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What's with this 'new' retro-look...
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Sep 25, 2023 03:55:21   #
mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey
 
larryepage wrote:
Some of their literature also specifically referred to it as a "fashion camera." I don't think it means any one thing. Whatwver it seems to mean in English is likely not at all what it would mean in other languages.


The only use of that term I have seen is from detractors. I do not believe Nikon ever used it. If you have a link to Nikon documentation which uses that term, I would appreciate it if you could post it.

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Sep 25, 2023 07:57:38   #
Harry02 Loc: Gardena, CA
 
If I want "retro" I'll bring out my Iskra, or my Zeiss.
Reading a few reviews, my D600 seems to be better.
A lot of the DF seems to be a collection of left over parts.
I'd rather have a D780, especially at that price.

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Sep 25, 2023 08:06:24   #
larryepage Loc: North Texas area
 
mwsilvers wrote:
The only use of that term I have seen is from detractors. I do not believe Nikon ever used it. If you have a link to Nikon documentation which uses that term, I would appreciate it if you could post it.


It was in one of the early online brochures on NikonUSA's website. May or may not still be there somewhere.

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Sep 25, 2023 16:37:44   #
mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey
 
larryepage wrote:
It was in one of the early online brochures on NikonUSA's website. May or may not still be there somewhere.


I was one of the first Z fc users. I preordered mine and it was shipped a day or two after B&H got their first order in. I was all over everything available about this camera including Nikon's USA site. I have spent the last two years of scouring the internet for anything relating to this body and I have never seen any Nikon literature defining the "fc" as "fashion camera" which would be a really negative reference suggesting that it is some sort of a fashion accessory. The official Nikon Nikon release announcement said the following regarding "fc":

"The letter "f" in the Z fc's name is a reference to models with symbolic importance in Nikon's history, while also being inspired by the word "fusion," representing the coming together of tactile precision mechanics and high image quality. The letter "c", meanwhile, conveys Nikon's wish for this camera, with all its inherited tradition, to be used by anyone, anywhere, "casually"."

https://www.nikon.com/company/news/2021/0629_mirrorless_01.html

While I assume you saw that designation somewhere, I doubt very much it was from Nikon.

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Sep 25, 2023 17:07:03   #
larryepage Loc: North Texas area
 
mwsilvers wrote:
I was one of the first Z fc users. I preordered mine and it was shipped a day or two after B&H got their first order in. I was all over everything available about this camera including Nikon's USA site. I have spent the last two years of scouring the internet for anything relating to this body and I have never seen any Nikon literature defining the "fc" as "fashion camera" which would be a really negative reference suggesting that it is some sort of a fashion accessory. The official Nikon Nikon release announcement said the following regarding "fc":

"The letter "f" in the Z fc's name is a reference to models with symbolic importance in Nikon's history, while also being inspired by the word "fusion," representing the coming together of tactile precision mechanics and high image quality. The letter "c", meanwhile, conveys Nikon's wish for this camera, with all its inherited tradition, to be used by anyone, anywhere, "casually"."

https://www.nikon.com/company/news/2021/0629_mirrorless_01.html

While I assume you saw that designation somewhere, I doubt very much it was from Nikon.
I was one of the first Z fc users. I preordered mi... (show quote)


Ok. Wherever I saw it, it was an intentional reference both to the distinctively different design and the ability to color-coordinate to any outfit.

I remember noting from the original materials that the Z fc was not intended for sale to the crowd of old men haunting UHH.

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Sep 25, 2023 17:34:43   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
larryepage wrote:
I remember noting from the original materials that the Z fc was not intended for sale to the crowd of old men haunting UHH.

I doubt if Nikon would turn down sales to anyone.

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Sep 25, 2023 18:34:36   #
OldCADuser Loc: Irvine, CA
 
Speaking of camera sales, below is a pie chart showing the market shares for the major suppliers of digital cameras at the end of last year. This shows that Canon was the leader with 45.8% of the market with Sony at 27% and Nikon at 11.3%, with Fujifilm and Panasonic at close to 6% and 4% respectively. Now this included both DSLR's, Mirrorless and point-and-shoot. When you look at just DSLR's, Canon has a bigger lead with 76.8% followed by Nikon at 17.2% and Ricoh (Pentax) at 5.7%. Sony isn't even listed.

But when you look at mirrorless cameras, it's an entirely different story. To start with one million more mirrorless cameras were delivered in 2022 than DSLR's (and that difference is only gotten bigger in 2023). And when looking at just the mirrorless market, Sony and Canon are virtually tied, with perhaps Sony eking out a small lead, but they both leave Nikon a distant 3rd selling less than a quarter of what either Sony or Canon does in terms of mirrorless cameras.

That being said, the overall digital 'camera' business is dropping off due primarily to people using smartphones as their primary camera, like my wife and all of our granddaughters

From Statista.com as of Novmber 2022
From Statista.com as of Novmber 2022...

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Sep 25, 2023 19:42:00   #
MrBob Loc: lookout Mtn. NE Alabama
 
OldCADuser wrote:
Speaking of camera sales, below is a pie chart showing the market shares for the major suppliers of digital cameras at the end of last year. This shows that Canon was the leader with 45.8% of the market with Sony at 27% and Nikon at 11.3%, with Fujifilm and Panasonic at close to 6% and 4% respectively. Now this included both DSLR's, Mirrorless and point-and-shoot. When you look at just DSLR's, Canon has a bigger lead with 76.8% followed by Nikon at 17.2% and Ricoh (Pentax) at 5.7%. Sony isn't even listed.

But when you look at mirrorless cameras, it's an entirely different story. To start with one million more mirrorless cameras were delivered in 2022 than DSLR's (and that difference is only gotten bigger in 2023). And when looking at just the mirrorless market, Sony and Canon are virtually tied, with perhaps Sony eking out a small lead, but they both leave Nikon a distant 3rd selling less than a quarter of what either Sony or Canon does in terms of mirrorless cameras.

That being said, the overall digital 'camera' business is dropping off due primarily to people using smartphones as their primary camera, like my wife and all of our granddaughters
Speaking of camera sales, below is a pie chart sho... (show quote)


Over 6 BILLION Phonecam users seem pretty happy.... Where would YOU put your R&D and marketing expertise...

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Sep 25, 2023 19:52:12   #
burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC
 
MrBob wrote:
Over 6 BILLION Phonecam users seem pretty happy.... Where would YOU put your R&D and marketing expertise...


The thing about the smartphone is its "Swiss Army knife" nature... It can be millions of different things, just by downloading the software applications (apps) you need. It isn't the best camera you (can) have, but it is the best camera you can have with you at all times. Even if you're out with your serious, dedicated camera, you're likely to have a smartphone with you.

What this does is make dedicated cameras into advanced tools of serious intent. If you don't have serious, advanced photographic intentions, let's face it. You don't need a dedicated camera. The cameras on the market today are getting really, REALLY good, because they have to be in order to appeal to those of us who want or need them.

Meanwhile, the smartphone market is so hot, makers have huge teams of engineers working on cameras, processors, and software to perform computational photography. The results from phone cameras are getting so good that the use cases for dedicated cameras are more and more sharply defined.

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Sep 25, 2023 20:16:47   #
MrBob Loc: lookout Mtn. NE Alabama
 
burkphoto wrote:
The thing about the smartphone is its "Swiss Army knife" nature... It can be millions of different things, just by downloading the software applications (apps) you need. It isn't the best camera you (can) have, but it is the best camera you can have with you at all times. Even if you're out with your serious, dedicated camera, you're likely to have a smartphone with you.

What this does is make dedicated cameras into advanced tools of serious intent. If you don't have serious, advanced photographic intentions, let's face it. You don't need a dedicated camera. The cameras on the market today are getting really, REALLY good, because they have to be in order to appeal to those of us who want or need them.

Meanwhile, the smartphone market is so hot, makers have huge teams of engineers working on cameras, processors, and software to perform computational photography. The results from phone cameras are getting so good that the use cases for dedicated cameras are more and more sharply defined.
The thing about the smartphone is its "Swiss ... (show quote)


Good reply Bill.... Lets revisit this subject in say 5 years and see what the "Faux " futurists have to say...

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Sep 25, 2023 20:47:22   #
OldCADuser Loc: Irvine, CA
 
Actually, I occasionally take a shot with my iPhone even when I'm out shooting with my mainline camera.

My old Sony A65 DSLR was GPS enabled where it would geo-tag the images. However, when I went mirrorless and started using my a6000 and now my a6500, that's something that I had to give up (in fact, with respect to my Sony a6500, that's about the ONLY thing that the A65 could do that it can't). So when I'm somewhere and I want to make sure I know exactly where I was when I was taking my shoots with my mainline camera, I grab my iPhone and take a shot which I'll archive with the regular images just so that I'll have a geo-tagged image for reference. It's a good habit to get into. Of course, I often don't have to worry about that as my wife will have probably taken a few shots with her iPhone and since I archive her photos along with my own, I'm usually covered without having to worry about it.

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Sep 25, 2023 21:15:31   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
OldCADuser wrote:
Actually, I occasionally take a shot with my iPhone even when I'm out shooting with my mainline camera.

I used my phone camera just the other evening. My wife took an evening Amtrak train, and my iPhone camera worked incredibly well in the near darkness.

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Sep 25, 2023 21:17:26   #
OldCADuser Loc: Irvine, CA
 
Yes, they do have very good low-light capabilities.

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Sep 25, 2023 21:19:58   #
rehess Loc: South Bend, Indiana, USA
 
OldCADuser wrote:
Yes, they do have very good low-light capabilities.

Well, they are backed by a lot of computing power.

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Sep 26, 2023 06:37:16   #
Bill_de Loc: US
 
What happens when Ai hits the SmartPhone, if it hasn't already?

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