tjim Loc: Far Northern California

Well, I do believe the Holy Spirit is not just of God but as and, mysteriously. is God. I guess we are apart there.
Yes the Holy Spirit is a hot button for sure for many generations because it's just so hard for humans to wrap their understanding around Spirit. In my reading of the Bible, though, the Holy spirit or Holy Ghost appears at least 14 or 15 times in the NT and if just Spirit is added it's more than that.
I do admire your defense of Jesus as the Son of God, especially in the middle east among Muslims. That would seem to have taken courage just to debate Jesus among them. I am with you on only God knows our hearts. Only He knows the depth of our faith, our pains, our blessings, experiences, thoughts, smiles, tears (and frustration with not getting the photo shot the way it should have been;)
Only God can work in the depths of our spirits to make them live again.

But my belief is it is the Holy Spirit that is the miracle worker inside me, not just a messenger but a healer, comforter and defender. My belief is that the only way God can truly be with me in my present state is by a God Spirit.

I sure do appreciate your thoughtfulness (even though you do have a bit of a kick to it). Sorry about the pain you have had to bear.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

I am not. Sure it was hard but everything in my life, good AND bad, made me who I am. I have no regret.

I can say that 'god did it' because he had the power to prevent it, to not let it happen, yet he did. This is not an accusation.

After the worst was over he gave his word that I would be whole and better. Well, I am whole. Better? Depends on who you ask. Ask me? I am.

The only time(s) I am not better is my own doing. When I doubt. This is a struggle we all have. After all who can believe in what some call "fairies' tales" without physical proof? The trouble is that I have physical proofs* yet at times you doubt your own experience. It is just too much.

This is why I have a beef with god. I call him the 'jester in the sky'. His answer to a single prayer - that was more a angry challenge than anything else, I have to admit - was... well like turning on a fire-hose onto someone asking for a glass of water. The trouble is... I was really asking for the fire-hose without knowing it. I was going to need it later on, for multiple reasons. That 'jerk*' just did not tell me that!!!

Everyone has a different relationship with god. There is no 'standard' unless you start limiting god - then you get into serious trouble.

As to being 'courageous'... There is no courage involved. There was no threat at all, just open conversation with all parties leaving with, hopefully, a different appreciation of the other.

-----
* Yes, multiple experiences
** Do not take this as an insult. Take it as 'your are a real jerk, you know that?' when addressing a friend.

tjim Loc: Far Northern California

Adam hid from God, Jacob wrestled with God, Moses wrestled with God, Isaiah hid from God, Solomon, David, Jeremiah, and the list goes on and on even with Jesus crying to God on the cross "My God, my God why have you forsaken me?". God is limited all the way through the Bible by his followers. Wow, what about Job and Jonah? Man, I struggle(d) with Him lot's of times. When I was a hospital chaplain I had a patient who had a heart attack and died in the arms of his daughter when they were dancing at her 17th birthday party. God and I went around that night for sure. Our first child died as an infant...God and I went around then. I'm am more concerned about Christians who do not struggle than those who do.

I read about a new preacher who just graduated seminary and interned in a small country church. When checked in with his mentor he was asked "Well how is everything going?" "Oh, it's going great", he said. "And everyone there really loves me. Looks like I'm doing everything right!" The mentor chimed in "Sorry to hear that!". The new preacher was aghast and asked why. "Well", said the mentor "it doesn't look like you pose enough threat to the Enemy for him to throw in some roadblocks."

God has very thick skin and is immensely patient but can be angered. Only you know your feeling toward God. None of us can judge that, though I'm sure some have tried. Anger seldom seems to hurt God as much as it hurts the believer.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

Merry christmas indeed... Why do US gun sales spike at Christmas?



Joy to the world!!!!

Now tell me it is a time to be happy, merry and all this crap.

Yankeepapa6 Loc: New York City

Adam hid from God because he knew he was naked. He knew he was naked because the women he was with could not listen to ONE thing. LEAVE the tree alone. Everything else before you is yours. except for that tree. Could she listen to one thing just one ...NO. Then she tricked poor ole Adam to eat of the fruit. After that, it was over.

d3200prime

People, wake up, this guy has you chasing your tails. He if full of psychobabble. Hopefully Admin will move this to the attic where it belongs.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

And another one who tries to discourage other, not because my faith is wrong but because I try to show that using the bible as an argument is wrong.

The bible is a a living book and a book to live by.

The bible is a 'working document. One that has been translate many times and because oif that has evolved over time. Not only that but many of the books were written long after the facts. That in itself is known by folks you argue with. Trying to use the bible as the massive argument is trying to use a nuclear bomb on a small Brazilian tribe. They cannot comprehend what happened to them for good reasons.

The bible should not be studied word for word for word. Same as a modern translations from one language to another should not be trusted. Too many things are left out or copied incorrectly. So, is the bible lying because of that? Yes, if you use the literal translation. No, if you use the bible as a living book.

The bible holds the truth and many treasures to be discovered not by reading it and agreeing with some scholar 'interpretation' but by letting the spirit of god inspires you when you read it. That is why I always encourage folks to pray before reading. This is especially true if you want an answer toward something specific. The answer is there. Let god show it to you.

My statement are a sharp departure from 'learn the bible from beginning to end and you will be a good christian'. I say, read it. Do not learn it. Do not listen to other's interpretation, preacher or otherwise. Let god speak to you THROUGH the bible. Trust god to use the bible to show you what you need, not some guy who has really no business telling what to do.

Take the simple fifth commandment: You shall not kill. Simple. Yet jesus forgave a killer. There is a sharp contradiction there, either it is a sin or it is not. In reality what is 'kill' is it about the body or the spirit? What is more important, stay alive but godless because an event like flinging the bible in someone's face kills the desire to learn more or someone killing a person, terminating his earthy life? What did the more damage? The murderer or the bible guy?

Question like this are hard to answer. Only the bible can offer you the solution. Consider that the person killed is not a christian, does it mean the murderer is doubly guilty in the eyes of god? If you think so, you and I believe that everything is written is not death and the time of death not avoidable? (prepare yourself) Is the killer doing just what he was supposed to do?

This becomes even harder to comprehend. Once again, only the bible can answer that, if you let it.

The first instinct is to condemn the murderer yet jesus forgave one. This murderer confessed his faith in jesus in the last moments of his life. He had no leisure time to show how much a believer he was to the world but jesus knew. Everyone wanted the guy dead and he was. Earthly justice was 'served', so was god's judgement that went against the grain of everyone present.

The only trouble comes from folks who read the bible to give you their interpretation, not what god tries to tell you, if you listen. Note that god can also tries to speak through these folks but at another level.

Do I have the answer to this killer question?

Sort off, I have my answer. My first wife was killed by a recidivist drunk driver, a killer on wheels. I had to come to terms with that. I knew who my wife was. I knew she longed to be with christ. For a long time I was angry then I realized she was where she wanted to be. My anger went away. How did this happen? The bible told me. This is my life, my experience on no way will you have the same experience or stuggle. By the way, my anger went away but did I forgive the killer? Of that, I am not sure at all. Only god knows what to do, I do not. I honestly do not want to know, which shows some degree of resentment.

So, call me all you want, call what I type 'psychobabble' and wish this to go the attic too. It does not change what is being said.

Lemmings following lemmings works only for lemmings. Each christian is different, each needs to make personal choices. Each needs guidance through the bible.

Bible knowledge should never be used to gauge the 'faith' of anyone. Until recently the large majority did not know how to read yet they were christians.

The bible should never be used to assassinate those who do not believe or make genuine christian doubt themselves because they do not 'know' the bible.

124 *Laughter*
457 *Laughter*

Is for folks in a bar, 'initiates'.

Beercat Loc: Central Coast of California

Won't respond to troll man but to this observation I will ...

Ask yourself, what was the bigger sin, and yes I realize sin is sin but ask yourself, what was the bigger sin? Satan deceived Eve into thinking God had kept the truth from them and they were missing out on being just like God. Adam however does not take responsibility for his action but blames not only Eve but God himself, "The man said, “The woman you put here with me".

Think about that ... ;)

d3200prime

Silence...........................maddening isn't it psycho babbler.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

Nope. It just shows your attitude as a so-called christian.

Keep exposing yourself, you give a service to anyone who may have agreed with you before.

d3200prime

Silence...........................maddening isn't it psycho babbler.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

Your stupidity knows no bond. Enjoy it, after all it is the 'merry christmas' season.

Christian section for some, indeed.

d3200prime

Silence...........................maddening isn't it psycho babbler.

Rongnongno Loc: FL

Really?

Think about what you are doing.

You set a typical example of what a 'christian' is like on line.

Once again, no wonder there is a push back.

d3200prime

Silence...........................maddening isn't it psycho babbler.