steve_stoneblossom Loc: Rhode Island, USA

As an event florist, I see 2 to 3 weddings every weekend for 7-8 months out of the year. Our clients are usually mid to high end; consequently, most of the photographers we work with are very professional and very, very good. Some random thoughts regarding some of the previous comments..

- Don't judge a book by its cover. Yes, it's nice when your photographer gets dressed up, but a nice suit does not make for nice photos. Many of them are working a very long day (or days). I don't want them looking like slobs, but I don't blame them for dressing comfortably. Some of the very best photographers I've worked with wear jeans and a nice dress shirt or blouse or comfortable dress. Some in 'dressy' T-shirts. Unless they're going to be in photos, it's irrelevant.

- There is no excuse for not properly vetting them. All of them showcase their work online. Meet them and ask for more samples of their work. Ask for client references. Ask for vendor references. We vendors all know who is good and who is great, or- more importantly- whose style matches whose. See whose work you like, meet with them, and unless you're socks are knocked off, meet with others, and decide who best matches your style.

- Be clear with your expectations. Never assume. Some do traditional weddings, some do photojournalism style, some like quirky and stylish. Again, meet and discuss.

- While price is not necessarily indicative of quality, there is a reason good wedding photographers are expensive. IT IS NOT AN EASY JOB. I learned the hard way, as a second shooter once and solo once. Never again. It takes a special blend of photography skills, people skills, and intuition. Usually, you get what you pay for. Want great photos? Hire great photographers.

- Photographers are not always at the bottom of the vendor list (okay, strike up the violins). Often it's the florist. Some times it's the caterer, or the venue. Or a DJ instead of a band. People have different priorities. Some don't care much about flowers and are happy with snapshots, while others want lavish displays that will be featured in wedding magazines. So long as all parties are clear with each other, no one should be disappointed.

Copyrat

I had been to a wedding in August.
There were three photographers exposing their tattooed muscles.
No lighting.
It seems the couple paid around 5 grant.
I was not impressed with the poorly lit pictures.
It seems the couple may get 60 prints.
Yet to see the prints.

Big name, lots of money and poor workmanship.

Dbl00buk Loc: Orlando

Why copycat, didn't you know?....you get what you pay for (gag). I know of other "pro wedding photogs" who charged a fortune for shots that guests did better with a cell phone.

jouster Loc: Witlesss Protection Program

When my niece was married recently I saw the "Professional photographer" shooting only one shot of poses that I thought most important. I told my brother and he went to the photographer and INSISTED that many more be taken. It sounds as if this guy who called himself a photographer is typical of many these days.

I did Wedding photography for about ten years (in the seventies and eighties) and I took it seriously. I was always aware of how important an event this was for those involved and I always worried about doing everything well.

Wedding photograph was so stressful for me that I gave it up after about ten years. Nowadays I'd sooner shoot myself (with a .38) than shoot a wedding.

Collie lover Loc: St. Louis, MO

When I got married in 1962, we couldn't afford a professional photographer. My brother-in-law took them. They were nice photos, although some of them were a little dark because his flash died. Rather have those than nothing at all.

Dalek Loc: Detroit, Miami, Goffstown

I shot one wedding as a friend of the family and as an assistant to the hired photographer. As luck would have it the Pros camera died half way through the event and he left for his office to get another body. I stayed and shot the cake, the dancing, the drinking, more dancing, and the garter toss then he arrived. He finished the remainder of the evening. I went home and printed 300 5X7s and sent them to my friend and his wife. They loved the shots I took. Several weeks later the Pros cd showed up. Cannot tell you much more but I will not shoot another wedding, too much work before, during, and after.

Dun1 Loc: Atlanta, GA

One thing I attribute to some of the camera slough is Phone cameras. So many are so content on taking photos and being the first to upload them to some social media outlet, no consideration is given to quality. People have lost sight of what decent images look like. Back in the day there was no way a person would attempt to board an airplane dressed the way some do now, it was coat and tie and the ladies were dressed in nice dresses. Many of the airline would not permit employees to board a flight if they were not dressed in business attire. Fast forward to present, a suit no tie is appropriate in some businesses. I think that you can tell the end result in most cases by the way photographers dress especially for a wedding shoot.
You just have to step back take a deep breath and try to find previous wedding shoots taken by the photographer to see what their past work produced.
The idea is the couple being photographed was probably one of the most important life events that would take place, the rule GIGO (Garbage In = Garbage Out) applies

Rongnongno Loc: FL

What century are you living in or do you see as the 'good old times?'

The legend at the time was 'coffee, tea or me'...

No one prevents you to put on your Sunday clothes when you fly. Personally I like to be comfortable when I travel.

Formality has its place, just not all over. 'Pros' in photography have to respect the event and their clients as well as provide a service. That is it.

In this case...
- respect of the event... None
- respect of the client... None
- provide a service... As long has I have not seen images, I reserve my judgement but I have serious doubts.

This is not a rant about the 'good old days' but a negative observation of the 'Pros'. Camera get smaller while being more performing? I have no problem with that. I have a problem with folks who become an instant photographer because they have a DSRL and have no clue as to what to expect.

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Something I did not mention and I should have. There was a nearly invisible videographer. This guy was set up correctly not far from the altar, hidden from view and at the right place to capture the event. He was also dressed correctly, clean appearance. In contrast with the two bozos...

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You get what you pay for.... This is mostly correct but I have seen nickel and dime photographers produce better 'reports' than expensive pros. Also, since I do not know how much my niece and her husband paid I do not think you do either so this is beside the point and a non-debate I will not enter.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

It's me again- just checkin' in with y'all!

More stories about bad wedding photographers are flowing in. It saddens me to read all of this, but let's face it folks, many of theses “photographers” whose less than competent actions are described in this thread are NOT really professionals. If your definition of “a professional” is simply a person who charges for his or her services or “gets paid, some of y'all are missing the boat and are operating with a serious misconception. In my book, a true professional, in any field or job, really and actually knows what they are doing, does extremely well at it and comes back with an outstanding job. Put yourselves in the customers place- when you hire a professional to do any job or preform any kind of expert service, do you not expect a proper job and complete satisfaction in return for you investment- your hard earned money?

This thing about proper dress at a wedding, dressing properly is part of the job! Smart photographers like to keep a low profile at wedding ceremonies and celebrations. Of course, they can't be invisible but if they blend in with the bridal party and the guests they will be less distracting and and call less attention to themselves. That results in getting better shots, better access in houses of worship and gaining acceptance and cooperation from the other professionals and officials at the event. Besides, its just good manners and shows respect for the occasion and folks tend to react better and take more direction from professionals who look like professionals and of course, the professional and amicable manners have to go along with the first impression. Maybe it's not nice or too judgmental to “judge a book by it's cover” but many folks do just that when the photographer is incongruous to the event and the acceptable manner of dress. Again, put yourselves in the customer's place- you exert so much time, effort and go to the expense expense of planning an elegant wedding- the attire, the decorations and the venue and you photographer shows up looking like the Roto-Rooter man. Put yourselves in the place of the clergy-person in the church or synagogue who is trying to maintain an environment of sanctity, dignity and decorum when “tattoo-muscle” guy shows up with a camera- in his going to the beach mode and wants access to the altar. What about the caterer, Matre d'hôtel or the hall keeper who is trying to put his or her best foot forward and put on a classy event when “King-Kong” or super-slob appears on the scene?! It just ain't COOL, it's not PROFESSIONAL and it's lousy PR for the photographer even if he or she happens to be talented.
By the way- for those long jobs on hot days, I have suits made of woman's tropical worsted fabric. The material looks just like the guy's fabric but they are lighter in weight and help maintain body temperature- it's called a thermal action in the textile biz. While the tailor is at it, I have the pockets made a bit larger and deeper and reinforced so I can pack lenses and other gear into them without damage. Sometimes, on those long and hot assignments, I bring along a change of clothing as well- some of my jobs go all day and half the night. Sure it can be a long job with some hard work but we have to stay in shape- I'm 73 years old and can still put in a a long day- I just suffer later on!

What does it tell y'all if the photographer needs to be told, by a guest or a member of the bridal party, to “take more pictures” of those must-have events. This is very basic stuff- you double up on certain shots like groups to compensate for closed eyes etc., you try different angles and go for sequences and various expressions in portrait and candid

If the photographer has a spare camera, why does he leave it at his office? The idea is to take it with you to the wedding! Come on people- the guy leaves the venue, a guest has to shoot the first dance and the cake (etc.) while the “photographer” drives back and forth, to and from his office? Who was the photographer- Mr. Bean? This a far cry from professionalism and it is not even common sense!

Get real, y'all. Some of theses “photographers” are not professionals by any stretch of the imagination and some of their customers simply did no do their homework and as a result, hired the wrong people. As for the folks here who avoid, dislike or have retired form wedding photography, they have done well and are wise to enjoy or do their photography elsewhere. For those or are not into it, it's best to stay out of it. It's the kind of photography where your attitude reflects directly upon your results.

When potential clients come to inquire about my wedding services and they mention my low-priced competitors, I NEVER make disparaging remarks about anyone, I simply say that I don't know of any photographer, amateur or professional, who purposely wants to rip-off their customers or intentionally do a bad job- they are all honest and charge what the really feel the work is worth. My booking rate is still pretty darn good!

So...when you go to a wedding and notice that the hired photographer is not really operating up to professional standards, it's really too late to do anythg about it. Telling them what to do may just fluster them and make things worse. If you are the family or friendly aficionado of fine photography but a non-wedding shooter, advise them in advance to get a competent, experienced and reputable professional wedding photographer. The you can leav you camera at home and eat, drink and be merry!

steve_stoneblossom Loc: Rhode Island, USA

I fully agree with you... almost. And maybe my "judge a book by its' cover" left too much to interpretation.

There have been times when I've raised my eyebrows at the attire worn by the photographer(s) on some of my weddings. But today's proper business attire is a far cry from what it was in days gone by. And I'm old enough to know about those bygone days. But I'd rather see someone in stylish jeans with a fitted button down shirt and dress shoes than a frumpy, ill fitting suit that looks like it only sees the light of day when they're shooting a wedding.

Sometimes the wedding party and guests are dressed such that a suit and tie is the only proper choice. But many weddings are less formal, and one can dress less formally without being incongruous. But while no one wants to be the one wearing a tux at a barbecue, in general I agree, it's always better to over-dress than under-dress. You can always lose the tie and jacket.

Let me reiterate without being superfluous: Communicate. Clients can stipulate dress code, and vendors can ask rather than risk client dissatisfaction. I don't understand why people are afraid to ask questions sometimes. Are they afraid it makes them appear unprofessional? If I were a client I would be thankful it was brought up.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

My wedding contract/planning form/who's who paperwork is extremely comprehensive and detailed. Do we ask questions! We plan, along with our clients, very carefully as to all the details of their wedding day and of course, appropriate attire is included in the conversation. We are not there to make a fashion statement- we just want to blend in and be respectful and of course common sense dictates. We are not going to wear tuxedos to a barbecue nor would we wear bluejeans to a black tie reception in the grand ballroom of a five star hotel. In either hypothetical scenario, we would stand out like a sore thumb and that would be counterproductive to the non-distracting and unobtrusive working method I have alluded to.

Our business and formal attire is well fitted and currently styled. They can't be too old fashioned, ill fitting or frumpy because with the workout we give them, they only last a couple of wedding seasons.

We cover a very wide scope of wedding celebrations. Some take place in a recreation room above a fire hall, the local legion hall, a back yard, a formal garden, a modest church or a majestic cathedral, or a posh venue. Casual or formal we like to "dress for success"!

steve_stoneblossom Loc: Rhode Island, USA

Forgive me if you felt I was directing my comment at you personally and your practices, that was not my intent. It was obvious to me that your handling of the situation is nothing but professional. My commentary concerned the gamut of other photographers I have worked with.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

Hey, Steve!

Absolutely no offense taken and in fact, I like to see theses topics and differences of opinion arise- they make for good conversation and lots of information comes out of theses exchanges. I am a full-time commercial photographer- that's my day job, however, wedding photography and fine portraiture are my "first loves" in the business and were my entry levels into professional photography over 5 decades ago. I still offer both of theses services on a high-end basis.

I also fully realize that wedding traditions and modes of dress can vary greatly from one geographic location to another and wedding photographers work and dress accordingly. I am fortunate in that my city offers a wide variety of social customs. Ottawa is Canada's capitol city so there is a great multicultural environment to work in. There are a number of posh hotels with opulent ballrooms, a newly renovated modern convention center, every denomination of church, synagogue, temple and mosque that one can imagine and we are surrounded by a vast rural and farming district in the Ottawa Valley. We get to cover military weddings, very interesting, colorful and picturesque ethnic celebrations, many informal ceremonies and parties as well as very traditional formal occasions.

The Central Experimental Farm, a branch of our Government's Department of Agriculture, features a gorgeous ornamental garden and a vast arboretum and both are very wedding photography friendly. There are many historical and heritage sites that have catering facilities and provide incredible backdrops for romantic wedding photography.We are right across the river from the Provence of Quebec with it's rich French Canadian culture, ancient churches and the best food this side of the world!

I usually jump into threads, here on the Hog, when I notice conversations about wedding photography, especially if the contain disparaging commentaries or negative narratives about wedding shooters or the wedding photography industry as a whole. It's unfortunate when folks, who are not seriously involved in this kind of work, tend to hear bits and pieces of information, see incompetent or inexperienced photographers at work, hear "sour grapes" complaints about the job and lots of misapprehensions and then "regurgitate" all this negativity. It's not fair to the many fine wedding photographers and aspiring shooters and rookies out there to get all of this negativity form folks who don't necessarily know what the are talking about. Some people around here must be misogamists- those are folks who abhor the concept of marriage. Others espouse the frivolity of wedding expenses and photography siting the divorce statistics- how pessimistic is that? Don't know- I've been married for nearly 50 years and could not be happier. I am now photographing weddings of kids that are the grandchildren of couples whose weddings I covered in the late late fifties and early sixties- and mostly everyone is still married.

This business of clients "never liking what the look like" in their wedding photographs is mostly due to bad photography. A good wedding shooter is part portraitist and part photojournalist. Folks enjoy furn and casual party shots but also expect elegant formal and simply want to look great in their wedding picture. This involves the study and mastery of portrait techniques like lighting, posing, facial analysis, and more. There are quick and easy methods that adapt studio methods to location work. You can get everyone lookin' good once you know how!

If you are a wedding shooter or an assistant photographer or second shooter, y'all know that wedding photography is not a job for the faint of heart, the lazy or impatient photographer or a persons without consummate people skills. It is sometimes challenging, usually enjoyable yet hard work and can be very lucrative with good business management and promotional savvy.

The industry needs new talent and the brides deserve great images and service.

PS- If you are interested, visit us in the WEDDING PHOTOGRAPHY section of the Hog. We are a small and friendly group and there are many interesting discussions of gear, methods, and the trials and tribulation of the job. You will be a welcomed participant.

steve_stoneblossom Loc: Rhode Island, USA

Thank you for the invite.

I have no aspirations of becoming a wedding photographer. As mentioned previously, it only took me one turn as second shooter and one shot at going solo to realize it's not for me. I have my hands full onsite setting up all the flowers and other decor, and hurriedly trying to get shots of my own for promotional material, in the event the hired photographer is slow in getting images to us. Unfortunately, from a social media/promotional standpoint, speed matters. Which brings up another point: why wouldn't they jump at the opportunity for free publicity? I know there are extenuating circumstances, such as trying to get national publications to pick up the shoot and the inherent need for exclusivity, which we always respect. Otherwise, why would you not want to get your work out for referrals with no cost to you?

But I do enjoy admiring others' work. Photographers with whom I frequently work cheerfully send us all their shots to go through for images to add to our website. Which is how I've come to my conclusions regarding attire, but in essence I agree with you there. I will check it out sometime.