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A complex question
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Nov 10, 2021 17:38:30   #
bertloomis Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
 
The guy that handed him the "cold" gun is at fault.

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Nov 10, 2021 17:49:58   #
edrobinsonjr Loc: Boise, Idaho
 
k2edm wrote:
I could be talked out of it I guess, I just wanted to throw that on the table... realistically, those people are told what to do, say and maybe even think so it is really unfair to hold them to real world standards, no? and as far as blanks on a movie set, I am not sure but the guns are probably loaded with smoke making ammunition, (for effect) as real guns use "smokeless" powder so the actors probably expect the firearms to be loaded with ammunition (blanks) and w/o a bullet, therefore "clearing" a movie set weapon is meaningless....
I could be talked out of it I guess, I just wanted... (show quote)


Actually I pretty much agree with you...

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Nov 10, 2021 19:02:19   #
therwol Loc: USA
 
khildy wrote:
Guess my question is why in the world are there live rounds on a movie set. Blanks can still put the hurt on you.


There have been reports that some of the crew were shooting real guns for "fun" outside of filming hours. Was one of those the gun that Baldwin used? Left loaded? I think that more details will come to us over time.

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Nov 10, 2021 19:04:35   #
jaymatt Loc: Alexandria, Indiana
 
Agree. Unfortunately, since he’s a celebrity, probably nothing will come of it.

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Nov 10, 2021 19:08:26   #
anotherview Loc: California
 
Well said: "Basic things like never pointing a gun at anything you don't intend to shoot, every firearm is treated as loaded even when you know that it's not, keeping your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot, and proper methods of loading and unloading should be basic knowledge for everyone if we want to prevent accidents like these."
Bison Bud wrote:
Geese, folks that can't even tell the difference in a blank round and real ammunition playing with guns has to be a problem at some point. Live rounds and real guns on a movie set are also a really bad idea, but the real problem here is that folks with no firearms instruction and/or experience are handling/playing with firearms not to mention most of them are "Anti-gunners" in the first place. Frankly, everyone should receive basic firearms instruction and I think it should be included in our schools for the sake of everyone's safety, but we all know that will never happen! Basic things like never pointing a gun at anything you don't intend to shoot, every firearm is treated as loaded even when you know that it's not, keeping your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot, and proper methods of loading and unloading should be basic knowledge for everyone if we want to prevent accidents like these.

Anyway, the ultimate responsibility for this accident would fall on Alex Baldwin since he was the one playing with the loaded gun. He broke all the basic rules, simply because someone told him the gun was "Cold!" He not only took their word for it without checking, but pointed the gun at another person and pulled the trigger. Yes, ultimately an accident, but still criminal negligence to say the least, since this shooting was entirely preventable using some common sense. Instead he was playing with a loaded gun and they weren't even filming at the time! Baldwin should be charged and ultimately convicted of at least involuntary manslaughter for his irresponsible actions. There are others that were also criminally negligent and they too should be charged, but the ultimate responsibility is his and being a celebrity or rich and famous should not give him a free pass! He should rather be made an example and have to pay dearly for this criminal offense!
Geese, folks that can't even tell the difference i... (show quote)

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Nov 10, 2021 19:15:15   #
2Dragons Loc: The Back of Beyond
 
Seems to me that these movie sets with firearms have to have a person who is licensed to be in charge of all firearms to make sure that this sort of things does not happen. Not every actor or actress is going to be fully vetted on the handling of firearms. The one in charge of firearms is the one who loads them and hands them off to the actor/actress. Why is this person not responsible in some way?

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Nov 10, 2021 19:20:48   #
anotherview Loc: California
 
This accident leaves little to quibble about. The parties will likely stipulate that AB violated gun safety, aimed a loaded gun at another, pointed the gun at another, pulled its trigger, and thus shot and killed the victim.

Importantly, with the facts we know, we can say that AB never intended to murder the victim. AB shot and killed the victim by accident.

I sense that AB will take a plea to a lesser crime and perhaps pay a substantial fine.

We shall see.
jaymatt wrote:
Agree. Unfortunately, since he’s a celebrity, probably nothing will come of it.

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Nov 10, 2021 20:32:43   #
sourdough58 Loc: Maine
 
I am an NRA Life member, I am a certified NRA Instructor for 6 disciplines, NRA Home Firearms Safety, NRA Basic Pistol, NRA Basic Shotgun, NRA Basic Rifle, NRA Personal Protection Courses, and Refuse to be a victim program also Maine State certified Master instructor trapping, hunter safety rifle, bow and State-certified range officer. 1. ALWAYS KEEP YOUR FIREARM POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION.


 2. TREAT ALL FIREARMS AS IF THEY WERE LOADED.


 3. KEEP YOUR TRIGGER FINGER OUTSIDE THE GUARD AND OFF OF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOU ARE READY TO FIRE.

4. BE CERTAIN OF YOUR TARGET, YOUR LINE OF FIRE, AND WHAT LIES BEYOND YOUR TARGET.
If anyone passes you a firearm, keeping it pointed in a safe direction, open the action and make absolutely sure that it is unloaded.
If the gun is in YOUR HAND you are responsible for whatever happens, shooting a person is NOT an accident, it is either deliberately with purpose or deliberately callous, the results are the same.

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Nov 10, 2021 21:30:57   #
cwp3420
 
Manglesphoto wrote:
With a simple answer.
Who is at fault in Alex Baldwin's firearm incident
I am talking about adults.
I guess I should give my answer.
The only person at fault is the person that pulled the trigger!!! No one else!!!
All guns Are loaded until YOU clear them!!!
If you don't know how to clear a weapon LEAVE IT ALONE!!!


Alec Baldwin. He should have checked the revolver regardless of what he was told.

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Nov 10, 2021 21:34:40   #
cwp3420
 
Longshadow wrote:
So, how many actors, do you think, are fully trained in the use of firearms? All off them who use them in scenes?

Were they doing a dry run to see how it looked in the camera before committing the scene?

I can't see where there would EVER be a need to have live rounds on a movie set. None at all.
If they need loose rounds with bullets for effect, they can mount the bullet in a powder-less cartridge, with a dummy primer.


You only point a firearm at something you’re willing to destroy. Do you suppose Baldwin wanted to kill the lady?

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Nov 10, 2021 21:37:31   #
cwp3420
 
Longshadow wrote:
The prop person who provides a gun to an actor is responsible for making sure that it is safe for the actor to use in a scene, no matter the actor's expertise/proficiency or lack thereof.


The prop person didn’t shoot the revolver and kill someone, Alec Baldwin did. If the firearm had lain there all day, would it have killed anyone?

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Nov 10, 2021 21:38:39   #
cwp3420
 
Longshadow wrote:
Trust issues?
Some have to have the magazines unloaded to see if the rounds are real or not.
Are all actors capable of doing that? Are they capable of reloading the magazine?


The revolver did not have a magazine. You sound as knowledgeable as Baldwin when it comes to firearms.

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Nov 10, 2021 21:41:49   #
cwp3420
 
Bob Smith wrote:
Bull


Why would you say that?

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Nov 10, 2021 21:49:46   #
cwp3420
 
bertloomis wrote:
The guy that handed him the "cold" gun is at fault.


Did the guy that handed him the gun point it at the videographer and pull the trigger too?

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Nov 10, 2021 23:11:13   #
anotherview Loc: California
 
Yep.
cwp3420 wrote:
Alec Baldwin. He should have checked the revolver regardless of what he was told.

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