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Metric Measurement
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Nov 6, 2023 10:03:33   #
aphelps Loc: Central Ohio
 
OldCADuser wrote:
Speaking of Metric versus Imperial units (I worked 14 years for an American subsidiary of a British company and we were never allowed to refer to it as the 'English System') we had a sort of joke where I went to engineering school. At the time, this was back in the late 60's - early 70's, a US highway, US-41, bisected the the campus of MTU (Michigan Technological University), resulting in about half the classrooms being on one side and the rest on the other. Now I'm sure that no one planned it this way, but the buildings where you had your math, physics, chemistry, etc, classes were on the West side of US-41 while most all of the buildings where you took your engineering classes were on the East side. Now in those days, virtually all of the so-called 'science' curriculums, like physics and chemistry, were taught using the Metric System, while most all of the engineering classes were taught using the Imperial System. So the joke was that as you crossed the highway, you had to reset your thinking, from one set of units to another.

Today, students at the school, while I'm sure that there's still a mix of Metric and Imperial units being used in the different classrooms and labs, the 'joke' about crossing the highway is no longer relevant as they rerouted US-41 so that now most all of the academic buildings are on the same side of the highway and all but one of the dorms are now on the other side. If nothing else, it's a lot safer getting from one class to another than it was when I was a student there, although getting to your dorm could still be a bit tricky.
Speaking of Metric versus Imperial units (I worked... (show quote)


Here is a handy conversion chart.

Attached file:
(Download)

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Nov 6, 2023 10:12:18   #
jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY
 
Reuss Griffiths wrote:
The problem with switching to metric is that it's in for a penny, in for a pound (so to speak). It not just linear measures or volumes, it's temperature, pressure, torque, ad infinitum. People may be willing to switch on linear and volume but it would be overwhelming to change them all.


The general conclusion is that it would be too expensive for us to switch completely.

I find it amusing that English people online still use inches, feet, and miles occasionally.

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Nov 6, 2023 13:01:40   #
goofybruce
 
Longshadow wrote:
'cept rulers/tapes in the US are not marked in tenths of inches.....
Converting to decimal inches just makes it more difficult to work with.

Like speed in furlongs per fortnight.


are we measuring racing horses or snails?? /s

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Nov 6, 2023 13:37:26   #
jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY
 
goofybruce wrote:
are we measuring racing horses or snails?? /s


That reminds me of a funny sign I want to photograph.

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Nov 6, 2023 15:30:02   #
jlg1000 Loc: Uruguay / South America
 
The real reason the US does not change is not (just) because of cost... but because they don't really need to.

It happens that the US have a very small foreign industrialized goods market compared to it's internal market. So US cars are manufactured in the US and sold and maintained in the US... No need to change anything.

On the other hand the rest of the countries have smaller economies, so they have to interchange more... so they have to use the IS (international system)

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Nov 6, 2023 15:46:02   #
OldCADuser Loc: Irvine, CA
 
While I can't comment on other car manufacturers, since I only have direct knowledge with respect to GM and it's engineers, but GM went Metric years ago. The big hold-up in the US is aerospace and the reason for that is that most aerospace companies are also customers of the Pentagon, which means the federal government, and since the US is not officially on the Metric system, most government contracts are still based on the Imperial System.

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Nov 6, 2023 15:47:25   #
aphelps Loc: Central Ohio
 
jlg1000 wrote:
The real reason the US does not change is not (just) because of cost... but because they don't really need to.

It happens that the US have a very small foreign industrialized goods market compared to it's internal market. So US cars are manufactured in the US and sold and maintained in the US... No need to change anything.

On the other hand the rest of the countries have smaller economies, so they have to interchange more... so they have to use the IS (international system)

Wouldn't cars manufactured in US for export be metric?

E

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Nov 6, 2023 15:54:27   #
jlg1000 Loc: Uruguay / South America
 
aphelps wrote:
Wouldn't cars manufactured in US for export be metric?

E


I've travelled to many countries, and found almost no US car

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Nov 6, 2023 16:45:57   #
chrissybabe Loc: New Zealand
 
jlg1000 wrote:
The real reason the US does not change is not (just) because of cost... but because they don't really need to..........

None so blind as those who cannot open their eyes.
Most (not all but MOST) of your industrial machinery is made overseas now. The factories who make it have to make two sets of machines - one for the US only because of your supposed need for Imperial measurements and the other for the rest of the world (and 2 types of packaging etc). This means they cannot reach the same economies of scale. If they made only one type of machine then their cost of manufacture per machine would be cheaper. So the US stubbornness is actually costing us all, including you, more per item. In a society that seems to value low prices more than most I would think you DO have a reason or need to change. Even for something like a hammer, which has no specific inherent metric or Imperial details, still requires different packaging for the US market. So higher costs.

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Nov 6, 2023 17:10:10   #
petrochemist Loc: UK
 
Bridges wrote:
What you say is true, but I was thinking of the millions of buildings and homes that are already in place. Yes, starting from scratch it would be easier to use metric but retrofitting things to older standards would be a nightmare!


We did it for most things in the UK back when I was a child. I still use both systems & the only time I've found it a pain has been buying 1/4" pipe ferrules only to get a mix of 1/4" & 6mm. These look pretty similar but are definitely not compatible - no way can you get a gas tight seal with the wrong one.

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Nov 6, 2023 17:27:06   #
petrochemist Loc: UK
 
Vaun's photography wrote:
While A4 might be shorter than 8.5 x 11, and be accepted by most countries, there is no obvious logic to indicate what the dimensions are. One must memorize each of those designations. Most people don't relish change. How the Ax system came to be so popular is beyond my comprehension.


Actually the logic comes when you change scale A3 is twice A4, yet still the same ratio, The same when going from A3 to A2, A1, A0 or smaller sizes like A5, A6...
The other bit of logic Is not so well known A0 has an area of 1m2 (so A1 is 0.5m2, A2 is 0.25m2, A3 is 0.125m2...)

Using the ANSI sizes going from Letter to Ledger (double the area) the ratio of sides changes so you can't simply enlarge the artwork. There have been quite a few photos I've printed in both A3 & A4, no need to select a different crop.

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Nov 6, 2023 17:40:51   #
OldCADuser Loc: Irvine, CA
 
jlg1000 wrote:
I've travelled to many countries, and found almost no US car


My first time in Moscow, I was driven from and to the airport in a nice new Cadillac sedan. Granted, we were sharing office space with the local GM sales office and they had put their driver at our disposal.

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Nov 6, 2023 18:37:29   #
jlg1000 Loc: Uruguay / South America
 
chrissybabe wrote:
None so blind as those who cannot open their eyes.
Most (not all but MOST) of your industrial machinery is made overseas now. The factories who make it have to make two sets of machines - one for the US only because of your supposed need for Imperial measurements and the other for the rest of the world (and 2 types of packaging etc). This means they cannot reach the same economies of scale. If they made only one type of machine then their cost of manufacture per machine would be cheaper. So the US stubbornness is actually costing us all, including you, more per item. In a society that seems to value low prices more than most I would think you DO have a reason or need to change. Even for something like a hammer, which has no specific inherent metric or Imperial details, still requires different packaging for the US market. So higher costs.
None so blind as those who cannot open their eyes.... (show quote)


Absolutely true.

My argument is rather the opposite: according to https://data.worldbank.org/share/widget?indicators=NE.EXP.GNFS.ZS&locations=US" width='450' height='300' frameBorder='0' scrolling="no" ></iframe>" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><iframe src="https://data.worldbank.org/share/widget?indicators=NE.EXP.GNFS.ZS&locations=US" width='450' height='300' frameBorder='0' scrolling="no" ></iframe>, the exports market if the US accounts to about 10% of it's GDP... and that are mostly services, like banking software, etc.

"US" cars that are exported to South America are mostly made in Mexico. Dodge, Chrysler and Jeep were purchased by Fiat and are made in Brazil..

So the US is mostly a closed economy, so they stubbornly insist in that *very expensive* outdated system.

Like 110V, it is a huge waste of money... but it is what it is. I've got 25kW input at 400V three phase current at home with just 6mm2 cables (AWG 10). Make the calculation for 110V

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Nov 6, 2023 19:19:10   #
mikee
 
BebuLamar wrote:
I don't know but the switch to metric never happened was because the majority of the American people don't want it. If you take a survey the majority of American do not want metric.


The MAJORITY can't read a tape measure and subtract 11 and 5/8" from 18 and 7/16"; follow a cooking recipe with ounces, cups, tablespoons, and teaspoons; or calculate 41 pounds 12 ounces minus 18 pounds 15 ounces.

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Nov 6, 2023 19:37:38   #
alberio Loc: Casa Grande AZ
 
mikee wrote:
The MAJORITY can't read a tape measure and subtract 11 and 5/8" from 18 and 7/16"; follow a cooking recipe with ounces, cups, tablespoons, and teaspoons; or calculate 41 pounds 12 ounces minus 18 pounds 15 ounces.


It's the cross we must bear. I'm happy to bear it.

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