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Walter Cronkite
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Sep 14, 2021 12:23:16   #
Jay Pat Loc: Round Rock, Texas, USA
 
"You were there" series when I was in school.
His daughter (Kathy?) was a talk show host in the Austin, Texas market years ago.

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Sep 14, 2021 12:51:16   #
Canisdirus
 
TriX wrote:
I was in DaNang, and you seem to forget that during Tet, Saigon, DaNang, Hue City, Khe Sanh and dozens of regional capitals were attacked. It wasn’t just the journalists that were surprised, the American commanders and troops were surprised also because no one thought they could launch such a coordinated offensive. No question the North lost many more men than us, but just like other wars (Afghanistan comes to mind) where we have spent years training and supporting a besieged government, the ARVNs were incapable of holding back the north or winning the support of the majority of the populous and crumbled as soon as we pulled out.

The American military is the finest in the world, but we have a tough time fighting an asymmetrical war on foreign soil when the local military and government cannot defend themselves. This has been proven time and time again.

And since this thread has morphed into a debate on VietNam, let me tell you a personal story. While in DaNang, I became acquainted with an ARVN Officer. One Monday morning, I was in downtown DaNang and drove him to his unit’s Monday morning formation. I was amazed at how large the company was - maybe 150 men. When I remarked on this to the officer, he said: “most only come to Monday morning formation and then go back to their jobs and lives - we really only have about 25 full time soldiers”. If the ARVNs had been as dedicated to their cause as the NVA, VC and “uncle Ho”, the war might have had a different ending.
I was in DaNang, and you seem to forget that durin... (show quote)


Why would you assume I forgot about the targets?
The TET offensive was system wide with many objectives...they failed at every one of them...with heavy losses.

Vietnam was not lost at the military level. It was lost by the politicians who from the get go held the military back with insane rules of conflict (sound familiar today?).

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Sep 14, 2021 13:49:43   #
Retired CPO Loc: Travel full time in an RV
 
Canisdirus wrote:
Why would you assume I forgot about the targets?
The TET offensive was system wide with many objectives...they failed at every one of them...with heavy losses.

Vietnam was not lost at the military level. It was lost by the politicians who from the get go held the military back with insane rules of conflict (sound familiar today?).


exactly!!!

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Sep 14, 2021 13:55:18   #
Smudgey Loc: Ohio, Calif, Now Arizona
 
Walter was great and I never missed his news cast. His reporting of JFK's death is something that I will never forget. I believe today still has good reporting if you care enough to get your news from reliable sources but not Social Media. Unfortunatly many people do. Yes NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX, CNN, and PBS have their biases, but for the most part still do a good job reporting.

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Sep 14, 2021 14:15:05   #
Retired CPO Loc: Travel full time in an RV
 
Retired CPO wrote:
exactly!!!
img src="https://static.uglyhedgehog.com/images/s... (show quote)


And on top of that, at the Paris Peace Accords when the cease fire was negotiated, both North and South Vietnam were allowed to rebuild their military capacity to the point of self defense. The NVA did that with the help of China. The democrat controlled U.S. government refused to comply with the agreement and refused to assist South Vietnam in rebuilding to the same level. Because of that South Vietnam was caught flatfooted without the means of self defense which resulted in the fall of Saigon and the later slaughter of hundreds of thousands of South Vietnamese. THAT was the disgrace of the Viet Nam War! And no one remembers that!

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Sep 14, 2021 14:21:06   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
Canisdirus wrote:
Why would you assume I forgot about the targets?
The TET offensive was system wide with many objectives...they failed at every one of them...with heavy losses.

Vietnam was not lost at the military level. It was lost by the politicians who from the get go held the military back with insane rules of conflict (sound familiar today?).


In my opinion (and it is only that), the VC and NVA were more dedicated to victory than the ARVNs. As I have said previously, I think we have the finest, best trained and best equipped military in the world for a conventional war, but that wasn’t the war we were fighting. Short of staying there forever, or invading the north or using nuclear weapons, how do you think it would have been won? What else would you have thrown at it? We had F4s, Skyraiders, Hueys, Cobras, a variety of other choppers, gunships, tanks, B52s, Swift Boats, Hawk missiles, artillery, 500,000 men and even the USS New jersey firing from off shore and bombing Hanoi with B52s as I’m sure you know. We defoliated their supply routes, and we still just held the north at bay, and the minute we were gone, the ARVNs folded. What EXACTLY do you mean when you say the military was held back?

What actually happens is when a President or Military leadership inherits a war they tell each other and the public what they want to hear - we’re winning and it’s ultimately winnable if we just escalate it. But eventually, the truth comes out, is reported by the press, the country loses support for the war, we get out, and everything goes back to the way it was going before we got involved, but tens of thousands of our finest lose their lives.

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Sep 14, 2021 14:24:17   #
TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC
 
U
Retired CPO wrote:
And on top of that, at the Paris Peace Accords when the cease fire was negotiated, both North and South Vietnam were allowed to rebuild their military capacity to the point of self defense. The NVA did that with the help of China. The democrat controlled U.S. government refused to comply with the agreement and refused to assist South Vietnam in rebuilding to the same level. Because of that South Vietnam was caught flatfooted without the means of self defense which resulted in the fall of Saigon and the later slaughter of hundreds of thousands of South Vietnamese. THAT was the disgrace of the Viet Nam War! And no one remembers that!
And on top of that, at the Paris Peace Accords whe... (show quote)


And let’s not forget the history of VietNam. After being occupied by the French and the Japanese, Ho Chi Minh came to the US and asked for help, but in our wisdom, we turned him down, essentially sending him into the arms of China and Russia. We had our chance and picked the wrong (corrupt) leader. It’s certainly not the first time we’ve picked the wrong side in a regional civil war. In that respect, I agree it’s the politicians that lost the war, not in 1968, but much earlier. You just cannot promote Democracy with a people that are not ready for it and unwilling to fight for it - our history is replete with multiple examples of failed attempts (Chile, Cuba, Iraq, Afghanistan, VietNam)

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Sep 14, 2021 14:33:44   #
vpeek1947 Loc: Louisville, Ky
 
I used him as an example in a college history class - I labeled him “ Grandfather of truth” my professor asked if he could use that.

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Sep 14, 2021 15:10:39   #
pendennis
 
TriX wrote:
U

And let’s not forget the history of VietNam. After being occupied by the French and the Japanese, Ho Chi Minh came to the US and asked for help, but in our wisdom, we turned him down, essentially sending him into the arms of China and Russia. We had our chance and picked the wrong (corrupt) leader. It’s certainly not the first time we’ve picked the wrong side in a regional civil war. In that respect, I agree it’s the politicians that lost the war, not in 1968, but much earlier. You just cannot promote Democracy with a people that are not ready for it and unwilling to fight for it - our history is replete with multiple examples of failed attempts (Chile, Cuba, Iraq, Afghanistan, VietNam)
U br br And let’s not forget the history of VietN... (show quote)


I got a chance to read some of Walter McDougall's writings on Viet Nam. He posited that Kennedy/Johnson split their advisors essentially into Tories and Whigs. The Tories believed we should smash the enemy, allow for not so good government until victory was won, and the Whigs believed we should win "the hearts and minds" of the Vietnamese people, and convince them that good government would be able to beat the insurgency and North Viet Nam. The Tories had the right idea, because there wasn't enough time to stall the insurgency. However, there was constant push/pull from LBJ's advisors, and also the incessant meddling of LBJ himself. It was also the first war the U.S. entered where the goal wasn't to defeat the enemy first.

The Tonkin Gulf Resolution was Congress' way of not having to declare war. What cowards!!

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Sep 14, 2021 15:35:33   #
classic320
 
We called him "The Oracle" and he had a hold on the news that no one else has ever had, kind of like Alex Trebek had on Jeapardy--no one else was as trusted, though the other networks had very good reporters and anchors. I feel that the major network news is still pretty good and balanced. I could get along just fine without the very biased "only the news as you want to hear it" outlets. I did see Cronkite once in person--I was circumnavigating Martha's Vineyard and saw his sail boat being single-handed not far from Edgartown and he was at the helm with his characteristic pipe!

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Sep 14, 2021 15:50:42   #
Jandjeby14
 
Yes, I remember Cronkite with great appreciation. But he worked in a vary different environment. News once a day with time to develop facts and perspective rather than reporting instantaneously, politicians who could fight during the day and go out for dinner with families together in the evening, a less politicized supreme court, no social media to construct and nurture conspiracy theories, congress that had votes which were not completely along party lines, a recognition of a role for government to recover from the war by helping other countries and internal recovery programs, and recognition of the need for things which serve us all like the interstate highway system. Remember that corporate taxes were quite high during the Regan years.

Am i just being nostalgic? Or have there been some deep changes in our social and political systems which make it difficult to find common ground?

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Sep 14, 2021 16:05:14   #
therwol Loc: USA
 
Jandjeby14 wrote:
Or have there been some deep changes in our social and political systems which make it difficult to find common ground?


I believe so. Politicians are mostly concerned with getting elected and staying in power, and if they waiver from the opinions of the people they consider to be their base, they may be toast. Opinions in our population seem extreme and polarized now, and politicians put those ahead of any reasoning or compromise.

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Sep 14, 2021 16:12:49   #
Bill_R Loc: Southeastern Wisconsin
 
One of my favorite journalists!

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Sep 14, 2021 16:29:44   #
Glenn Harve
 
TriX wrote:
When news outlets didn’t have an agenda and just reported the news.


I understand why one brings this up such time fogged "reminiss missing". But it doesnt fix the f'in fix we are in. Negate the fact that many of chronkites "commarades" took us here.

We are not far away from cameras being seized, along with all of our Constitutional God given rights. We must all call out the fundamental issue here. Its easy to see, for those with the intelligence and honesty to do so. The first things "they" do are erase history, create cultural hatred and division, seize guns, and indoctrinate the youth. Pick any one and FIGHT! Realize which party and fight. Speak up loudly, while you still can. Those who try to silence you are the enemy. Its simple.

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Sep 14, 2021 16:35:25   #
Manglesphoto Loc: 70 miles south of St.Louis
 
TriX wrote:
When news outlets didn’t have an agenda and just reported the news.



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