mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

I totally agree with this assessment. The absence of chroma information in a scene renders the image differently. It can change the mood, the perceived emphasis on various objects, and more.

lamiaceae Loc: San Luis Obispo County, CA

I still can think and shoot in B&W as I have since 1977. I love B&W images. I really only liked doing color once I switched Digital and even now I still shoot some subjects with the intent of converting them to B&W. RAW color via ARC and Ps to B&W.

TriX Loc: Raleigh, NC

Well said.

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

Color film required special tools and special skills to capture accurately. I used lots of 'chrome (slide) films. I had a bag full of color correction filters to adjust white balance under different lighting conditions. Raw capture and post processing digital images is much more satisfying.

B&W images can be altered via Photoshop's new Neural Filters to create false color results. For example, her skin and hair are close to reality, but the ground behind her is really dead brown leaves and her shirt is green and white, not charcoal and white:

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Delderby Loc: Derby UK

Does that really mean that you see the purpose of B&W photographers is to make black skies, grey trees, dark and threatening waters, grey people, all birds looking like magpies and a grey Santa?

gvarner Loc: Central Oregon Coast

Black and white and shades of grey as far as I’m concerned are parts of the color palette and deserve the same level of consideration as do the rest of the colors.

Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC

Delderby since you are located in the UK surely you've seen Kate Moss showcasing David Yurman's fine jewelry...
It's all about the genre in which you work... And the client's visual statement...

Clients demand that their "Branding" a.k.a. visual statement be honored...
Typically on high end commercial gigs is not up to the photographer to decide what medium...
But rather the client's art director...

My question to you Delderby is on how many assignments have you had the honor, privilege and pleasure to work with a client's art director?

Wish all a wonderful holiday season with family and friends...

Kate Moss for David Yurman.

mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey

The difficulty you're having understanding black and white photography seems to be your a result of your attempt to mentally translate those images into color. That is not only futile but defeats the purpose of a black and white image.

When we look at a B&W image what we are seeing are different tonalities, different textures, shapes contrast, a greater focus on details, etc. The very first thing we see when we look at a color image is the color. That color can, and does, often distract from other elements of an image.

With good B&W images one can often see things and feel emotions that are not easily seen or felt in a color version.

A few years back somebody posted a color and B&W version of a photograph of a native American man in profile wearing ceremonial war paint. Some people prefered the color version and some others the black and white version. They both had value, but the color version was more decorative showing the bright colors of the paint against his sun baked skin. The B&W version, however, without the distraction of those bright colors, highlighted his piercing eyes as he looked off to the distance, which made me wonder what he was thinking at that moment. The impact of his eyes was not evident in the color version without having to work at seeing it. It was just a colorful and attractive well composed image, but nothing more than that. It conveyed no emotion..

Keep in mind that good black and white is not just desaturated color. It can take a lot of effort manipulating color channels, contrast, shadows and highlights, and sharpening to achieve a compelling image.

The great portrait photographers of the 40s 50s 60s, and 70s and even today, chose to capture their subjects in B&W rather than color because their goal was to capture the essence of the person they were photographing, without color getting in the way.

Delderby Loc: Derby UK

Yes - there is certainly room for both. It is good to discuss points of view, likes and dislikes - and get to know each other a little better.

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That is NOTHING like what I see. I see what is presented pretty much just as it is presented.

If I view a pencil sketch I see line and suggestions of form. A BW photo is a more elaborate version of a pencil sketch.

I don’t bring outside concepts into the frame. IOW when I view BW I’m similar to anyone toadally color blind full time, someone living in a grayscale world.

Your post suggests to me that you have little or no BW vision. Perhaps you see photos as “windows on reality” ? As someone who creates imagery from a blank canvas, I see all photos as stuff inserted into a blank space to create what will be offered to the viewer. The UHH concept of a photo as a “capture” is quite alien to me.

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Using a single line I drew an album cover rendering of Brenna, a singer. I drew without a model or photo. Brenna’s mom asked if she could have a copy of “the photo”. The ultra simple line rendering was so true to Brenna’s “presence” that her mom assumed it was distilled from a photo. I greatly suspect that you and Brenna’s mom share a similar way of viewing images. Maybe thaz extremely common, but I don’t see like that at all. Therefor I photograph for a very small narrow audience.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

There are all kinds of discussions where folks philosophize about black and white photography as opposed to colour. Some say that black and white is more "artistic, challenging, dramatic, requires more skill, etc, etc, etc. Others have a diametrically opposite view. Myself? I love both! Each has its attributes, technical challenges and it is a matter of fitting the medium to the concept.

I won't argue for one or the other but I do have some practical advice about previsualizing in monochrome. Of, course, if your camera has a monochrome setting in the menu that allows you to assess a scene or a subject in monochrome, you are good to go. If it does not have the feature you can use an old director of photography trick. On a movie set, the D.O.P. has a viewfinder that replicates the camera's aspect ratio and can simulate various focal lengths. If you add a dark green filter, such as the Wratten X1 you will get a somewhat more monochromatic view. If you have or can obtain such a filter, simply view the subject through the filter.

I can envision or imagine a black and white version of colourful scenes and subjects- things such as dramatic skyscapes, and the effect of certain coloured filters on various colours. This is not because I can magically see in black and white. It's just by reading the literature and experience, I can imagine or plan what is gonna result. After years of black and white film photography, I am familiar with shifting the panchromatic rendition of various colours.

It is the old example- you shoot a red apple against a blue background and of course, the opposite colours will enable ample visual contrast. You may, however, find that in black and white both the apple and background will register as the same or nearly the same tone of gray and thereby negating sufficient tonal contrast and separation. So, I have a choice- use a red filter to light the apple and darken the background or use a blue filter to lighten the background and take the apple. You can then see which approach seems more natural. In a portrait, you can use a green filter to create a more dramatic- darker and more robust skin tone and stimulate the old orthochromatic film effect. Problem is, with a female subject, you may end up with BLACK lipstick. If the subject has greenish eyes, the may come up as WHITE- weird!

Having written all of the aforementioned, this is why I lie to shoot black and white in monochrome mode, in the camera, so I assess and apply some of these techniques and make any corrections on the spot. Of course, I can shoot in colour and do the converse in post-processing, but I fie this method more precise as to exact previsualization.

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Black, gray and white are not in any way colors. They are an absence of color, not merely by geek tech definition but also functionally in terms of information and /or emotion conveyed. Same goes for a color-toned monochrome image (sepia, selenium, etc).

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Huuuuuuuuuuumongous AMEN.

CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City

What is black and white and red all over?