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Back button focus and shutter speed
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Sep 21, 2017 17:09:46   #
speters Loc: Grangeville/Idaho
 
Peterff wrote:
BBF is great, but you need to learn how to use it. Can you drive a stick shift? If not, BBF may not be for you, unless you learn how to do so.
????????????

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Sep 21, 2017 17:13:46   #
leftj Loc: Texas
 
speters wrote:
????????????


Yeah, I agree. Where did that come from.

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Sep 21, 2017 17:17:36   #
anneabc
 
So, I guess I don't understand. Have watched those videos. Will continue to watch others.

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Sep 21, 2017 17:59:22   #
rfcoakley Loc: Auburn, NH
 
anneabc wrote:
Well, looking at my shot, I knew for sure the speed was too slow. But the problem seems to be that I missed the focus. Is that correct? I kept my finger on BBF the whole time and pressed the shutter release button at the same time. I could see that the focal point was not staying on her. Argh!!


Posting full downloadable image with EXIF data could show whether focus was correct or not. Otherwise, any response would be just an opinion or guess regarding whether or not you missed the focus vs image blur from low shutter speed. Since, as you say, "the focal point was not staying on her," my opinion is that focus was an issue.

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Sep 21, 2017 18:58:57   #
idrabefi Loc: Michigan
 
I still believe basic photo knowledge is being shadowed by BBF and camera brand in this discussion. First, shooting sports at slow shutter speeds should typically be avoided. Second, sports focus mode should normally be AI Servo (sorry, I shoot Canon). Third, and true for all focus discussions, AF area must be considered. For the image provided, it may have been wise to use manual off center spot AF as the subject is not in the center of the frame. All 3 points apply whether using BBF or not, and all apply regardless of camera brand. Sorry, just my 2 cents.

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Sep 21, 2017 19:09:37   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
I think from what the OP said and the picture posted, he thought that pressing the button locks focus. So he pressed the button and recomposed, and wound up focusing on the people in the background. Next time he will know to take his finger off the button before recomposing.

--

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Sep 21, 2017 20:15:24   #
lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA
 
Peterff wrote:
BBF is great, but you need to learn how to use it. Can you drive a stick shift? If not, BBF may not be for you, unless you learn how to do so.


Nope, no stick shift automobiles in my life, only ATs. And I have arthritis in my right hand so I best to stick to Shutter Release Button half pressed metering and focusing.

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Sep 21, 2017 22:28:08   #
anneabc
 
You hit the nail on the head, Bill. I HAVE been keeping my finger on the button while recomposing. So many people have said to do so, so I don't know WHAT to believe. I've heard both things. Press to focus, keep finger on button while recomposing, press shutter button,

OR Press to focus, keep finger on button while recomposing, release finger, press shutter button,

OR, Press to focus, release finger to lock in focus, then press shutter button.

No one has been REALLY specific on the process.

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Sep 21, 2017 22:39:26   #
leftj Loc: Texas
 
anneabc wrote:
You hit the nail on the head, Bill. I HAVE been keeping my finger on the button while recomposing. So many people have said to do so, so I don't know WHAT to believe. I've heard both things. Press to focus, keep finger on button while recomposing, press shutter button,

OR Press to focus, keep finger on button while recomposing, release finger, press shutter button,

OR, Press to focus, release finger to lock in focus, then press shutter button.

No one has been REALLY specific on the process.
You hit the nail on the head, Bill. I HAVE been ke... (show quote)


Don’t rely on input from hoggers. That’s like asking the IRS a question. Just read your manual or third party expert book on your specific camera.

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Sep 21, 2017 23:04:00   #
Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.
 
speters wrote:
????????????


OK, I'll explain. Automatic transmission vehicles have only two primary controls, the go pedal, sometimes called the accelerator, and the stop pedal, also known as the brake. Once the car is put into drive mode (the big green auto mode on a digital camera) there are just two controls to be concerned with, go and stop. Digital cameras are very similar in their basic auto operation, push the shutter button and it sets the focus, takes a meter reading, and frequently selects a shutter speed and aperture value before making the exposure. All the photographer user has to do is point it roughly in the right direction, which is similar to using the steering wheel on an automatic transmission vehicle.

This is not the case with a stick shift - manual transmission - vehicle. They have one additional pedal and a gear selector in addition to the stop and go pedals and steering wheel. This combination of the clutch pedal - engage engine power to gear box - and the selection of an appropriate gear, take a certain amount of understanding of how the vehicle works and a degree of coordination to get it right.

The use of back button focus combined with servo/continuous focus separates the individual camera functions from the single shutter button to two or more buttons/settings. Focus with one button, and continuous if held, or locked if released. Metering with another button, usually locked if held while recomposing the shot. Doing it successfully takes a similar level of interaction and coordination to driving a stick shift - manual transmission - vehicle. You have to do all the right things, in the correct order, and get the timing right for it to be smooth and seamless. For many people it is more challenging than it looks, and it takes practice. The same is true with BBF, there are two or more things to synchronize to get a good result.

It is pretty clear that the OP does not yet grasp how all of those things work or interact together, but if he/she can handle the complexity of driving a stick shift vehicle - especially on twisty mountain roads - then using BBF should have no greater degree of complexity or difficulty.

Reading the manual to understand how each thing works and experimenting would be a good place to start. Then perhaps you tube videos or other training tools.

This is not about arthritis or other physical impediments, it is about understanding separate functions and coordination.

Apologies if my original post was too obscure, I grew up in a country where every driver was taught to drive a stick shift and had to take their test on a stick shift. Take the test on an automatic, and that is all you were allowed to drive legally.

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Sep 21, 2017 23:23:58   #
photoman022 Loc: Manchester CT USA
 
anneabc wrote:
Well, looking at my shot, I knew for sure the speed was too slow. But the problem seems to be that I missed the focus. Is that correct? I kept my finger on BBF the whole time and pressed the shutter release button at the same time. I could see that the focal point was not staying on her. Argh!!


Looking at the photo, all the girls sitting are in focus; which makes me wonder, "Why are the girls in focus and your granddaughter is out of focus?" My first thought is that you have to move the camera (and the focus point) and keep it on the subject. By keeping the backbutton depressed, it could be a case that your granddaughter moved and you (inadvertently) focused on the wall (which would keep the seated players in focus).

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Sep 21, 2017 23:37:16   #
AzPicLady Loc: Behind the camera!
 
peterg wrote:
Buy it! I can set my Sony A6300 so the subject's eye controls where the camera focuses.
From Gary Friedman's Sony A6300 book: "The A6300 also has an improved Eye AF feature. Once it’s been assigned to a button (I've assigned it to the "AEL" button since it's easy to hold down while you're shooting), pressing that button focuses on the closest eye. ... and the feature now works in Continuous AF (AF-C) mode too."
I'm sure you didn't want the photographer's eye control the focus. That would not make sense and would be very impractical. A good photographer normally looks all over the field of view to properly compose the shot. The photographer would have to stare at the subject's eye when snapping the shutter. Composing using the camera's LCD screen would make less sense.
Buy it! I can set my Sony A6300 so the subject's e... (show quote)


Oh but yes I do want the photographer's eye to control the focus. For years I used eye-control focusing cameras. They were dead on and as long as I looked at the object to be in focus, it was. Some folks didn't like them, but I sure did. I was mad as a hornet when I bought my first DSLR and it wasn't there! Almost shipped it back!

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Sep 22, 2017 00:12:02   #
IBM
 
jamesl wrote:
Focus then release the focus button and then recompose and shoot. You can't keep the back button focus engaged while you are recomposing or your focus will change.


That is OK for a static shot , but if she's moving you keep bb held down , I use it BIF all the time , and it's on cf. Contonues focus
The comment you make above is going to have a lot of flying bird shooters scratching there head , and your focus is changing
With every every shot hopefully, if not your going to get a lot of out of focus shots of moving targets , as a lot are taken wide
Open on a dull day ,

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Sep 22, 2017 08:44:18   #
Mary Kate Loc: NYC
 
Peterff wrote:
OK, I'll explain. Automatic transmission vehicles have only two primary controls, the go pedal, sometimes called the accelerator, and the stop pedal, also known as the brake. Once the car is put into drive mode (the big green auto mode on a digital camera) there are just two controls to be concerned with, go and stop. Digital cameras are very similar in their basic auto operation, push the shutter button and it sets the focus, takes a meter reading, and frequently selects a shutter speed and aperture value before making the exposure. All the photographer user has to do is point it roughly in the right direction, which is similar to using the steering wheel on an automatic transmission vehicle.

This is not the case with a stick shift - manual transmission - vehicle. They have one additional pedal and a gear selector in addition to the stop and go pedals and steering wheel. This combination of the clutch pedal - engage engine power to gear box - and the selection of an appropriate gear, take a certain amount of understanding of how the vehicle works and a degree of coordination to get it right.

The use of back button focus combined with servo/continuous focus separates the individual camera functions from the single shutter button to two or more buttons/settings. Focus with one button, and continuous if held, or locked if released. Metering with another button, usually locked if held while recomposing the shot. Doing it successfully takes a similar level of interaction and coordination to driving a stick shift - manual transmission - vehicle. You have to do all the right things, in the correct order, and get the timing right for it to be smooth and seamless. For many people it is more challenging than it looks, and it takes practice. The same is true with BBF, there are two or more things to synchronize to get a good result.

It is pretty clear that the OP does not yet grasp how all of those things work or interact together, but if he/she can handle the complexity of driving a stick shift vehicle - especially on twisty mountain roads - then using BBF should have no greater degree of complexity or difficulty.

Reading the manual to understand how each thing works and experimenting would be a good place to start. Then perhaps you tube videos or other training tools.

This is not about arthritis or other physical impediments, it is about understanding separate functions and coordination.

Apologies if my original post was too obscure, I grew up in a country where every driver was taught to drive a stick shift and had to take their test on a stick shift. Take the test on an automatic, and that is all you were allowed to drive legally.
OK, I'll explain. Automatic transmission vehicles... (show quote)


How about an apology for being condescending??? If you have information present the information. If you feel the need to have a greater sense of self. See a psychiatrist.

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Sep 22, 2017 08:49:32   #
Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.
 
Mary Kate wrote:
How about an apology for being condescending??? If you have information present the information. If you feel the need to have a greater sense of self. See a psychiatrist.


No apology is required for using an analogy. If you or others consider my comment condescending that is your prerogative.

My sense of self is quite adequate, thank you, and I was only following your own style of communication!

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