Mirrorless EVF verses viewfinders: I generally like everything I hear about the new mirrorless cameras. One thing that bothers me, however, is the constant comments about the EFV and...

Toby

I generally like everything I hear about the new mirrorless cameras. One thing that bothers me, however, is the constant comments about the EFV and the ability to see the actual image before it is shot. I do not understand why it is different. Are you saying that the recorded image is simply electronic vs what you see in the view finder? Also, it seems to me that the EVF has no advantage in shooting rapidly changing scenes such as sports because you would need to hold the camera away from your eye to see the image. Am I missing something?
Thanks for input

Ysarex Loc: St. Louis

Toby wrote:

I generally like everything I hear about the new mirrorless cameras. One thing that bothers me, however, is the constant comments about the EFV and the ability to see the actual image before it is shot. I do not understand why it is different.

An optical viewfinder shows you the scene but gives you no indication of the exposure and processing that will be applied when you take the photo. The EVF can simulate both the exposure as well as camera picture controls that alter color and tone so that you can basically see the RGB image the camera will create when you click the shutter. WSIWIG.

Toby wrote:

Are you saying that the recorded image is simply electronic vs what you see in the view finder? Also, it seems to me that the EVF has no advantage in shooting rapidly changing scenes such as sports because you would need to hold the camera away from your eye to see the image.

You use the EVF just as you do an OVF. Both are eye-level viewfinders. There is no need to hold the camera away from your eye to see the image -- that would be the LCD on the back of the camera.

Toby wrote:

Am I missing something?
Thanks for input

User ID

Toby wrote:

I generally like everything I hear about the new m... (show quote)

Yes. You need to get your hands on one to really understand how it works.

You put your eye to the eyepiece, NOT like a phone.

As for sports, some models burst speeds are way over 30 fps. And some actually begin the recording of the burst from 30 frames BEFORE you press the button.

Jerry Green Loc: Huntsville, AL

Mirrorless cameras have viewfinders just like the DSLR cameras. It is electronic rather than done with mirrors. You do not have to use the LCD to take the photos.

rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona

My biggest gripe with EVF cameras is the lag between what happens in front of the camera and what it shows in the viewfinder.

As for seeing the adjustments and processing, I do that before I even set up the camera.
--Bob

Toby wrote:

I generally like everything I hear about the new m... (show quote)

wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado

Toby wrote:

I generally like everything I hear about the new m... (show quote)

Everything Ysarex said plus some cameras allow for no "black out" of what you are taking. There is no need for a mirror "black out" or "cutoff" with the EVF since there is no mirror. It can be set up for continuous image. Plus it allows for things like the Olympus/OMDS Pro Capture.

wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado

rmalarz wrote:

My biggest gripe with EVF cameras is the lag between what happens in front of the camera and what it shows in the viewfinder.

As for seeing the adjustments and processing, I do that before I even set up the camera.
--Bob

Interesting. I do not notice the 1/120 second lag. And besides, I use the image in the viewfinder to view the continuous action which allows basically no lag. And then there is Pro Capture for cases of doubt of when the peak action occurs.

User ID

rmalarz wrote:

My biggest gripe with EVF cameras is the lag between what happens in front of the camera and what it shows in the viewfinder.

As for seeing the adjustments and processing, I do that before I even set up the camera.
--Bob

Outdated info for users of outdated gear ... which acoarst is, overly proudly, your special specialty. Doesnt mean much to users of current gear. Basically you just provide a historical footnote.

(Download)

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

Toby wrote:

I generally like everything I hear about the new m... (show quote)

The Electronic Viewfinder (EVF) presents an eye-level preview of the scene. It has evolved since its inception into a very functional feature on mirrorless cameras. It shows the results of shutter speed and aperture adjustments and you can even have it show a histogram, along with focus peaking and overexposure warnings - all before you take the picture. These capabilities are mostly present in DSLRs, but it is mostly historically or when using Live View.

Optical viewfinders, typically found on DSLRs, also have evolved - at a glance you can see your exposure settings, exposure compensation, ISO, focus acquisition (a dot that shows when you have acquired focus), the number of images remaining, and metering mode. Cameras also can be set to show the metering area, focus points, etc.

The clear advantage that EVFs on mirrorless cameras have over OVFs on DSLRs is that there is no need to perform focus calibration. If the mirrorless camera shows something to be in focus, it simply is. When looking at a OVF, you are relying on a number of opto-mechanical components - all of which have to be perfectly calibrated - in order to get the image crisp and sharp. Deviations are quickly dealt with in the field using the ubiquitous focus shift feature that allows the photographer to make a focus shift adjustment to the entire lens - in order to get focus correct at a specific distance and in the case of zooms, a specific focal length. This feature was never intended to substitute for a proper camera calibration and a proper lens calibration - which can zero in on multiple distances and focal lengths. Anyway, this is not at all an issue with mirrorless cameras. What you see electronically is pretty much what you get - with few surprises.

As far as shooting active subjects I don't think there is a meaningful difference between them - except that in EVF you can zoom-focus, like you can in Live View - just faster and much less cumbersome.

I would say that you are missing something if you haven't tried a mirrorless camera in person.

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

rmalarz wrote:

My biggest gripe with EVF cameras is the lag between what happens in front of the camera and what it shows in the viewfinder.

As for seeing the adjustments and processing, I do that before I even set up the camera.
--Bob

It's gotten a lot better to the point that on the newest cameras there is almost zero lag. You'll see more "lag" using optical stabilization waiting for the image to settle down, than you will with the better EVFs.

User ID

Gene51 wrote:

It's gotten a lot better to the point that on the newest cameras there is almost zero lag. You'll see more "lag" using optical stabilization waiting for the image to settle down, than you will with the better EVFs.

And you dont even hafta remove the film holder see the image ;-)
.

(Download)

rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona

Gene, though that may be, it's not enough for me to transition to mirrorless. Additionally, I don't use stabilization. Only a few of my lenses have it. So, it's sort of a feature I forget I have on the lenses that have that feature.
--Bob

Gene51 wrote:

It's gotten a lot better to the point that on the newest cameras there is almost zero lag. You'll see more "lag" using optical stabilization waiting for the image to settle down, than you will with the better EVFs.

Strodav Loc: Houston, Tx

Just like film and digital, they are different. Each has advantages and disadvantages. The debate will go on forever. I have used OVF for decades and have adjusted my techniques to get the results I am looking for. I am now learning how to use the Z9 EVF, with it’s advantages and disadvantages, and how to get the results I am looking for. I understand it is human nature to whine about change. If the change is too much for you, stay with a dslr while the rest of us learn how to use these new tools. In any case, choose the camera of your choice and take great photos.

Fredrick Loc: Former NYC, now San Francisco Bay Area

rmalarz wrote:

My biggest gripe with EVF cameras is the lag between what happens in front of the camera and what it shows in the viewfinder.

As for seeing the adjustments and processing, I do that before I even set up the camera.
--Bob

That (lag) problem was resolved long ago with mirrorless cameras. My six year old mirrorless camera has ZERO lag.

rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona

It's still something I notice.
--Bob

Fredrick wrote:

That (lag) problem was resolved long ago with mirrorless cameras. My six year old mirrorless camera has ZERO lag.