Its not just camera stores that are closing !!
Jan 28, 2017 19:33:25 #
blackest wrote:
I don't know how it works in American degree progr... (show quote)
I like your joke! However the study and research discipline is frequently as important as the subject matter, which has 'a best by' date in most cases. The skill set is far more enduring in most cases. By the way I did my degrees at a British university.
Jan 28, 2017 20:08:19 #
I graduated from UCLA with a degree in Political Science in 1968. Liberal Arts are supposed to teach you how to think. What I found repeatedly in my 4 years as an undergrad was that you were expected to learn to think like the teacher or instructor. Another thing I learned was the day you left with the intention of getting a job you were completely on your own.
Now this was almost 50 years ago and I know things had changed. At work during the 1980's and 90's I had many occasions to interview job applicants, and interns. The single most important attribute for success was the eagerness to learn and to work hard. What I found was most recent college grads already thought they knew it all. They somehow equated confidence (or pretended confidence) with knowledge and ability. When fantasy confronts reality, reality always wins.
Now this was almost 50 years ago and I know things had changed. At work during the 1980's and 90's I had many occasions to interview job applicants, and interns. The single most important attribute for success was the eagerness to learn and to work hard. What I found was most recent college grads already thought they knew it all. They somehow equated confidence (or pretended confidence) with knowledge and ability. When fantasy confronts reality, reality always wins.
blackest wrote:
I don't know how it works in American degree progr... (show quote)
Jan 28, 2017 20:21:23 #
bdk wrote:
you dont need photography school buy a good camera and good lens and thats all u need. just press the little button and move on to the next pic
I Wish it was that easy.
Jan 28, 2017 20:44:18 #
Bobspez wrote:
I graduated from UCLA with a degree in Political S... (show quote)
That's pretty much the confidence of youth, when your 18 you think you know it all by the time you hit 21 you realise you didn't then but.. sometime after that you realise you still have more to learn, me i'm still learning :) Lets say we could go back in time and meet up with our 18 year old selves would you give your younger self a slap and a few choice words. I think I would. I wasn't a bad kid but i needed some direction.
Jan 29, 2017 10:00:10 #
Peterff wrote:
I like your joke! However the study and research discipline is frequently as important as the subject matter, which has 'a best by' date in most cases. The skill set is far more enduring in most cases. By the way I did my degrees at a British university.
Absolutely! Learning how to learn, how to research, the scientific method, the principles of math and language, the nature of the human condition, and the principles of a major discipline are the most important things I took with me from college.
Facts? Meh. You can look 'em up on the 'net. Knowing how to approach and solve problems, and having the enthusiasm to do so, are far more important than dated "knowledge".
Jan 30, 2017 15:01:56 #
stadtmkw
Loc: Burlington, MA
burkphoto wrote:
College teaches one how to learn and how to think and sometimes how to get along with others. Processes and principles... not facts worth remembering (in most cases).
Agreed. While parts of formal education may not be applicable in one's career, one of the most valuable skills that formal education provides is the ability to think critically. The Critical Thinking Community site provides a definition that is far better than I could:
"Critical thinking is that mode of thinking — about any subject, content, or problem — in which the thinker improves the quality of his or her thinking by skillfully analyzing, assessing, and reconstructing it. Critical thinking is self-directed, self-disciplined, self-monitored, and self-corrective thinking. It presupposes assent to rigorous standards of excellence and mindful command of their use. It entails effective communication and problem-solving abilities, as well as a commitment to overcome our native egocentrism and sociocentrism."
Jan 30, 2017 15:28:05 #
stadtmkw wrote:
Agreed. While parts of formal education may not be... (show quote)
Good quote. Of course, it is possible to do all of that right, yet still deceive oneself by failing to consider facts, principles, and viewpoints that we may not be aware of. Millions of examples of such failure exist. Stated differently, to "mastermind" something thoroughly takes the guidance and review and input from others, especially those who do not think as we do, since they come from very different perspectives, cultures, or disciplines.
Jan 30, 2017 15:31:07 #
burkphoto wrote:
Stated differently, to "mastermind" something thoroughly takes the guidance and review and input from others, especially those who do not think as we do, since they come from very different perspectives, cultures, or disciplines.
I thought that was no longer considered to be an acceptable, appropriate and worthwhile approach in the USA!
Jan 30, 2017 15:39:46 #
about news... similar to sugar, unhealthy and does not encourage thinking. Small fragments of addictive entertainment presented as information, unlikely to change minds. We choose what we listen to, and only when we hear something we want to hear, do we believe it.
about training... often already out-of-date. BUT, it can serve as a litmus test. If a student can survive training, then perhaps he can survive the job. Not so good if it only speaks to the student's willingness to make loan payments.
about information and thinking... it is out there, it can be found, but it must be earned and searched for. It requires effort. Thinking is not easy - it can be best compared to exercise. It hurts, but it builds strength. Most won't be bothered with it.
about training... often already out-of-date. BUT, it can serve as a litmus test. If a student can survive training, then perhaps he can survive the job. Not so good if it only speaks to the student's willingness to make loan payments.
about information and thinking... it is out there, it can be found, but it must be earned and searched for. It requires effort. Thinking is not easy - it can be best compared to exercise. It hurts, but it builds strength. Most won't be bothered with it.
Jan 30, 2017 15:46:04 #
pfrancke wrote:
about training... often already out-of-date. BUT,... (show quote)
I've taken the liberty of reordering your three points, which I hope still reflects your thinking, but possibly represents our current situation even more accurately!
Jan 30, 2017 15:57:38 #
Peterff wrote:
I've taken the liberty of reordering your three points, which I hope still reflects your thinking, but possibly represents our current situation even more accurately!
LOL - I agree with your order. We have been fooled into thinking that news is information and that others can do our thinking for us.
Jan 30, 2017 16:00:52 #
pfrancke wrote:
LOL - I agree with your order. We have been fooled into thinking that news is information and that others can do our thinking for us.
Jan 30, 2017 16:32:56 #
repleo wrote:
I was browsing on line looking for photography courses. I found a site that listed four photography schools in Massachusetts. When I checked into them I discovered that three of the four schools have shut their doors !!
As Trump would say - 'So sad'.
As Trump would say - 'So sad'.
Quoting Trump. So sad.
Jan 30, 2017 17:05:29 #
Very true. If you can survive the absurdities of an education, you can survive the absurdities of the work world. It is conditioning more than anything. That's why the degree is a passport to the job interview. Just like your survival in school may depend on crackpot professors, your survival at work may depend on crackpot bosses. Much like basic training in the military. Making your bunk as tight as a drum, spit shining your shoes, marching in formation, isn't training you to be a soldier, it is training you to obey, to conform, to follow orders to the letter no matter how absurd they may be. As far as critical thinking, you learn to keep it to yourself.
pfrancke wrote:
...
about training... often already out-of-date. BUT, it can serve as a litmus test. If a student can survive training, then perhaps he can survive the job. Not so good if it only speaks to the student's willingness to make loan payments.
....
about training... often already out-of-date. BUT, it can serve as a litmus test. If a student can survive training, then perhaps he can survive the job. Not so good if it only speaks to the student's willingness to make loan payments.
....
Jan 30, 2017 17:08:37 #
Bobspez wrote:
As far as critical thinking, you learn to keep it to yourself.
True, but thinking IS critical!
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