don't need to look more mature.
If I wasn't doing this, I'd probable be watching TV, so waste of time either way. I'll stop now too.
May 19, 2017 15:15:37 #
Tom G
Loc: Atlanta, GA
markngolf wrote:
I posted it to have some fun. Sorry you cannot indulge.
Thanks for viewing.
Mark
Thanks for viewing.
Mark
Fun? For whom? Samantha and Jerry? Was it supposed to be humorous to them? Was it an inside joke? What about the rest of us?
Not knowing one well, or even at all, One usually take another literally. So, I took you literally and missed the "Fun".
When people know each other they can usually recognize humor or "Fun" as you put it. They can realize when a friend or someone they know is "putting them on". Then they can participate in repartee or laugh together.
You gave no indication or signal that you were posting "tongue in cheek" or in a facetious or comedic manner.
Strangers don't laugh at another's statements because most times they assume the commentary is serious.
So, I, not knowing you had to take what you posted seriously. I had no clue it was supposed to be posted in "Fun".
Next time give is a signal or two so I (we) can laugh with you.
May 19, 2017 17:42:41 #
Tom,
The post was a followup to a previous thread about beards. I clearly stated that in the introductory paragraphs. Perhaps you did not understand? My fault. Jerry & Samantha are UHH friends,
so I purposely mentioned them in those same intro paragraphs. They had posted in the original thread. My initial statement in my post was, "Don't take this too seriously" or did you miss that? Lastly, if you were not interested in the material, why didn't you just pass it up? If I have offended or antagonized you, I apologize.
Now, I've explained and apologized. Your replies have been curt and aggressive. Hopefully, your anger has been dissipated.
Mark
The post was a followup to a previous thread about beards. I clearly stated that in the introductory paragraphs. Perhaps you did not understand? My fault. Jerry & Samantha are UHH friends,
so I purposely mentioned them in those same intro paragraphs. They had posted in the original thread. My initial statement in my post was, "Don't take this too seriously" or did you miss that? Lastly, if you were not interested in the material, why didn't you just pass it up? If I have offended or antagonized you, I apologize.
Now, I've explained and apologized. Your replies have been curt and aggressive. Hopefully, your anger has been dissipated.
Mark
Tom G wrote:
Fun? For whom? Samantha and Jerry? Was it suppos... (show quote)
May 19, 2017 18:21:14 #
Tom G
Loc: Atlanta, GA
markngolf wrote:
Tom, br The post was a followup to a previous thre... (show quote)
Thank you very much Mark for the explanation. I was not offended, I just could not understand why such an innocuous article would have been posted for all to read when friends knew what you were referring to.
I read your admonition of not taking it too seriously, but it flew past me.
I try not be aggressive; however, I am usually very direct, sometimes curt; it's just my nature.
So, I now understand, and will be more perspicacious when reading yours (and other's) posts.
I reacted too quickly. And, I am sorry for causing you any unnecessary consternation.
Let's carry on...
May 19, 2017 20:55:44 #
May 20, 2017 07:34:21 #
hj
Loc: Florida
Mark, I have to congratulate you on your kind, patient demeanor in your posts. Sometimes it's difficult with the attitude of some arrogant responders. :-)
markngolf wrote:
Tom, br The post was a followup to a previous thre... (show quote)
May 20, 2017 07:37:10 #
May 20, 2017 07:59:54 #
Interesting study but I'm wondering if there may be a cultural bias in Australia, the study site, and if age demographic is a value to be considered.
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