Ugly Hedgehog - Photography Forum
Home Active Topics Newest Pictures Search Login Register
Main Photography Discussion
Raw processing versus jpg
Page <<first <prev 4 of 11 next> last>>
May 11, 2017 06:43:38   #
Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.
 
NorthPacific wrote:
.....Irony of ironies is that when all is said and done, YOU STILL HAVE TO CONVERT THE RAW INTO A JPEG FOR ANY PRACTICAL USE...!!!!


That is completely untrue, and just shows that you do not understand the tecnology.

Especially when prints are the desired result a JPEG is not required at all, and a 16 bit printer will produce superior results without a JPEG or other 8 bit file format in the workflow.

Just because some people can't see a difference does not mean that there is no difference.

Reply
May 11, 2017 06:54:25   #
infocus Loc: Australia
 
gbernier505 wrote:
I have a Samsung nx500 camera, which I have used with great results over the last year or so using jpg format. After reading so much about using the raw format, I decided to try it. After using jpg+raw and editing the results, I find that my raw edited pictures seem to be no better than my jpg pictures. Am I missing something here.


You can process a jpg file as a Raw file if you want to. If you have Photoshop Bridge just right click on the thumb nail and read the drop down menu until you find "Open in Camera Raw" and away you go.
Not saying it replaces shooting in RAW, just saying it gives you a lot of room to move.

Reply
May 11, 2017 07:19:20   #
cthahn
 
RAW is like a negative. It can not be changed. It is available forever.

Reply
 
 
May 11, 2017 07:29:56   #
Kmgw9v Loc: Miami, Florida
 
"I shoot RAW".

Reply
May 11, 2017 07:54:35   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
gbernier505 wrote:
I guess I should have added that I converted the Samsung raw shots to the dng format and processed them in Photoshop Elements.


Elements is an 8-bit, crippled version of Photoshop. Raw files need to be handled in a 16-bit per color channel environment for best results.

By the way, it isn't "raw VERSUS JPEG." There are completely different reasons why you can and should use both, or one or the other, under different circumstances and for different workflows.

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:01:55   #
WessoJPEG Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
 
burkphoto wrote:
Elements is an 8-bit, crippled version of Photoshop. Raw files need to be handled in a 16-bit per color channel environment for best results.

By the way, it isn't "raw VERSUS JPEG." There are completely different reasons why you can and should use both, or one or the other, under different circumstances and for different workflows.


Thanks Burk.

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:04:53   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
infocus wrote:
You can process a jpg file as a Raw file if you want to. If you have Photoshop Bridge just right click on the thumb nail and read the drop down menu until you find "Open in Camera Raw" and away you go.
Not saying it replaces shooting in RAW, just saying it gives you a lot of room to move.


Myth. ACR is not going to give you the benefit of all the data you would have had in the raw file. It only lets you use familiar tools to adjust what you have. The range of adjustment is much narrower.

You can test this. Make both a raw file and a JPEG file of the same subject in bright sun. Overexpose both by 1.33 stops. You can get a MUCH better conversion from the raw file. No matter what you do, the JPEG will have no detail in the highlight areas. But the adjusted raw file will look fine.

Reply
 
 
May 11, 2017 08:09:47   #
DavidPine Loc: Fredericksburg, TX
 
Right on, Gene! I cannot imagine shooting my real estate images in JPG. I feel if I shot any image in JPG I could not produce as good of an image as I do shooting RAW. I understand the worms this topic produces among the SOOC crowd and JPG shooters but I consider shooting JPG akin to leaving food on the table.
Gene51 wrote:
Maybe not. Jpeg is fast and easy until you have to adjust it. White balance, color balance, tonal adjustments, highlight and shadow recovery is often more limited compared to what you can do with a raw file. The hardest part to understand is how with raw you can make different exposure decisions in high contrast situations, which would ordinarily result in an awful jpeg, yet has all the information required to produce a really good conversion from raw. If you shoot average contrast subjects, or shoot in a studio where you control the light, you are likely to not see much of a difference. But raw files have considerably more "pushability" than jpegs, which start to fall apart when you make even modest adjustments. To see a difference you'd have to take an image that is tone and dynamic range (and color) challenging.

First image is an unedited jpeg of what the camera recorded. I biased the exposure to protect the highlights in the water. You can already see nasty stuff in the shadows, and I didn't do any editing yet.

Second image is an attempt to open up the shadows (most of the image, actually) in the jpeg, and you can see "mud" instead of detail in most of the darker areas, posterization, and just a crappy image.

The last is a jpeg of the raw file as I converted it, and made some minor adjustments - contrast, saturation, some removal, etc. I created a 16 bit psd file, then opened it in photoshop, then saved it as a jpeg for posting.

This is the kind of subjects I shoot, so I have absolutely no use for a workflow that starts with a jpeg. I shoot weddings, sports events, birds in flight and perched, night photography, landscape, cityscape, street, etc - and so far I have not ever thought that jpegs out of the camera could touch what I can do when I use a raw workflow.

I used Lightroom and Photoshop for these. But I also regularly use ON1 Raw, DXO Optics Pro, and have used Capture One in the past.

I just finished a shoot I did yesterday of shelter cats and dogs - giving back to the community. Even though I had some control over lighting, there was some variation. and I shot everything from black dogs and cats to white ones. Dialing in a custom camera profile for the speedlight shots for all the images I took with them was a piece of cake. Making the tonal adjustments, applying sharpening, etc also very fast. I went through 300 images, culled about 50, selected 120, and was done with all the processing in an hour. Raw editing is super fast, not complicated, and far easier to learn than trying to mess with jpegs, which I would have had to adjust individually.
Maybe not. Jpeg is fast and easy until you have to... (show quote)

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:10:00   #
Cape Coral Joel
 
The advocates for Raw processing are right on. If you have Phtoshop it will open your photo's in Raw processing and even if you don't understand all of the setting hit the auto button and you will be amazed. In addition the processing is non-destructive which means you can do a lot of experimenting without the worry of damaging your art work. keep in mind that jpegs derogate every time you save them. As a side note you can open jpegs as a raw file in photoshop. Other than the large file argument why wouldn't you shoot in raw if your camera has the feature.

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:19:00   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
TonyP wrote:
Interesting comment.
I find processing raw files quicker than tweaking jpeg files individually, I think.
I usually batch process them in Photoshop elements using the ACR Plugin. All the sliders are on the one screen, save as a jpeg file and then if I have a 'standout' file I can play with the jpeg file or even go back to ACR to do it there.


JPEGs are not meant to be adjusted! They should be PRE-processed BEFORE exposure --- by nailing:

Exposure
White Balance
Picture Style or Film Simulation
Hue
Saturation
Color Tone
Contrast
Sharpness

...and the setting for any other process control your camera menu gives you.

Making good JPEGs is like making good slides was. ALL the best control was at the camera. Working with raw files is like working with color negatives. ALL the control is in the post-processing software.

The two options exist for COMPLETELY different needs and reasons. Each workflow is better than the other in certain circumstances.

Just because you CAN adjust JPEGs in post doesn't mean that's a good way to work. And just because you CAN make a straight conversion from a raw file doesn't mean that's a good way to work, either!

One workflow is meant to maximize access speed. One is meant to maximize control.

It's not 'versus'. It's appropriate choice of control for the imaging goal!

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:21:17   #
WessoJPEG Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
 
Cape Coral Joel wrote:
The advocates for Raw processing are right on. If you have Phtoshop it will open your photo's in Raw processing and even if you don't understand all of the setting hit the auto button and you will be amazed. In addition the processing is non-destructive which means you can do a lot of experimenting without the worry of damaging your art work. keep in mind that jpegs derogate every time you save them. As a side note you can open jpegs as a raw file in photoshop. Other than the large file argument why wouldn't you shoot in raw if your camera has the feature.
The advocates for Raw processing are right on. If ... (show quote)


My computer won't open raw, photo elements won't open. D7200.

Reply
 
 
May 11, 2017 08:35:03   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
WessoJPEG wrote:
My computer won't open raw, photo elements won't open. D7200.


Then you need an upgrade to open the latest camera files.

This happens all the time, even to pros. New camera comes out. You buy it. You can't open its raw files.

Three months later, Adobe updates Camera Raw to add new camera profiles. BUT, you have the last *full* revision of the software, not the current one.

Updates that add new camera compatibility only work with the CURRENT version of Adobe software.

The Photoshop/Lightroom/Bridge CC bundle subscription solves this. You can get every update and upgrade the day it is released.

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:41:00   #
WessoJPEG Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
 
burkphoto wrote:
Then you need an upgrade to open the latest camera files.

This happens all the time, even to pros. New camera comes out. You buy it. You can't open its raw files.

Three months later, Adobe updates Camera Raw to add new camera profiles. BUT, you have the last *full* revision of the software, not the current one.

Updates that add new camera compatibility only work with the CURRENT version of Adobe software.

The Photoshop/Lightroom/Bridge CC bundle subscription solves this. You can get every update and upgrade the day it is released.
Then you need an upgrade to open the latest camera... (show quote)


Tried every download, but computer won't handle it.

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:46:58   #
Peterff Loc: O'er The Hills and Far Away, in Themyscira.
 
WessoJPEG wrote:
Tried every download, but computer won't handle it.


It may not be the computer itself, but the way the software is set up. Either way it is a problem for you, but not a JPEG vs raw issue necessarily,

Reply
May 11, 2017 08:50:30   #
camerapapi Loc: Miami, Fl.
 
In the first place, and this is the rule "if it is not broken don't fix it." You have said you have been getting good results from JPEG files and in your case I would have stay with them.
On a regular basis RAW vs JPEG appears in this forum. I bet that if you do a search you will find a myriad of articles describing the virtues of one against the other. Many photographers shoot RAW and they do not even know what RAW is.
A RAW file is data straight out of the sensor or to explain it better, an image without processing. JPEG images are made with the firmware of the camera and the operator has parameters in the camera that can regulate the processing of the files such as contrast, saturation and sharpness. A JPEG image is an image that requires little editing while a RAW file needs good editing to obtain all it has to give.
Each manufacturer of cameras has its proprietary RAW file and many of them offer usually for free their own RAW editor. It is up to the photographer to manipulate the file to make it alive. We can say that the photographer is now doing the job of the camera's firware and it up to him to make that RAW file shine.
I use both files but I find myself using JPEG more often. It works for me and I am happy with the quality.

Reply
Page <<first <prev 4 of 11 next> last>>
If you want to reply, then register here. Registration is free and your account is created instantly, so you can post right away.
Main Photography Discussion
UglyHedgehog.com - Forum
Copyright 2011-2024 Ugly Hedgehog, Inc.