Same sex marriage shoots.
Jun 28, 2015 15:46:51 #
canon Lee wrote:
Hi David. What do you think about photographers "mandated" to shoot all types of weddings? How does it stand with you to be mandated? What about the photographers "rights"?
If I don't wish to do something I can always find a reason. I have to wash my hair that day, my goldfish just died and I'm in mourning, sorry I'm out of state that weekend at my Inuit Aunt's funeral....
There are plenty of ways to decline an assignment. There are bound to be some excellent gay photographers in your neck of the woods, give them a referral....
Jun 28, 2015 15:55:04 #
Apaflo wrote:
It's the same "mandate" the corner grocery store operates under.
You seem to be trying very hard to sound like a real bigot, without saying that you are. What purpose is there in that?
You seem to be trying very hard to sound like a real bigot, without saying that you are. What purpose is there in that?
How did you arrive at calling me a "bigot"? I don't like a law that mandates me to do anything, whether I want to do it or not. Am I a bigot because I detest "Affordable Heath Care" because it "mandates" everyone to comply. How far does a mandate go? Will you, in time, be mandated to photograph a wedding between siblings? Would you be called a "bigot" when you refuse?
Perhaps the issue is not bigotry, but being mandated to do something. Big government seems to think they can force you to do what they deem good for everyone. Remember, my topic was an interest in what other photographers opinions were. Unfortunately it seems like this topic has been degraded into "bigotry"!
I have no hidden motives for my topic, but how it affects our industry.
It is not what we photograph but how well we do it!
Jun 28, 2015 16:01:22 #
canon Lee wrote:
"), I do hope the "you" is just general and not directed at anyone here. I have not given my opinion but simply asked what other's might be. So I exclude my self from your use of "YOU" Your opinion would be of benefit to others if you commented with I, me, my...... The question is about YOUR opinions, not others!
You is quite general in fact it can include I , i was trying so hard to be gender neutral too :)
My basic thinking is if you/he/she/we/they/I have little or no empathy to the couple then you/he/she/we/they/I are not going to perform adequately and so should give it a pass.
Surely people skills are an essential part of wedding photography, I question those people skills when using prejudiced eyes.
It is also up to the couple to find a photographer they are happy with, although that can be tricky. You/he/she/we/they/I are never the only game in town.
Jun 28, 2015 16:05:33 #
Not everyone HAS to have an opinion on every controversial ruling. Therefore, trying to get a consensus of opinion is merely a media/Political fantasy designed to increase sales/votes. If you need an opinion, make one of your own for yourself, but it can never really be justified nor is always even useful. On the whole most of us don't care about things that don't impinge on our 'life'. That which does makes your opinion biased in any case.
Jun 28, 2015 16:06:09 #
Peterff wrote:
If I don't wish to do something I can always find a reason. I have to wash my hair that day, my goldfish just died and I'm in mourning, sorry I'm out of state that weekend at my Inuit Aunt's funeral....
There are plenty of ways to decline an assignment. There are bound to be some excellent gay photographers in your neck of the woods, give them a referral....
There are plenty of ways to decline an assignment. There are bound to be some excellent gay photographers in your neck of the woods, give them a referral....
My point exactly, but the bakery that refused to make a wedding cake for a gay couple, didn't get away with it and wound up in court and loosing! How do you deal with a $75,000 judgement? You think the bakery should have just baked the cake or should they have stood their ground. What excuse would you conjure up to get out of baking the cake? Our big government at work again!
Jun 28, 2015 16:06:13 #
blackest wrote:
You is quite general in fact it can include I , i ... (show quote)
One is sometimes challenged to express one's own opinions without implying some kind of unintended attribution to others....
Jun 28, 2015 16:10:58 #
canon Lee wrote:
Thank you for your thoughts, but who are you addre... (show quote)
You ask a question that raises ethical and belief issues. Your answer here shows that either you are trolling for a fight or you wish to confirm and opinion you already have and refuse to really say.
My question to you, a direct one:
Will it bother you to shoot a gay/lesbian/transgender?
Yes or no?
One answer: "Money is all that counts" Shows a mercenary spirit that truly reflects a professional photographer. We are there to report an event and get pay for it; no if, no or, no but.
Jun 28, 2015 16:15:57 #
Well said, Canon Lee.
The left in the US seems to defend their opponents' right to free speech by name calling, shouting down, and suing them. So far.
The left in the US seems to defend their opponents' right to free speech by name calling, shouting down, and suing them. So far.
Jun 28, 2015 16:17:10 #
G Brown wrote:
Not everyone HAS to have an opinion on every controversial ruling. Therefore, trying to get a consensus of opinion is merely a media/Political fantasy designed to increase sales/votes. If you need an opinion, make one of your own for yourself, but it can never really be justified nor is always even useful. On the whole most of us don't care about things that don't impinge on our 'life'. That which does makes your opinion biased in any case.
my opinion, is; I will photograph anything legal that I want to. I have in the decade of shooting weddings never turned down a wedding. My opinion; is it is my business and that I need to provide to my clients the best I can do. No matter who the clients are. It is my business. BUT don't tell me what I can shoot! I was interested in my fellow photographers opinions. How simple was that? Thank you for your opinion.
Jun 28, 2015 16:20:00 #
Peterff wrote:
I would be concerned about a photographer taking a... (show quote)
Are you suggesting it's hypocritical to see things differently than you do?
As far as "gay marriage" goes, people can do what they want. That's because God gave us free will, and I won't stand in the way of that. But the entire proposition is oxymoronic. There is simply no such thing. What two people choose to do is their own business, but if they choose to call a cow a horse--well, that's just nonsense.
Personally, I go to great lengths to keep anything remotely human out of my images--but that's just me...
Jun 28, 2015 16:21:51 #
Jun 28, 2015 16:22:09 #
canon Lee wrote:
My point exactly, but the bakery that refused to make a wedding cake for a gay couple, didn't get away with it and wound up in court and loosing! How do you deal with a $75,000 judgement? You think the bakery should have just baked the cake or should they have stood their ground. What excuse would you conjure up to get out of baking the cake? Our big government at work again!
Me, I would have happily taken the engagement.
However, it is not hard to find a defensible excuse if such a thing is desired. These people apparently tried to push the issue from a rights perspective and lost. They had the choice to discretely walk away and it appears that they chose not to do that.
This isn't so much big Government as big Hypocrisy, or big Religion, or big Prejudice. Most of all it is about people wishing to impose their belief system upon others.
The hypocrites frequently fall back on the "Freedom of Religion" defense, but that is also quite frequently expressed better by a similar phrase that I heard many years ago in a certain part of the USA:
"Here we believe in freedom of religion, but not freedom from religion!"
I have seldom heard such a well expressed hypocritical double standard where the person saying it had zero comprehension of how unconscionable a statement that was from a moral or ethical perspective.
Jun 28, 2015 16:27:51 #
Peterff wrote:
Something about: "And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?" King James Bible, Matthew 7:4 ( I think)
Something about: "And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?" King James Bible, Matthew 7:4 ( I think)
Why in the world would you quote a document when you have no idea what it says?
This same document has strong words about homosexuality and the definition of marriage...neither of which you'd agree with.
Quoting it to make your point would seem insincere at best.
Jun 28, 2015 16:28:08 #
moonhawk wrote:
Are you suggesting it's hypocritical to see things differently than you do?
No, not at all. I respect people's right to differ.
What I am saying is that there are many people who try to impose a standard upon others that they do not adhere to themselves. That is what I see as hypocrisy, and it can come from any side of this debate.
One needs to keep integrity to one's own beliefs, and if one wishes to impose standards upon others then one should adhere to the equivalent restrictions oneself.
Jun 28, 2015 16:33:08 #
canon Lee wrote:
my opinion, is; I will photograph anything legal that I want to. I have in the decade of shooting weddings never turned down a wedding. My opinion; is it is my business and that I need to provide to my clients the best I can do. No matter who the clients are. It is my business. BUT don't tell me what I can shoot! I was interested in my fellow photographers opinions. How simple was that? Thank you for your opinion.
Well said, Sir. There are situations where I would not be comfortable delivering on the assignment as requested.
I feel that I could turn that down on the basis that I did not have the skills to do an adequate job, but not based upon a moral judgment of the situation.
I believe a photographer needs to be able to be impartial. Freedom to decline is not the same as freedom to refuse or to deprive.
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