How to reconcile Sunny 16 rule with reciprocal rule for shutter speed for long lens?
Dec 3, 2019 20:45:07 #
nadelewitz
Loc: Ithaca NY
YNY wrote:
Silly question but one that has been bugging me. I understand the Sunny 16 guideline (Example: For bright sun and ISO 100 use f16 at 1/100 second). How does this apply to using a long lens (300mm for example) where the recommended minimum shutter speed would be 1/300 second or faster? Does one compensate with a larger aperture? Use a faster ISO? No need to compensate? What am I not seeing? I have searched for an answer without luck. Thank you.
The Sunny 16 rule has nothing to do with focal length, and doesn't change with different length lenses. Why is there a question here?
Dec 3, 2019 20:47:24 #
nadelewitz wrote:
Why is there a question here?
Probably because the OP didn't know the answer,
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Dec 3, 2019 21:00:51 #
nadelewitz
Loc: Ithaca NY
Bill_de wrote:
Probably because the OP didn't know the answer,
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My point exactly. There isn't a question here, so he doesn't know the answer.
Dec 3, 2019 21:02:11 #
The day-2 contributors are always the most useful UHH community members when they only get as far as page 1 of 5 ....
Dec 3, 2019 21:21:41 #
nadelewitz wrote:
My point exactly. There isn't a question here, so he doesn't know the answer.
I thought It was a good question. I think exposure reciprocity was the answer to how different combinations of shutter speed and aperture can all be sunny 16.
Dec 3, 2019 21:39:42 #
nadelewitz wrote:
The Sunny 16 rule has nothing to do with focal length, and doesn't change with different length lenses. Why is there a question here?
The way the Sunny 16 is stated, the shutter speed is chosen to be 1/ISO. But the OP needs higher shutter speed because he uses long focal length lenses. Thus he needs to know how to change the aperture so he can use higher shutter speed.
Dec 3, 2019 22:56:55 #
The f/16 is not "stupid" as someone has suggested, it's just very rudimentary and basic- nothing wrong with that! It's too bad that more folks who are taking up photography nowadays don't start off with some of the simple rudiments instead of approaching their new craft as if they were attempting to learn how to fly an Airbus A-389 and the controls on the camera and the data in the viewfinder resemble that on the instrument panel on the flight deck of the aforementioned aircraft!
Think of this; the first thing you learn via the f/16 rule is to recognize various weather-related light conditions, bright sunlight, hazy sunlight. cloudy-bright, overcast, and back-lighting. While you are at it, you begin to appreciate theses lightnings, not only from an exposure standpoint but how they influence the mood of the resulting image and how they cause the subject to be rendered as to texture, modeling, dimension, color or tonal qualities and direction. You are forced to examine and assess light AND light aesthetics- ain't any meter that can do that! You develop basic working disciplines.
If you forget your meter, if it dies or malfunctions, or if you think your metering system is acting funny, you can always set your camera manually and end up well into the ballpark. In fact, how can you tell if your meter is wonky or if your camera (or you) are sampling light from the wrong zone? Answer- If the exposure readout does no make sense as per the basic rule.
I can recall, as a kid, shooting Kodachrome ISO (ASA) 16 and later on 25 with hardly any latitude, following the instruction sheet and getting 36 out of 36 accurate exposures. After a while, you develop a built-in exposure meter in your head-using your eyes. You can even learn to compensate for strange lightnings and for subjects of extreme reflectance properties.
Why is it that so many folks, right here on this site, complain about exposure inaccurate or erratic exposure despite the fact that they have the most sophisticated cameras and top-of-the-line exposure meters? Sometimes those systems need some expert second-guessing!
Long lenses? The focal length/shutter speed rule is essentially for hand-holding the camera so as to avoid camera movement causing blur. If, however, the camera is mounted on a tripod and the subject is not moving about rapidly or is completely static, you can certainly shoot at a slower shutter speed if required. Some experienced shooters use monopods, gun-stock grips and other means to steady the camera with long lenses and get away with slower than recommended shutter speeds. The focal length/shutter speed rule has nothing to do with accurate exposure, only with blur avoidance.
Of course you can use any of your camera's automatic features, built-in metering, you can employ handheld metering and you can chimp to your heart's content and consult the histographic data after each shot to assess your exposure and even auto bracket but all that does not negate the basics or time-honored methods that you can use if there is no time to calculate so you can simply preset and easily capture the action.
Think of this; the first thing you learn via the f/16 rule is to recognize various weather-related light conditions, bright sunlight, hazy sunlight. cloudy-bright, overcast, and back-lighting. While you are at it, you begin to appreciate theses lightnings, not only from an exposure standpoint but how they influence the mood of the resulting image and how they cause the subject to be rendered as to texture, modeling, dimension, color or tonal qualities and direction. You are forced to examine and assess light AND light aesthetics- ain't any meter that can do that! You develop basic working disciplines.
If you forget your meter, if it dies or malfunctions, or if you think your metering system is acting funny, you can always set your camera manually and end up well into the ballpark. In fact, how can you tell if your meter is wonky or if your camera (or you) are sampling light from the wrong zone? Answer- If the exposure readout does no make sense as per the basic rule.
I can recall, as a kid, shooting Kodachrome ISO (ASA) 16 and later on 25 with hardly any latitude, following the instruction sheet and getting 36 out of 36 accurate exposures. After a while, you develop a built-in exposure meter in your head-using your eyes. You can even learn to compensate for strange lightnings and for subjects of extreme reflectance properties.
Why is it that so many folks, right here on this site, complain about exposure inaccurate or erratic exposure despite the fact that they have the most sophisticated cameras and top-of-the-line exposure meters? Sometimes those systems need some expert second-guessing!
Long lenses? The focal length/shutter speed rule is essentially for hand-holding the camera so as to avoid camera movement causing blur. If, however, the camera is mounted on a tripod and the subject is not moving about rapidly or is completely static, you can certainly shoot at a slower shutter speed if required. Some experienced shooters use monopods, gun-stock grips and other means to steady the camera with long lenses and get away with slower than recommended shutter speeds. The focal length/shutter speed rule has nothing to do with accurate exposure, only with blur avoidance.
Of course you can use any of your camera's automatic features, built-in metering, you can employ handheld metering and you can chimp to your heart's content and consult the histographic data after each shot to assess your exposure and even auto bracket but all that does not negate the basics or time-honored methods that you can use if there is no time to calculate so you can simply preset and easily capture the action.
Dec 4, 2019 00:02:03 #
CHG_CANON wrote:
Imagine your life as a successful photographer. What type of phone are you holding?
One that’s constantly ringing with gig offers.
Dec 4, 2019 00:05:09 #
selmslie wrote:
That's about all I can smell from the chemicals these days and I have to get close to the liquids to notice.
Many years ago there were smellier chemicals and my nose was more sensitive.
Many years ago there were smellier chemicals and my nose was more sensitive.
The chemicals that LR and PS use are odorless.
Dec 4, 2019 03:08:37 #
Dec 4, 2019 05:43:33 #
Dec 4, 2019 05:48:49 #
Photocraig wrote:
What you're looking for is the equivalent exposure... (show quote)
If you are using 1/focal length with a 600mm lens, stabilization will be far less effective, and in some cases actually create blur. On Nikons, VR is intended for use at longer than 1/500 sec. The aperture fstop sequence is 1, 1.4, 2, 2.8, 4, 5.6, 8, 11, 16, 22, 32 - at least that's what every lens I have ever owned or used is labeled. Which lens do you have?
Dec 4, 2019 05:58:37 #
Bill 45 wrote:
Don't hand hold a camera with a lens over 200mm. Use 400 speed film for pictures using a lens over 300mm.
Well, that makes no sense at all.
This was taken with a 600mm stabilized lens (Sigma Sport), using a D800, hand held at ISO 400, F8 and 1/25 sec. Boy, am I glad I didn't read YOUR advice before taking that shot.
Dec 4, 2019 09:14:38 #
Gene51 wrote:
If you are using 1/focal length with a 600mm lens, stabilization will be far less effective, and in some cases actually create blur. On Nikons, VR is intended for use at longer than 1/500 sec. The aperture fstop sequence is 1, 1.4, 2, 2.8, 4, 5.6, 8, 11, 16, 22, 32 - at least that's what every lens I have ever owned or used is labeled. Which lens do you have?
I remember 1 and 1.4 and walk the rest up by doubling each pair. 1 and 1.4 doubled is 2 and 2.8, that doubled is 4 and 5.6, etc. Except for that pesky rounding at 11. This works because double any f number is 1/4 the exposure, not telling you anything new, but thought it was interesting.
Of course it's not that hard to memorize but shows a cool relationship/pattern anyway.
Dec 4, 2019 11:48:56 #
nadelewitz
Loc: Ithaca NY
bleirer wrote:
I thought It was a good question. I think exposure reciprocity was the answer to how different combinations of shutter speed and aperture can all be sunny 16.
And as already said here, the focal length of the lens has no effect on the Sunny 16 Rule. Have you not read anything?
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