Timmers wrote:
Interesting question and I have an answer but as always there will be many who will grind on about Timmers and his stories.
I left the employ of the University of Texas at San Antonio and took the position of chairman of the Photography Department at the Southwest Craft Center.
The short answer is simply that the Southwest Craft Center was one of the sacred cows of San Antonio Texas. If you were part of it you would NEVER ever do anything that was not perfectly legit nor inappropriate. Simple as that.
I needed models for the newly emerging studio classes for the photography department. So I went to the local junior collage downtown, it is still there going strong called SAC (San Antonio Collage) and spoke to the head of the student office that found employment for students. Nicely dressed and with my Business Card for Southwest Craft Center it took but a few minutes and the figure modeling position was opened as a listing.
Essentially it was $15 an hour pay and classes were three hours so a model would make $45 for a modeling session. Really great money for a student part time job, or any job in the city. Locally, universities including the University of Texas paid $6 to $7 an hour and we had free parking and no hassles.
But, then as I got to know the women, the regulars would stop by and ask for a payday before they had modeled. This was happening a lot but students were a cert type back then, not like now. They were just ditsy and needed to get a quick fix of cash for groceries and rent, gas and going with boyfriends and other girls out of town, quick cash. Tim was 'mister money bags.
You perhaps think, where did all this cash come from? The bookkeeper at Southwest Craft Center. She decided to check up on things and she brought it up with the director's office. He was an artist and knew some creative events were occurring. Like when we had adjuncts from UTSA teaching two drawing and painting classes and need models for their classes at Southwest Craft Center. The 'lab' fee was absurdly low and could not possibly cover the cost but then the director talked to me and I of course said sure and sent figure models to do drawing and painting classes. Of course they did not like doing these classes because it was not easy like the photography classes, but then these were the best of the best and I would toss in an extra payment above the regular $45 and then they could not get enough classes. And the director knew exactly what was going on, not our bookkeeper.
With all of this, the director knew exactly what was going on. You see he was running an entire art school. Here is the God up truth. ONLY photography made money out of the entire school. It was how it had to be, it is not cheap to run an art school, but photography could and did run in the black, he and I knew this reality. Photography thus covered the cost of much of the schools expense. The board of Directors were fully aware of this and knew that photography could and did provide funding for the rest of the school.
Photography Studio Fees were the highest in the school. Reality check, and this goes to your question, we charged more for a lab fee for figure photography than the basic cost of the class (class fee and studio fees were listed separately in our brochure). Class rosters were a joke, I always had at least two or three 'participants' who were not on the class rosters. These were people who were gifted but without funds to attend, so they just showed up and that was that. The director was always aware of this.
So how could we get away with charging such a high class fee and Studio fee is always the question. Because, one, we were that sacred cow (Southwest Craft Center), two, where are you going to get to photograph the female nude for $225, for 15 weeks, with al least 10 contact sessions (that is a payment of $22.50 each session lasting a bit over two hours). At one point I had 16 to 18 participants (we did not use the term 'student'), so I would have three to five models working that evening. It all worked out and we always closed that semester with a surplus of $ for the school.
Interesting question and I have an answer but as a... (
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But that above is all true, But it does not answer the question, "How do you get women to model nude with/for you?
The simple answer is that I have a great reputation as a human being. This is half the secret to this question. Get it straight, it is never going to be easy to gain the trust of any women, men have a mostly suspect reputation, even basically bad ones among women. Plain and simple.
So women don't trust men, but they do trust other women. If among a group of women the conversation turns to being naughty or the desire for photographs to be made and they speak with another woman who knows me, well case closed, that women will contact me. It really is your reputation that opens the door.
Once you make contact, you must be in a certain state. This goes past reputation. What I do on here is exactly what I do with women. First I treat them to the great truths, but in women's terms. This is mostly impossible for men to understand, but women get it immediately. Facts, like the fact that all mothers train their children (all of them, boys and girls alike) to believe that they are dressed if they have their shoes on. Its a proven fact, it is psychology and most people 'know' this intuitively, but they never real get around to using it to their advantage with other people.
So our woman is there with clothes on. I get their shoes size (I've gotten vary good at knowing a woman's shoe size) and then knowing how women's shoes work. ALL American women dig shoes/boots. Watch them light up when a stand ten feet tall is in front of them with all manner of shoes/boots. Open toed, you can fudge on a half even a full size 'too small' depending on the elevation of the heel. Stripper shoes, platforms, in other words Bad Girl shoes, oh they all want to try them on and imagine being slutty. And then I tell them how to walk in them. I'm the girl friend that they always wanted.
This goes to one of the great secrets about all women, it is called by women "Pretty, pretty princess". Most any intelligent woman has gone through this rite of passage as a young girl. They all do it. Some call it dress up. Putting on too much make up and some rather risky outfits. Bettie Page dressed up in night and day wear but not much more than stockings and gloves. In my studio there are all of the outrageous items. Loads of stockings to go with the shoes/boots. Even semi transparent dresses. I'm well known to remove the lining from a dress to make it naughty. Now a days, collars and wrist and ankle gear for bondage. Harnesses. Kool items like Velcro One and steel shiny rings and double ended clips to attach with.
I know, you think I'm off on some fantasy world, I'm not, few women will read this (if they do they are nodding their heads say, "YES!"). No, I'm writing this to an audience of mostly men. This is the basic stuff of working with women do naughty/nude images. I use to 'teach' this to participants, mostly it went no where, but a few actual got it. So most of the 'doing' nude photography has to do with psychology. There are no short cuts or ways around the reality of your subject. You must learn to understand what makes them tick. Funny thing is this is the root of most problems between men and women. I just began talking and listing to what they tell you. And brother, they are quite subtle about it. They are just not men, they rarely actual come out and say things, they speak softly and they often speak through gestures.
Last part is the tricky one. The male gaze. This part is difficult because you think you 'know' but again, until you get how the feminine mind works you will never pull it together. Take the BIG page from the female book, it is about delay, you know, what people call foreplay. Never state the obvious, always follow her lead until she gives you the go ahead to lead, and then take the position of complete indifference. Women are all about delay. But at some magic point you need to take the single to take control. This has nothing to do with "Being Professional" Honestly I'm never sure what that is exactly.
Never be quiet and never get caught up in guy things. It is psychology, it is about a collaboration, so collaborate, but collaborate as a girl does. As a woman removes clothing I put new articles of clothing on her. But as I do I steer the clothing a certain direction. The whole time I am engaging her in a running dialogue. An example would be to do some Bettie Page style images. Pull out some medium fishnet stockings BUT, first explain that fishnets for some reason never work in photographs, so WE have stockings, medium to light toned stockings because the light contours the leg and defines the shape of the muscles by showing how the leg appears with healthy form (it actually does in fact and with shoes and higher heals even when not standing with weight on the muscles the legs look longer and more trim! Do some images of her putting on stockings and the shoes (you got her OUT of her shoes, psychology here, she is off her protected game by 30 to 40%, psychology, but she now gains back a sense of control, she is dressed, She is no longer nude, she is fully clothed, she no longer nude.
But now she has to remove her shoes and put on the fishnets, nude again, vulnerable, give her more personal space and let her ask for you to come help to see if this looks correct, psychology again. Change the shoes to some platforms, much more sexy looking, sort of bag girl looking. Again and again psychology. Put on more clothes, some opera length gloves, maybe lace ones from Halloween (I'm always looking for items as props, spices up the session), doesn't have to work, we are in the digital age, shoot some frames, use the card. NEVER EVER say lets not do this isn't working, shut the hell up, take the image, after all, this is Pretty, Pretty Princess time!
Focus on her facial expressions, surprise, scolding, "Your not Worth!", You caught me! You caught me and I'm being naughty! And I like it! Then add gestures. Turn her back on you, now cover your ass, give her a big fan, now a small fan, looking over her shoulder being coy, now disapproving, then light hearted.
Last, never get into the three subjects, her nose, her ass and her boobs. These are things to avoid unless you are ready to really go all in, and then you may not be able to recover the situation.