Ugly Hedgehog - Photography Forum
Home Active Topics Newest Pictures Search Login Register
Main Photography Discussion
Extenders or close-up lens
Page <prev 2 of 3 next>
Dec 27, 2016 07:40:06   #
billnikon Loc: Pennsylvania/Ohio/Florida/Maui/Oregon/Vermont
 
russjc001 wrote:
I have a 55 mm 1.8 prime and wish to do some macro. Would like some opinions on using an attached close-up lens vs getting extenders. Which provide the best clarity? I shoot with Sony A7RII.


Buy a Minolta 50 mm micro lens from ebay, cheap and sharp. Then get the adapter for your camera. There you go.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 08:04:58   #
sb Loc: Florida's East Coast
 
When I first started in photography I used the screw-on "close-up" filter-type lenses and was very pleased with the results, even though purists will point out that you are "putting cheap glass in front of good/expensive glass". But the close-up lenses are quick and easy to use, are pretty inexpensive, and will let you develop some skills and determine whether this is an area of photography that you wish to spend time and money on.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 08:05:14   #
pyroManiac Loc: HIXSON,TN
 
Mounting the lens backwards works great except that your working range is very limited. I have a lens to body mount that screws into filter threads and have some tack sharp pix of a green lynx spider. I do not attempt to focus in normal way but mount camera on tripod and crank down VERY SLOWLY so as not to startle subject spider, when subject is in sharpest focus then make the exposure---works.

Reply
 
 
Dec 27, 2016 08:14:27   #
Mark Bski Loc: A sleepy little island not far from Seattle
 
Get a macro lens.

I damaged the connector on one of my lenses using an extension tube and now the lens does not auto focus.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 08:42:57   #
imagemeister Loc: mid east Florida
 
Gene51 wrote:
What are you trying to shoot?

True macro lenses are optimized for working at or near the minimum focus distance. Putting either on a normal lens, intended for general use, may work for the occasional closeup, but they do not compare to the real thing. Besides, either the tubes or the filter will get you closer to your subject - that's how you get the extra magnification - and if you aren't shooting stamps or coins on a copy stand, you are likely to not have enough working distance. If you are shooting nature subjects, a 150 - 180 macro is what you probably want.

If you decide to go the auxiliary filter route, get a one or two element achromatic filter - you'd have to get one of these:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/87479-REG/Canon_2819A001_52mm_250D_Close_up_Lens.html

and one of these - https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/809605-REG/sensei_sur_4952_49_52mm_step_up_ring.html

since the smallest close up filter Canon makes is 52mm.

You do realize that your lens gives you a magnification of 1:4 without any filters or extension tubes.
What are you trying to shoot? br br True macro le... (show quote)




extension tubes = light loss, relatively difficult to install and un-install, relatively no IQ loss.

Extenders = light loss, some IQ loss, relatively difficult to install and un-install, good if you need the extra working distance they provide

expensive 2-element close up lenses like Canon 500D - no light loss, some IQ loss, some focal length loss, EASY to install and un-install and especially preferable for zoom lenses and longer focal lengths. I really prefer these for most cases.

All IQ loses above are minimized by stopping lens down.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 09:00:27   #
jeep_daddy Loc: Prescott AZ
 
The guy never came back to see our recommendations.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 09:47:19   #
dave.m
 
the optical affects of tubes or close up lenses have been well covered here and can be investigated further with a google search.

If you are experimenting then I would suggest either will be ok in many conditions.

However the two biggest issues I have found once I got even mildly serous about macro was distance to subject and depth of field.

I think a 50mm lens is way to short - it could put you so close to a subject that lighting becomes almost impossible, or if the subject is live then it will have moved as soon as you approach. I finally (yea right) bought a 100mm macro lens. Withing a year I traded in for a 150mm and at times even 150 puts me too close. I also have been lucky to get a used Canon 500D close up lens for my 70-200m zoom. Pricey new, but this lens attachment has two elements and gives excellent optical results. However as has already been mentioned a close up lens greatly reduces the focal distance to a subject - great for close up but maximum focusing is minimal.

Perhaps even more of a handicap is depth of field with close up work. A quick google of DoF tables for close up shows even at f8 a magnification of x0.35 DoF is only 2.5mm and at x1.0 magnification 0.56mm! It is still only 4mm with f22 at x1. given the big fall off of aperture with extension tubes, plus small apertures on the lens to get some DoF, exposure (and lighting with a short lens like 50mm) with become a big issue. Small DoF affects high magnification whether you use close up lenses, extension tubes or bellows, or a macro lens. While out of focus backgrounds are great when doing portraits, wildlife etc its not so good when the out of focus is just 1/2mm back from the focus point of the subject itself. So at this point, as you get more hooked on macro you need to invest in stacking software where you take multiple refocused images and stack them to get overall focus in the final image.

So I make the following suggestions: get a close up lens that with give you up to x0.3 magnification - a relatively modest investment to experiment with (unless you get the Canon 500D close up lens, which I wouldn't until I was satified that a cheap close up lens is giving workable distance to subject and DoF with subjects I was interested in).

If that whets your appetite for this fascinating branch of photography, then got for it with a macro lens. Look and test 100, 150, 180 or 200 at that time so you hopefully reduce your purchase to a lens that meets your meed. Finally if into extreme close up then look at image stacking which can be done in Photoshop or with specialist software such as Helicon or Zerene and others. If you have a suitable Canon or Nikon Helicon offer an android app which will work out the number of images, and then take the multiple refocused exposures (maybe also Iphone but haven't got one so don'r know.) The images can then be stacked in Photoshop.

BTW this is another excellent example of 'computer assisted time wasting' as you get actively involved in post processing multiple stacked imaged - but then again post processing many images leads along that path :)

Reply
 
 
Dec 27, 2016 09:57:36   #
Smudgey Loc: Ohio, Calif, Now Arizona
 
I agree with melismus.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 10:12:26   #
camerapapi Loc: Miami, Fl.
 
I would go with a macro lens.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 11:05:27   #
JimH123 Loc: Morgan Hill, CA
 
dave.m wrote:
the optical affects of tubes or close up lenses have been well covered here and can be investigated further with a google search.

If you are experimenting then I would suggest either will be ok in many conditions.

However the two biggest issues I have found once I got even mildly serous about macro was distance to subject and depth of field.

I think a 50mm lens is way to short - it could put you so close to a subject that lighting becomes almost impossible, or if the subject is live then it will have moved as soon as you approach. I finally (yea right) bought a 100mm macro lens. Withing a year I traded in for a 150mm and at times even 150 puts me too close. I also have been lucky to get a used Canon 500D close up lens for my 70-200m zoom. Pricey new, but this lens attachment has two elements and gives excellent optical results. However as has already been mentioned a close up lens greatly reduces the focal distance to a subject - great for close up but maximum focusing is minimal.

Perhaps even more of a handicap is depth of field with close up work. A quick google of DoF tables for close up shows even at f8 a magnification of x0.35 DoF is only 2.5mm and at x1.0 magnification 0.56mm! It is still only 4mm with f22 at x1. given the big fall off of aperture with extension tubes, plus small apertures on the lens to get some DoF, exposure (and lighting with a short lens like 50mm) with become a big issue. Small DoF affects high magnification whether you use close up lenses, extension tubes or bellows, or a macro lens. While out of focus backgrounds are great when doing portraits, wildlife etc its not so good when the out of focus is just 1/2mm back from the focus point of the subject itself. So at this point, as you get more hooked on macro you need to invest in stacking software where you take multiple refocused images and stack them to get overall focus in the final image.

So I make the following suggestions: get a close up lens that with give you up to x0.3 magnification - a relatively modest investment to experiment with (unless you get the Canon 500D close up lens, which I wouldn't until I was satified that a cheap close up lens is giving workable distance to subject and DoF with subjects I was interested in).

If that whets your appetite for this fascinating branch of photography, then got for it with a macro lens. Look and test 100, 150, 180 or 200 at that time so you hopefully reduce your purchase to a lens that meets your meed. Finally if into extreme close up then look at image stacking which can be done in Photoshop or with specialist software such as Helicon or Zerene and others. If you have a suitable Canon or Nikon Helicon offer an android app which will work out the number of images, and then take the multiple refocused exposures (maybe also Iphone but haven't got one so don'r know.) The images can then be stacked in Photoshop.

BTW this is another excellent example of 'computer assisted time wasting' as you get actively involved in post processing multiple stacked imaged - but then again post processing many images leads along that path :)
the optical affects of tubes or close up lenses ha... (show quote)


I agree with everything you are saying. But there is a solution. The Olympus EM5ii and EM1 will allow you to take many images, adjusting the focal distance between shots and with that, you can load the images into a program such as Helicon and combine into one fully focused image. It works really well, and allows you to pick up to 999 photos, if you care to go that high. And the EM1 adds one additional capability. This mode only takes 8 images, but it auto stacks in camera to produce one final combined image.

There is a restriction on which of their lenses are supported in these modes. I have the 60mm macro which is supported and with the crop factor, it acts like a 120mm lens.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 11:50:07   #
Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak
 
I have a D7200 with the 18-140 zoom lens. Any reason I couldn't use extension tubes with this lens? It seems like I could get close up to a subject without having to get right on top of it like I would with my 50mm f/1.8, and suffer the accompanying light issues of getting right on top of the subject.

Reply
 
 
Dec 27, 2016 12:01:52   #
Mark Bski Loc: A sleepy little island not far from Seattle
 
Wingpilot wrote:
I have a D7200 with the 18-140 zoom lens. Any reason I couldn't use extension tubes with this lens? It seems like I could get close up to a subject without having to get right on top of it like I would with my 50mm f/1.8, and suffer the accompanying light issues of getting right on top of the subject.



Extension tubes were tight and I damaged my lens connection when I used them. Spend the money and get a macro lens.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 12:22:23   #
LoneRangeFinder Loc: Left field
 
Mark Bski wrote:
Extension tubes were tight and I damaged my lens connection when I used them. Spend the money and get a macro lens.


Which set of tubes? I have used tubes for quite some time...and never had this problem.

However, there is a lesson here: never ever force any lens or adapter on your camera or lens. Although this thread is about extension tubes, the "don't force it" rule also applies to teleconverters. Some, in fact, are incompatible with some lenses. Check before you buy and check before you apply.....

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 12:28:16   #
Wingpilot Loc: Wasilla. Ak
 
LoneRangeFinder wrote:
Which set of tubes? I have used tubes for quite some time...and never had this problem.

However, there is a lesson here: never ever force any lens or adapter on your camera or lens. Although this thread is about extension tubes, the "don't force it" rule also applies to teleconverters. Some, in fact, are incompatible with some lenses. Check before you buy and check before you apply.....


Amen to that.

Reply
Dec 27, 2016 12:36:52   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
russjc001 wrote:
I have a 55 mm 1.8 prime and wish to do some macro. Would like some opinions on using an attached close-up lens vs getting extenders. Which provide the best clarity? I shoot with Sony A7RII.


My first close up equipment was a cheap set of close up lenses. I had loads of fun with them. I knew they were not as good as a macro lens but I was doing small 3d objects and did not need flat field of a macro lens.
So if you want to explore the fun of close up photography they are great and inexpensive. I never regretted the decision and took many close up photos with my 50mm f1.4 lens and close up lenses. In fact it was just a simpler time overall.
Do as you want and have lots of fun.

Reply
Page <prev 2 of 3 next>
If you want to reply, then register here. Registration is free and your account is created instantly, so you can post right away.
Main Photography Discussion
UglyHedgehog.com - Forum
Copyright 2011-2024 Ugly Hedgehog, Inc.