Nagging Question re: RAW files: When I first started taking pictures with my 7D, my RAW files were dull and uninspiring. Then I found out that RAW files are by nature dull and...

JayB Loc: Northeast US

When I first started taking pictures with my 7D, my RAW files were dull and uninspiring. Then I found out that RAW files are by nature dull and uninspiring. At some point, I switched my camera setting to Landscape. My RAW files improved so that I can't really tell them color wise, from my JPEGs. I also read that RAW files are not supposed register camera settings re: color balance. Not complaining, just confused.

Acountry330 Loc: Dothan,Ala USA

My understanding is that what you see on the view screen is a jpeg not raw picture. You do not see a raw file until you download it from the camera. I also understand the landscape mode increases the vibrancy in the colors.

CurreyPhoto Loc: Reddick, Florida

aerides wrote:

When I first started taking pictures with my 7D, my RAW files were dull and uninspiring. Then I found out that RAW files are by nature dull and uninspiring. At some point, I switched my camera setting to Landscape. My RAW files improved so that I can't really tell them color wise, from my JPEGs. I also read that RAW files are not supposed register camera settings re: color balance. Not complaining, just confused.

Both Canon and Nikon are shipped with software that will process RAW files from their respective cameras that do register the camera settings at the time of the shot. ACR does not register camera settings. It applies its own presets to the RAW file. I don't know of any of the third party RAW converters that apply camera settings to the RAW file, but I'm sure that if I am wrong (It happened once in '52) someone will let us both know.

Izza1967 Loc: Bristol, England

I also own a 7d and believed that the Raw files were unaffected by any of the presets like landscape, neutral etc so I took a couple of shots and was surprised to see the raw files looking different, the landscape one was much more vivid. I re checked my camera and found it had moved to P mode. I tried again on a AV mode and the raw files were not affected by the presets at all.

Conclusion - Presets only affect the raw image when using P, CA or Auto mode

lighthouse Loc: No Fixed Abode

Just as a note of interest.
You can actually watch Bridge/ACR strip out the presets as your files load.
Take a heap of shots with presets.
Load into computer.
Now open up the folder in Bridge or mini Bridge.
As you watch the files load in your "filmstrip" you will see them load with the presets (brighter, vibrant).
After a few seconds the shots in the filmstrip will visibly change to a duller thumbnail.
I assume this is because the Adobe converter is stripping out the presets.
But I have no idea why it intially loads with the presets.
Doesn't really make sense to me.

KennyMac Loc: Lynchburg, VA

Select RAW + jpeg on your camera. The camera does significant post processing and compression on jpeg file. This is fine unless you had a pix that you think need more PP. You can't take back the PP done in the camera. There are many situations that you may shoot jpegs instead of RAW (snapshots, street shooting, etc. There are also situations that would benefit shooting RAW with much more flexibility. Eventually you would probably convert to jpeg to sent to a lab. When you convert in your software, it doesn't change the RAW, just compresses the data. Also you should NEVER RE-SAVE a jpeg under the same name, this creates unwanted artifacts visible in pix. Try re-saving a jpeg, and watch how crappy it gets !

CaptainC Loc: Colorado, south of Denver

aerides wrote:

When I first started taking pictures with my 7D, my RAW files were dull and uninspiring. Then I found out that RAW files are by nature dull and uninspiring. At some point, I switched my camera setting to Landscape. My RAW files improved so that I can't really tell them color wise, from my JPEGs. I also read that RAW files are not supposed register camera settings re: color balance. Not complaining, just confused.

The raw file DOES display the as-shot white balance. It is all those other presets that it discards. The raw file also disregards your camera setting for sRGB or AdobeRGB1998. That is applied at the raw converter as you have it set. Just FYI - you can get gorgeous images if you convert your raw files to sRGB immediately. The wider AdobeRGB 1998 is of no value for many types of images - landscapes and flowers a possible exception. For people images, there is virtually no advantage to Adobe RGB. I keep reading all this stuff about how one has to shoot in Adobe RGB or loose color - you are somehow less of a photographer if you shoot in sRGB. At a meeting last night several of my professional friends all agreed we work entirely in sRGB and get killer color.

KennyMac Loc: Lynchburg, VA

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

mikemilton

aerides wrote:

When I first started taking pictures with my 7D, my RAW files were dull and uninspiring. Then I found out that RAW files are by nature dull and uninspiring. At some point, I switched my camera setting to Landscape. My RAW files improved so that I can't really tell them color wise, from my JPEGs. I also read that RAW files are not supposed register camera settings re: color balance. Not complaining, just confused.

You are confusing two things. The raw file is, in fact, not different but the preview in them (which is a jpg) is and some post processing software (typically the vendor's SW) recognize and apply the various settings.

So, you can choose to change them back to dull or to process tham any other way you like because you have not lost anything. This is actually the point. If you had shot only jpg, then the settings *would* be 'burned' into the jpg and not be something you can recover from.

JayB Loc: Northeast US

CaptainC wrote:

The raw file DOES display the as-shot white balanc... (show quote)

Yes. This is the answer to my question. I have sRGB set and I didn't realize that Lightroom or whatever RAW converter applies that setting. Another piece of the puzzle sorted. Thank you!

Dlevon Loc: New Jersey

CaptainC wrote:

The raw file DOES display the as-shot white balanc... (show quote)

Completely agree with you. That's the way to go. I convert raw right away And that's my keeper.

jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ

aerides wrote:

When I first started taking pictures with my 7D, my RAW files were dull and uninspiring. Then I found out that RAW files are by nature dull and uninspiring. At some point, I switched my camera setting to Landscape. My RAW files improved so that I can't really tell them color wise, from my JPEGs. I also read that RAW files are not supposed register camera settings re: color balance. Not complaining, just confused.

First of all, which software are you using to view the images? If you are using the software that came with your 7D (DPP) then you will see the effects of the "Picutre Style" "Landscape". If you use a 3rd party software, you should see no difference unless you are viewing jpg image files.

JayB Loc: Northeast US

jeep_daddy wrote:

First of all, which software are you using to view the images? If you are using the software that came with your 7D (DPP) then you will see the effects of the "Picutre Style" "Landscape". If you use a 3rd party software, you should see no difference unless you are viewing jpg image files.

I'm using Lightroom, and DPP to compare RAW files images - one presumably including the picture style and one not. (The LR file is still CR2 format). They are identical to my eye. I think I understood CaptainC to say that you can set your RAW converter (in my case, LightRoom) to apply sRBG, but I haven't made any special settings or run any further instruction to apply sRBG. Just imported directly from the card.

JayB Loc: Northeast US

How about this explanation? I shoot RAW+JPG. I was looking at a CR2's file's metadata in Lightroom and it lists the JPG (which is not actually displayed in LR) as a Sidecar file. My understanding is that Sidecar files, per se, in LR are specifically sources of formatting for the RAW file display. Is that what's happening? LR is assuming that I want my RAW file to display with the additional formatting contained in my JPG file and has attached it to the RAW file as "Sidecar." And so (logically) if I deleted the JPG, or disconnected it in some other way from the associated CR2, my CR2 file display would go back to the standard RAW file display.

Searcher Loc: Kent, England

aerides wrote:

How about this explanation? I shoot RAW+JPG. I w... (show quote)

The xmp (sidecar file) generated by Lightroom for raw files contains Exif data, develop & pp information and location pointers to the preview file, pointers to the xhtml web address, "open with" data and things like image size and camera information.

If you locate any xmp file in Explorer, right click and select "open with", then select WordPad, you can see all the information. Jpg's are not stored in a xml sidecar file.

If you wish to view, outside of LR, the preview image, go to the catalogue folder, select the preview folder, open one of the folders contained therein, and see the previews. There is no suffix to say if they are jpgs, tiffs or something else, but I suspect they are jpgs. These images are small and generated by Lightroom - not by the camera.