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Is it worth $300?
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Dec 5, 2016 11:07:59   #
cactuspic Loc: Dallas, TX
 
The demands put on RAM depend in part on you file size and the type of processing you do. If you have a 50 MP camera and you do focus stacking, panoramas, luminosity masks or other taxing procedures, then I would recommend the additional RAM as well as a loaded graphics card.

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Dec 5, 2016 11:09:09   #
desert-view
 
I recently bought a new desktop used mostly for image processing. My raw files are around 24 megs (sony alpha). I use mostly "elements 14", "portrait pro" software. From my experience,
1. 12 gigs of memory is adequate.
2. 4.0 gz core I7 processor very desirable, the faster the better.
3. 1 SSD used to store all applications and operating system (250 gigs capacity is adequate)
4. A second separate SSD used to store all recent working image files RAW and JPG (mine is also 250 gigs but I archive every 4 months (approx).
5. 1-2 terabyte hard drive to store archived image files and other documents
6. Do not ever attempt to Defrag SSD files.

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Dec 5, 2016 11:11:04   #
trek6500mt
 
Gene51 wrote:
I just read three pages of very well-intentioned responses to your question, but none have asked the most important question - what software do you use?

You need to know how the software engineers have written their software before you can decide on a configuration. I think you'd want a machine that you can use today, and still provide some expansion capability for the future. Without knowing the specifics, you are using a D800. These generate 45mb raw files, and if you edit a file in Photoshop, in 16 bit, you will end up with an image that is typically 500mb, or more if you make extensive use of layers. If you use content aware features, gaussian blur, stitch together panoramas, do focus stacking and HDR, etc - 16 gb ram is not going to be enough. With 32 gb ram, you will be able to edit .psb files, which are 2 gb or bigger. I do it all the time with 32 gb. If you use Photoshop, b\uying a computer with 32 would be the right move for your needs today, and in the near future. Having the capability to expand to 64gb would give you a degree of future proofing. As we have all experienced, ram is constantly getting denser and cheaper. Buying more than you need today may not be the best use of your $$$. If you wait until you actually need it, you may end up paying a lot less. Just make sure your motherboard has enough slots, and that your current configuration leaves enough room for adding memory without tossing lower density chips. When the time comes, you want to be able to buy just 32 gb ram, and not 65 gb, tossing out your 8gb sticks and replacing them with 16 gb ones.

Lightroom, if you use that, is a horse of a different color. It does not improve appreciably with more than 16 gb. When I went from 16 to 32 gb, I really didn't notice any improvement in performance. But LR did not have HDR or pano stitching. What LR does utilitize is mutliple CPU cores - 4 is considered minimum, and it will use up to 6 or 8 if you have them. There are 6 and 8 core i7 cpus (68XXa series) that really fly with LR.

Graphics are even easier. There is no real benefit to having more than 4 gb vram unless your use includes driving a pair of 5k displays with a 4k video editing application. The extra ram is used for frame buffering for video at high frame rates - mostly for a smooth gaming experience or for 4k video editing.

Howeveri f you have a 10 bit capable display and you want to be able to turn on the 10 bit graphics capability in Photoshop, you will need a 10 bit card - your choices are either NVidia Quadro, or ATI Fire Pro cards. The card needs to support the Open GL and Open CL libraries. That's it. The newer non-10 bit cards are slightly faster when used with LR or PS, but just barely. A 5 yr old NVidia GT550 with 2 gb ram will easily drive a pair of 1920x1200 displays with decent performance. I went from that card to an NVidia K2200 with 4 gb, and the performance improvement was modest at best. I have one student that has is a gamer and uses Photoshop. He did not see any difference upgrading to a GTX1080 with 8 gb from a GTX 960 with 2 gb as far as PH was concerned. He did see a substantial improvement with his gaming apps though. Fast hard drives are considerably better than fast graphics cards loaded with lots of vram for Photoshop. And LR is even less dependent on GPU speed and vram.

Here are some guidelines from Adobe on graphics cards:

https://helpx.adobe.com/camera-raw/system-requirements.html#General
https://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/kb/photoshop-cc-gpu-card-faq.html
https://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/kb/photoshop-cc-gpu-card-faq.html#CardRequirements
I just read three pages of very well-intentioned r... (show quote)


Good points!

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Dec 5, 2016 11:12:55   #
desert-view
 
Oh I forgot, a large capacity graphics card is important.

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Dec 5, 2016 11:44:59   #
twr25 Loc: New Jersey
 
Most high end graphics cards have memory on board for processing ... buy the best card you can afford. working Memory can be added later

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Dec 5, 2016 12:11:48   #
mas24 Loc: Southern CA
 
I just upgraded an 8 year old backup laptop computer from 2gb RAM to 4gb. And I was so thrilled over it. Now RAM is 32gb and more. My current has 8gb. Until I get a Dell, 12-16gb on my next purchase.

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Dec 5, 2016 12:23:51   #
Desert Gecko Loc: desert southwest, USA
 
wapiti wrote:
Thanks guys for your prompt responses. I'm having a hard time deciding whether to go with a ready built machine from Dell or have one built to my specifications. I'm now starting to lean toward the latter because it seems that the ready built ones each have something that is not the most efficient for image editing.


This is the correct answer - you answered it yourself! Dell does not manufacture computers for photo processing. They make them for business environments, gamers, and families. Moreover, Dell computers as well as several other name brands (Compaq, HP, and more) use many proprietary components, so you might be limited if you want to upgrade or replace a failed part.

I would recommend you decide what you want then either build it yourself (it's not terribly difficult) or find a friend or reputable shop to build it for you. Adobe.com even has recommendations.

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Dec 5, 2016 12:33:00   #
DWU2 Loc: Phoenix Arizona area
 
wapiti wrote:
I'm buying a new computer before Christmas. I've decided upon the make, model, etc, etc. Except for one thing. There are two versions of this computer. One has 24gb of ram and the other has 64. It costs $300 more to get the 64gb model. This computer will be used for image processing, web surfing, emails, and that's about it. No gaming. Do I need the extra ram and, more importantly, will it make a considerable difference in image processing? My cameras are Nikons D3, D800, and DF, if it matters.
I'm buying a new computer before Christmas. I've ... (show quote)


You can never be too rich, or too thin, or have too much RAM.

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Dec 5, 2016 12:38:19   #
markngolf Loc: Bridgewater, NJ
 
Sounds like a good idea. However, these are his uses:" This computer will be used for image processing, web surfing, emails, and that's about it. No gaming". Other than possibly LR and/or PS, his other loaded software will not be intensive or voluminous. Some of the prior, but I'm sure excellent suggestions, may be overkill. It might be enlightening to hear what his prior experience in post processing has been and what his future experience might be. Maybe all he needs is a Honda, that can be upgraded to a Mercedes, when the need arises.
Mark

Desert Gecko wrote:
This is the correct answer - you answered it yourself! Dell does not manufacture computers for photo processing. They make them for business environments, gamers, and families. Moreover, Dell computers as well as several other name brands (Compaq, HP, and more) use many proprietary components, so you might be limited if you want to upgrade or replace a failed part.

I would recommend you decide what you want then either build it yourself (it's not terribly difficult) or find a friend or reputable shop to build it for you. Adobe.com even has recommendations.
This is the correct answer - you answered it yours... (show quote)

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Dec 5, 2016 12:42:09   #
Jay Pat Loc: Round Rock, Texas, USA
 
I live in Round Rock.
If Wapiti gets all this stuff you all are mentioning, I will be able to tell when he fires up his computer.
My house lights will dim a little.........LOL!!!
Pat

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Dec 5, 2016 12:48:41   #
mvillasin
 
Whether or you actually need 64 GB depends on what you do, but you don't need to shell out an extra $300 for it (on top of the base 24GB) . Here's what I got (x2) from Amazon:

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01B4F3IJY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I got two of these for around $260 and it's in the color I want for my white build (white would have been ideal, but gray was cheaper). In general, I've found it cheaper buy basic from the manufacturer and go third party for upgrades. Of course sometimes this isn't an option, like when you have RAM or SSDs soldered in a laptop.

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Dec 5, 2016 12:54:11   #
mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey
 
Desert Gecko wrote:
This is the correct answer - you answered it yourself! Dell does not manufacture computers for photo processing. They make them for business environments, gamers, and families. Moreover, Dell computers as well as several other name brands (Compaq, HP, and more) use many proprietary components, so you might be limited if you want to upgrade or replace a failed part.

I would recommend you decide what you want then either build it yourself (it's not terribly difficult) or find a friend or reputable shop to build it for you. Adobe.com even has recommendations.
This is the correct answer - you answered it yours... (show quote)

I was in IT for 35 years and have built my own machines, but I must say that many off the shelf machines are perfectly capable of handling photo post processing with packages like Photoshop. If you are a hardcore gamer or doing 3D rendering, that's another story, Yes, the basic components in prebuilt machines from HP and Dell are not top of the line, but today, just about any machine with an i7 processor, 16-32 gigs of ram, a decent hard drive and a decent video card, is perfectly capable of meeting and exceeding the image editing requirements for the overwhelming majority of users. Further, suggesting that someone completely inexperienced with the process can somehow build their own machine, and that it's not terribly difficult, is very bad advice given the obvious lack of general computer knowledge I see posted here daily.

Paying some professional to build your machine is a viable approach but will likely cost more money for albeit a better spec'd machine than one off the shelf. But, depending on how and what you are using it for, a better spec'd machine could be overkill and may not meet the intended purpose any better than a stock machine. Building a cost effective custom machine implies you understand exactly what you need to meet and reasonably expand your requirements over the middle term, (there is no long term with any computer).

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Dec 5, 2016 12:55:38   #
markngolf Loc: Bridgewater, NJ
 
Jay Pat wrote:
I live in Round Rock.
If Wapiti gets all this stuff you all are mentioning, I will be able to tell when he fires up his computer.
My house lights will dim a little.........LOL!!!
Pat



In NJ too!!
Mark

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Dec 5, 2016 13:18:32   #
cambriaman Loc: Central CA Coast
 
I have 32Gb and have never felt the need for more. RAM of 64Gb implies an intent to process some mighty large image files. Lots of layers?

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Dec 5, 2016 15:21:05   #
Vince68 Loc: Wappingers Falls, NY
 
wapiti wrote:
I'm buying a new computer before Christmas. I've decided upon the make, model, etc, etc. Except for one thing. There are two versions of this computer. One has 24gb of ram and the other has 64. It costs $300 more to get the 64gb model. This computer will be used for image processing, web surfing, emails, and that's about it. No gaming. Do I need the extra ram and, more importantly, will it make a considerable difference in image processing? My cameras are Nikons D3, D800, and DF, if it matters.
I'm buying a new computer before Christmas. I've ... (show quote)


If you said it had 32GB RAM, I would say leave it at that, it would be more than enough RAM, although you can really never have too much RAM. 24GB sounds odd though, because RAM modules come in amounts like 4GB, 8GB, 16GB and have to be inserted in pairs into the motherboard. If your motherboard has 4 slots and you wanted to use 16GB RAM, you would have to insert either 4 sticks of 4GB or 2 sticks of 8GB to equal 16GB. Unless something has changed that I am unaware of, when inserting RAM you have to insert it in pairs and use either 2 slots or 4 slots depending on the board you have. You cannot put 3 sticks of 8GB RAM into 3 of the 4 slots, you have to insert the RAM in pairs. You definitely need more than 8GB of RAM though, because LR an PS are not going to be the only things using the RAM, other processes will be using RAM at the same time as they are. 32GB should be adequate for most users. Myself, I have 64GB installed in my latest build.

The other thing you want to make sure of is that you have a good video card as others have said. Get the most RAM on the video card that you can afford. Try to make sure it has DDR5 RAM which is basically DDR3 that has been optimized for graphical content. Also, the "memory speed" of the card will determine how fast the video card can access the data that is stored on the RAM. The faster the card can access the data, the less time it takes to process what you are doing, so faster memory speed is better. The other thing is the "Memory Bus Width". Fast memory is important, but the video card needs to be able to process the data from the memory quickly. The bus width is the amount of data the video card can access from the memory each clock cycle. So if you are doing something that uses a lot of video memory, you want to have a large bus width to efficiently transfer data to and from the video card's memory. Just like the size of the RAM, more is usually better.

Another thing to keep in mind is the type of connectors on the video card. Not sure if you are using the monitor you already have or buying a new one. Depending on the age of your monitor, make sure the connectors match the new video card.

You probably got a lot of tips on here. Good Luck.

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