Is You A Tweaker, or Potoshop Twerker.
May 5, 2015 12:41:52 #
Chuck_893 wrote:
.... I've been very interested in the basic questions for very, very long. "How much is too much?" "How little is too little?" "What is just right?" I think it depends on the craftsperson and the viewer and their respective grandmothers. :D I have my personal preferences. Y'all have yours. ...
Chuck, I've come to believe that the difficulty with these questions is that most people approach them with the idea that there is some defining answer, and that that answer is somehow universal for all photographers and all photographs. My feeling is that the answers are uniquely individualistic and are dictated by the aesthetic and emotional intent of the photographer as they apply to a specific image.
If one were to ask a group of photographers to process the same image, I am confident that the results would pretty much cover the spectrum from minimal to extensive manipulation. Put those images in front of a variety of viewers and there will be a lot of disagreement about which is the "better" image. All of the images can conceivably have equal merit but appeal to different viewers. And that, in my mind, is why photography can be thought of as a creative art form. We are not, and should not, be limited to any fixed definition of what exactly is too much, too little, or just right. We are only limited by our imagination, creativity, and skill sets.
May 5, 2015 12:59:45 #
Photographer Jim wrote:
Chuck, I've come to believe that the difficulty wi... (show quote)
:thumbup: :thumbup: I agree.
Such "conversations" as this often start out amicably enough but derail when some folks insist or insinuate that there is a "right" and a "wrong" rather than merely accepting that we humans have infinite varieties of opinions and talents and that much of the fun of pastimes like photography is in finding our own path through exploration, experimentation, study and practice. It isn't necessary or advisable to chart anyone's path other than our own.
May 5, 2015 13:05:48 #
Little side story here. I did a show last year in La Jolla and had the opportunity to meet and talk with Laurent Martres, author of the Photographing the Southwest book series. He commented that at one time he was very reluctant to say that he did a lot of post-processing. Now, he simply answers when asked, "Yes, I do". His work is often saturated more than many would do, but it is his vision and he stands by it.
One likes an image, or one doesn't. Quibbling about how the image got to be what it is misses the point.
One likes an image, or one doesn't. Quibbling about how the image got to be what it is misses the point.
May 5, 2015 13:11:45 #
minniev wrote:
:thumbup: :thumbup: I agree. br br Such "c... (show quote)
I suppose in the future I will simply not respond to the few who so transparently display over the top hostility. I mean it's not politics it's photography after all.
:lol: ;) pith
May 5, 2015 13:17:27 #
I would also reject the premise. You say you want to document what you see, and you think that very minimal tweaking will achieve that. But what you see is massively post-processed by the brain behind the eye. The eye is constantly moving, focusing at different distances and opening and closing the iris (shutter) to adjust the exposure for different points. Then it's all selectively assembled in the brain, selecting the best focus and exposure for each point. One camera photo is perhaps 1% of what your eye saw. One obvious example is a sunset shot where the sky is beautiful and the photo shows buildings in black silhouette, very artistic. But your eye saw considerable detail in those buildings. It's a much more powerful image capture device.
Not changing much is a completely legitimate approach but don't claim that it's more "real" or that it represents what your eye saw. Do what you like and enjoy the results!
Not changing much is a completely legitimate approach but don't claim that it's more "real" or that it represents what your eye saw. Do what you like and enjoy the results!
May 5, 2015 13:18:07 #
TheDman
Loc: USA
Photographer Jim wrote:
Little side story here. I did a show last year in... (show quote)
You're absolutely dead on, but at times it can be tricky waters to negotiate... I was just at a live art show judging, where we had to bring 3 samples to show one judge. The judge glanced at my pieces for a while, and the first question out of her mouth was "Now how much Photoshop manipulation was done to each of these", said in such a manner that let me know she didn't approve of such shenanigans.
Oddly enough, two of my 3 samples happened to be my least edited ones, but I was straight with her that the third was an exposure blend. I try to answer that question by trying to educate the judge as to why the manipulations are a positive thing, rather than a negative. I'll know in a couple weeks if I got in. :)
May 5, 2015 13:19:05 #
pith wrote:
I suppose in the future I will simply not respond to the few who so transparently display over the top hostility. I mean it's not politics it's photography after all.
:lol: ;) pith
:lol: ;) pith
Some of those who came across as unpleasant may have already seen this movie, they know it ends bad :wink:
May 5, 2015 13:30:23 #
TheDman
Loc: USA
minniev wrote:
Some of those who came across as unpleasant may have already seen this movie, they know it ends bad :wink:
Yep! This is about the 9,000th thread I've seen here that begins with the premise that A) Too much post processing is bad, and B) Too much = more than I do. They're all the same.
May 5, 2015 13:37:00 #
Tweaker, with rare Twerks. I like to shoot what I see - and leave the world in it largely as it is...
May 5, 2015 14:05:10 #
TheDman wrote:
You're absolutely dead on, but at times it can be ... (show quote)
LOL I understand. But the competition arena is a whole different bally-wick all together (and one that can admittedly be frustrating at times). While the casual viewer may like or dislike an image (based on the presence or absence of manipulation) judges (who undoubtedly have the same gamut of preferences) are in a position of "power" to determine "merit" based on their personal preferences. I have an image that was rejected from a show because the judge's opinion was "its Photoshop run wild". The same image placed highly in several other competitions, and was purchased by a micro brewery in SoCal as the center piece over the bar of their new public tasting room! Both viewpoints were correct for those who made them.
May 5, 2015 14:38:11 #
I never thought there was any question. The post processing has always been just as important as the pre-processing.
May 5, 2015 14:59:27 #
Mark7829
Loc: Calfornia
pith wrote:
I suppose in the future I will simply not respond to the few who so transparently display over the top hostility. I mean it's not politics it's photography after all.
:lol: ;) pith
:lol: ;) pith
You don't understand the nature of an open and public forum. If you don't like the comments - simply refrain from posting. As they say, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen. And in this kitchen, there are too many cooks. You will likely step on one including yourself.
Note, you did not ask just a question. You prefaced it with a comment on how you process for which you indicated that you do minimal post processing. It is a bias, resulting a plethora of prejudiced replies. Perhaps you should take from this what you can and learn?
May 5, 2015 15:16:56 #
Photography isn't a matter of life and death, it's much more important than that! Or at least so it would seem from the amount of heat these threads generate. Not much light, but a lot of heat. ;) :P
pith wrote:
I suppose in the future I will simply not respond to the few who so transparently display over the top hostility. I mean it's not politics it's photography after all.
:lol: ;) pith
:lol: ;) pith
May 5, 2015 15:30:20 #
TheDman wrote:
Dman, I like what you did. It really pops. But for me it's just a hair "overcooked." The reds (in particular) are (for me) a little beyond what's real, even assuming that I had managed to arrive on a bell-clear day with no haze in the canyon. But your tweak is good! Just a little further than I'd go. :)...Frankly, I would have gone a bit farther with the contrast adjustments, but then I wasn't there and don't know what it really looked like:
Photographer Jim wrote:
Yyyep, Jim! :) It's been argued for a long time that photography can't be art because "any fool can push a button." And to some extent that's a true statement, but only as far as it goes. :D... If one were to ask a group of photographers to... (show quote)
minniev wrote:
Minnie, I think what Friend Pith originally meant to ask was the ancient, wheezing question, "How much PP do you do and why do you do it?" Here is what Pith originally (pithily) said::thumbup: :thumbup: I agree. br br Such "c... (show quote)
pith wrote:
That's pretty much self explanatory, no? "How much PP do you do and why do you do it?" :mrgreen:... Ok, lets see what camp everyone here falls into, and what the thinking, and reasons are. :lol: ;-) pith
pith wrote:
... it's not politics it's photography after all.
:lol: ;) pith
:lol: ;) pith
May 5, 2015 15:40:11 #
CaltechNerd wrote:
I would also reject the premise. You say you want... (show quote)
You know it's pretty clear from the opening post that I intended this thread for people to express why they do like to process a lot, or don't. The idea was for everyone to give their reasoning, and why they do or don't agree with my premise. Most were quite content to do exactly that, but an increasing number thought it would be more fun to turn it into a vitriolic food fight. I'm older than many here, and I miss the days when you could kid around with these sorts of discussions without it turning into a tedious opportunity for those that insist you agree or else. It's their own loss because these discussions can be fun without those who seem to think getting nasty if you disagree is the way to go. In any event I'm undeterred, and will try to ignore those that clearly are more interested in fighting than discussing.
;) pith
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