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Flash Dance
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Jul 6, 2016 11:51:56   #
chapjohn Loc: Tigard, Oregon
 
mas24 wrote:
Yes. Please ask if you are permitted to use a flash. Dance competitions and weddings, perhaps they don't care. But flash units are banned for indoor sports such as basketball and volleyball at certain places in my area. For under $200, you can purchase a Yongnuo 600EX-RT for $120 from B&H.


At lot of indoor weddings flash is NOT allowed because it distracts everyone from the event. However, if the photographer sets up strobes around the sanctuary and triggers them remotely most officiates allow this as this set up is not distracting.

The last indoor wedding I officiated the photographer (using the popup flash on her camera) said to me that if she could not use flash she would not be able to get pictures (I also suspect she using auto setting). She became the center of attention instead of the bride. The point is that as a photographer at any event, you want to be not seen.

For dances and concerts ask if you can be there for dress rehersal and shoot. Usually all the lights are on and you do not need flash. During these times you can get to places off limits during the actual show. It is all about POV and the viewer will not know that you got the image during rehersal.

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Jul 6, 2016 12:20:10   #
St3v3M Loc: 35,000 feet
 
chapjohn wrote:
...
For dances and concerts ask if you can be there for dress rehersal and shoot. Usually all the lights are on and you do not need flash. During these times you can get to places off limits during the actual show. It is all about POV and the viewer will not know that you got the image during rehersal.

Great advice! S-

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Jul 6, 2016 13:00:05   #
speters Loc: Grangeville/Idaho
 
Maik723 wrote:
Currently shooting with a Canon 7d and 7dmII with a Canon 70-200 IS II lens. Dance competition, wedding and other events coming up. Never used flash but, considering for events forthcoming. Researched Canon Speedlites but, would strongly consider other brand(s) that's more aligned with my budget (max. $200). Any and all recommendation would be much appreciated.

Yungnuo's 600EX-RT at $118 will fit nicely within your budget and it is an almost clone of the Canon (and it plays well with them as well)!

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Jul 6, 2016 13:08:49   #
canon Lee
 
SharpShooter wrote:
Maik, as for the dance, as Steve has said, NO WAY you can use flash on that. Now let me qualify, IF it where daytime outside then fill would probably be ok.
But indoors on a darkened stage with lighting, NO WAY! Just too dangerous.
With enough light the zoom might work but it's probably too slow. For a play or a band it might work but not likely for fast moving dance. My lens of choice is a 50mm @1.4 from up close or a 200 f1.8 from the back and use auto ISO.
Why do you still have the 7mkl? Sell it and get the lens you need!!! Good luck
SS
Maik, as for the dance, as Steve has said, NO WAY ... (show quote)


Shooter, he probably holding on to the 7D as back up or he may use it with another lens.

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Jul 6, 2016 18:13:30   #
ted.herman Loc: Chatsworth, CA
 
Have been shooting dance competitions for over 7 years and flash is a NO NO! Competitors hate the flash as it can disorient them. Also, have had great photos ruined by someone with a flash as I shot. Lighting at competitions is bad enough without photo flashes.

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Jul 6, 2016 18:57:23   #
lowkick Loc: Connecticut
 
ted.herman wrote:
Have been shooting dance competitions for over 7 years and flash is a NO NO! Competitors hate the flash as it can disorient them. Also, have had great photos ruined by someone with a flash as I shot. Lighting at competitions is bad enough without photo flashes.


Since you are experienced and have told the opportunity what not to do, why not give him some tips on how to shoot a dance competition?

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Jul 6, 2016 20:39:58   #
BHC Loc: Strawberry Valley, JF, USA
 
Maik723 wrote:
Snoot? What's a snoot?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snoot

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Jul 6, 2016 23:38:02   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
Mogul wrote:
IF you are allowed to use flash, consider the purchase of a "snoot".


For moving subjects far away?

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Jul 6, 2016 23:41:12   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
Maik723 wrote:
Snoot? What's a snoot?


A snoot is a cone like device that restricts the flash output to a narrower angle. It is typically used for accent lighting.

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Jul 7, 2016 00:58:01   #
lowkick Loc: Connecticut
 
lowkick wrote:
Since you are experienced and have told the opportunity what not to do, why not give him some tips on how to shoot a dance competition?


Damned auto correct! Opportunity was supposed to be OP for original poster.

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Jul 7, 2016 16:34:21   #
Maik723
 
ted.herman wrote:
Have been shooting dance competitions for over 7 years and flash is a NO NO! Competitors hate the flash as it can disorient them. Also, have had great photos ruined by someone with a flash as I shot. Lighting at competitions is bad enough without photo flashes.


Thanks. BTW, in lieu of flash, what lens and settings have you employed in your 7-years of shooting dance competitions. In general of course (I know the lighting is different for each situation).

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Jul 7, 2016 17:34:57   #
ted.herman Loc: Chatsworth, CA
 
Thanks to those who asked. Don't know if this will help or not. My current camera is a Sony A7ii. I will alternate 28-70 and 18-200 lens. Sony is a great low light camera, so my settings are mostly from experience. I start fully automatic, then make adjustments from there depending on multiple factors in the room.

Typically dance competitions have approx 24 couples in quarter finals, narrowed to 12 in semi's and 6 for the finals. The dance floor is usually about 4,000 square feet. Lighting is mostly terrible, from too much or too little and too many flashing colors. There are numerous levels of competition from novice to professional and many dance categories, typically American Smooth and International Ballroom, which tend to dress in the flowing dressy gowns and tuxedos, and American Rhythm and International Latin with the ladies outfits designed by structural engineers to keep everything in place. Each category has certain rules as to the moves and steps the dancers can take. I concentrate on the professionals. Most categories include 5 different dances lasting approximately 60 to 70 seconds each with a 15 second break in between. There are only a small number of moves couples can make in the short time period. Also, colors of the outfits are a problem in combination with the lighting. I start with the quarter finals, looking first for interesting couples and the routine they dance. I want to watch mostly the ones that have a chance to move on. Most will do 10 to 12 steps, then repeat once or twice during the time period. I try to remember their routine and then anticipate a good shot. The floor is very crowded, so I shoot mostly to get into the competition mode and check for any camera adjustments that need to be made.

Semi's are less crowded and am more into the flow of the dancers. Another chance to adjust camera settings. As lighting brightness and color are so different in different facilities, I can't recommend camera settings that would meet everyone's needs. In the finals, there are only 6 couples on the floor, so by now, I know which couples I want to concentrate on. Again, interesting couples and color/style of outfits are more important that the dance ability. Most ladies will change outfits for the finals, so some camera adjustments may need to be made. Black outfits are the worst to shoot and lighting is darker for the finals. After the competition is over, there are usually "show dances" by the best dancers, where there are "no rules" as to the moves. Lighting here is usually by spotlight following the couple or group dancing. Best chances here for good shots. Again, lighting is a problem, so need to adjust settings on the fly.

I tend to take a lot of shots, perhaps 2,000 for two days, then narrow down to about 100, then down to about 25. (As Wayne Gretsky said, "you miss 100% of the shots you don't take"). Then into photoshop to get just the "feel" I want.... whatever strikes my fancy. I tend to keep the top 100 shots and check back a year to two later, letting me take a fresh look. Am working now processing photos as digital negatives with fun results. I find that galleries don't want to exhibit photos by anyone except the very top level photographers. Interesting that most painters want to make their work look like a photo, while many photographers like me want to make their work look like a painting as a way to get into galleries.

Hope this helps. Good luck and take time to enjoy the dancing.... Ted

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Jul 7, 2016 18:29:52   #
lowkick Loc: Connecticut
 
So you start from auto mode and then adjust from there? Do you use a special shooting mode in auto (like sports mode)? Could you be a little more specific? Like, because of the speed of the dancers, you should probably start your shutter speed to at least a 125th of a second, and because you are shooting couples, or more, your aperture should probably start at about an f/8 for enough depth of field. Set your ISO to auto and your focus on averaging (unless you want to focus on a single dancer). Then start taking shots and chimping. Adjust your shutter speed to a faster setting,if necessary, and your f/stop to a higher number (smaller opening) if necessary. Oh, by the way, with the difficult lighting situation (low light and changing light), it might be smart best to shoot in RAW so you can adjust white balance in PP. You might try auto WB, but the camera will probably be fooled by the changing lighting. I would also suggest using back button focusing to keep up with the action.

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