Starting to print
May 19, 2019 17:05:30 #
I am considering starting to print. The research I have done so far leads me to believe I will use either Epsom or Canon. Specific models would be helpful, but I have another question about these printers. If I use either of these, and if I only use that manufacturers printing paper do I need to be concerned about printing profiles? I use PC CC and only shoot in RAW. Some black and white conversion photo's and all Canon equipment.
May 19, 2019 17:11:14 #
Good question...
I have a Canon MX-920 and print on Ink Press luster paper with OEM ink.
Not sure if I put a profile in or not. Been a while.
I guess it depends on how what would turn out for you,
if it would be acceptable or not, and how much you don't mind spending.
But if I'm printing a bunch, I have Costco print on photo emulsion paper.
That way I'm not going through a ton of ink. I don't print a ton at home.
I have a Canon MX-920 and print on Ink Press luster paper with OEM ink.
Not sure if I put a profile in or not. Been a while.
I guess it depends on how what would turn out for you,
if it would be acceptable or not, and how much you don't mind spending.
But if I'm printing a bunch, I have Costco print on photo emulsion paper.
That way I'm not going through a ton of ink. I don't print a ton at home.
May 19, 2019 17:30:27 #
To the best of my knowledge if you use a Canon printer and Canon paper there is no need to enter profiles. You simply pick your paper from a drop down list.
May 19, 2019 17:32:00 #
For best results, you will want to calibrate your computer monitor. Then the print will very closely if not exactly match the image on the monitor screen. It's a must.
In addition, each paper manufacturer produces a paper profile that you can download to use it when printing. This profile (AKA printer driver) informs the software how to print for that specific paper.
I hear that most photographers use Epson printers. I've used only Epson printers so I cannot attest to any other ones.
In addition, each paper manufacturer produces a paper profile that you can download to use it when printing. This profile (AKA printer driver) informs the software how to print for that specific paper.
I hear that most photographers use Epson printers. I've used only Epson printers so I cannot attest to any other ones.
will47 wrote:
I am considering starting to print. The research I have done so far leads me to believe I will use either Epsom or Canon. Specific models would be helpful, but I have another question about these printers. If I use either of these, and if I only use that manufacturers printing paper do I need to be concerned about printing profiles? I use PC CC and only shoot in RAW. Some black and white conversion photo's and all Canon equipment.
May 19, 2019 17:56:54 #
Strodav
Loc: Houston, Tx
If you are printing to hang your work on your walls, then something like the Epson XP-15000 (6 color, 13" x 19" maximum) if you are cost conscious, or the P400 (8 color, 13" width, but can print up to 129") if you have a few extra $$. If you are looking for a more professional printer, I recommend either the Epson P600 (9 color, 13" wide) or the P800 (9 color, 17" wide). I have used Canon photo printers, they get good reviews, and people swear by them. The 9 color printers are exceptionally good at B&W prints. I'm just more familiar with the Epsons and am very pleased with them. BTW, there is a printer forum on UHH. You might want to take a look and post your question there. I'd start out by letting folks know why you want to print and how much you are willing to spend.
As far as calibration goes, if you are serious, you will get something like the Xrite i1 Studio, which allows you to calibrate monitors, printers, scanners, projectors, and even develop profiles for your cameras.
As far as calibration goes, if you are serious, you will get something like the Xrite i1 Studio, which allows you to calibrate monitors, printers, scanners, projectors, and even develop profiles for your cameras.
May 19, 2019 18:11:51 #
doctp
Loc: ny
I use the Epson P 600 and only Epson original inks and paper, no guessing to save a few dollars; but they do use lots of expensive ink, esp. when switching between different "blacks".
Doctp
Doctp
May 20, 2019 05:59:50 #
Get real, OEM ink is third party ink. For outstanding prints, hi-quality paper is important.
I replace my Epson about 8 months ago with a canon TS9020... a $200 printer on sale for $90 because the TS9120 came out... trivial difference saved me a lot.
I did a lot of reading prior to purchase. Historically I have been an Epson person... used 3 party ink and used a tank feed system. Over the 5 years period, I saved thousands using that system. Plugging only when I failed to use the printer for a month... then I had carts with alcohol to clear the plugging and technicolor hands from handling the ink.
The Canon print heads I read in several sources are less likely to plug, OK, sounds good. I have been rebuilding my condo and so photography & printing was neglected for 4 months... The 9020 printed as tho it had been used the day before... no problem; I was pleased and supprised.
I have replaced my Canon OEM carts with really low-cost third-party ones and experienced no problem... easily recognized by the printer. I contend that it is difficult for a person to perceive the difference in color between OEM and aftermarket. Get real, OEM ink is third party ink. Do you think that Canon or Epson have ink factories...No... they buy from China. Do you think if Canon did a lot of research to get the formula to just-so perfection that China would not use that formula for third-party carts... bet they do.
Paper... yes I use low-cost 2fur sale paper from staples... Except when I have a photo I really like and then I have my RedRiver paper, for thin transparent colors I love the Polar Metallic paper from RedRiver; expensive but beautiful ... beauty that can be perceived.
I replace my Epson about 8 months ago with a canon TS9020... a $200 printer on sale for $90 because the TS9120 came out... trivial difference saved me a lot.
I did a lot of reading prior to purchase. Historically I have been an Epson person... used 3 party ink and used a tank feed system. Over the 5 years period, I saved thousands using that system. Plugging only when I failed to use the printer for a month... then I had carts with alcohol to clear the plugging and technicolor hands from handling the ink.
The Canon print heads I read in several sources are less likely to plug, OK, sounds good. I have been rebuilding my condo and so photography & printing was neglected for 4 months... The 9020 printed as tho it had been used the day before... no problem; I was pleased and supprised.
I have replaced my Canon OEM carts with really low-cost third-party ones and experienced no problem... easily recognized by the printer. I contend that it is difficult for a person to perceive the difference in color between OEM and aftermarket. Get real, OEM ink is third party ink. Do you think that Canon or Epson have ink factories...No... they buy from China. Do you think if Canon did a lot of research to get the formula to just-so perfection that China would not use that formula for third-party carts... bet they do.
Paper... yes I use low-cost 2fur sale paper from staples... Except when I have a photo I really like and then I have my RedRiver paper, for thin transparent colors I love the Polar Metallic paper from RedRiver; expensive but beautiful ... beauty that can be perceived.
May 20, 2019 06:55:15 #
dpullum wrote:
Get real, OEM ink is third party ink.....
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Yes, most likely to tighter/special specifications than many 3rd party suppliers.
Just because the same company may make both inks, it doesn't mean the inks are identical!
May 20, 2019 06:59:17 #
If you don't need or do specialized do professional printing; consider an HP Model. They have an ink replacement that is second to none. I have an HP office Pro 8710 (all-inone) which does a tremendous job. For a small monthly sum (about $9.00/month) I never run out of ink and it is always there before I need it. I'm always satisfied with the quality and this model has features that are out of this world.
May 20, 2019 07:51:32 #
Bunkershot wrote:
To the best of my knowledge if you use a Canon printer and Canon paper there is no need to enter profiles. You simply pick your paper from a drop down list.
👍👍
May 20, 2019 08:24:09 #
mizzee
Loc: Boston,Ma
I’ve had bad luck with the two Epson printers I owned, primarily with clogging. I now have a Canon Pixma Pro 100 and Canon Print Studio Pro and am very happy.
May 20, 2019 10:00:05 #
I do not print at home on a daily basis and my Epson Photo 1400 will invariably fail to print properly if not used often enough.
A master technician at a professional lab has advised me to always keep my monitor calibrated and to edit with the software made by the camera manufacturer for best results. I have seen changes in colors, specially skin colors, when I used non proprietary software. He told me that is a common problem at his professional lab when professional photographers do not see in the prints what they saw in the monitor. I talked about this in a post I made in the post processing section. Files in the sRGB color space have too many colors that neither the monitor nor our eyes can see. Monitors read sRGB. All images tend to look great in our monitors but not when printed.
My monitor is calibrated and I could not explain why some of my prints did not have accurate colors till I talked to him.
A master technician at a professional lab has advised me to always keep my monitor calibrated and to edit with the software made by the camera manufacturer for best results. I have seen changes in colors, specially skin colors, when I used non proprietary software. He told me that is a common problem at his professional lab when professional photographers do not see in the prints what they saw in the monitor. I talked about this in a post I made in the post processing section. Files in the sRGB color space have too many colors that neither the monitor nor our eyes can see. Monitors read sRGB. All images tend to look great in our monitors but not when printed.
My monitor is calibrated and I could not explain why some of my prints did not have accurate colors till I talked to him.
May 20, 2019 10:03:58 #
will47 wrote:
I am considering starting to print. The research I have done so far leads me to believe I will use either Epsom or Canon. Specific models would be helpful, but I have another question about these printers. If I use either of these, and if I only use that manufacturers printing paper do I need to be concerned about printing profiles? I use PC CC and only shoot in RAW. Some black and white conversion photo's and all Canon equipment.
With due respect I think you will find that Epsom is a salt used for medicinal use while Epson makes printers. Of course most others realized your probably typo.
Have a wonderful day,
Dennis
May 20, 2019 10:14:49 #
dennis2146 wrote:
With due respect I think you will find that Epsom is a salt used for medicinal use while Epson makes printers. Of course most others realized your probably typo.
Have a wonderful day,
Dennis
Have a wonderful day,
Dennis
Hmmm. I guessed typo as the "m" and "n" keys are right next to each other.
May 20, 2019 10:39:52 #
will47 wrote:
I am considering starting to print. The research I have done so far leads me to believe I will use either Epsom or Canon. Specific models would be helpful, but I have another question about these printers. If I use either of these, and if I only use that manufacturers printing paper do I need to be concerned about printing profiles? I use PC CC and only shoot in RAW. Some black and white conversion photo's and all Canon equipment.
At a large commercial photo lab, 2000–2005, I managed all the digital printing on a dozen different kinds of devices. Here are a few bits of wisdom from that experience:
Inkjet printers thrive on frequent use. If you don’t intend to use one at least several times a month, consider using a lab or service bureau instead.
I’ve often advised that people buy inkjet printers primarily for these reasons:
> Ultimate control over the entire process
> Privacy/security of sensitive content
> Making LARGE prints
> Archival quality and print longevity — up to FIVE TIMES longer than silver halide technology
> Printing on special rag papers, canvas, art board, etc.
> Widest possible color gamut output
> Low volume (but frequent) usage
One should never expect to save money with an inkjet printer.
It is my professional opinion and advice that no one consider printing photos without first using a calibration kit from X-Rite or Datacolor to precisely calibrate and profile their desktop computer monitor.
When you buy a printer, it will use a printer driver — device driver software written to control that particular printer. Typically, on the Mac OS platform, the manufacturer sends all drivers to Apple, and Apple distributes them through software updates. I don't know what happens on Windows 10. I no longer print from Windows. However, your printer may come with a CD/DVD, or a link to the manufacturer's web site, where you can download the latest software.
OEM printer drivers COME WITH and INSTALL all the profiles for the papers recommended for each particular printer model. When you print, you choose the paper by name in the driver interface. That is really just activating an ICC profile, in addition to setting the printer for a particular thickness of paper.
Third party papers require their own profiles to be installed in your operating system, and the usual custom is to download them from the manufacturer or vendor website and install them according to simple instructions.
If you want What You See Is What You Print color:
> Use a high quality desktop monitor. Very few laptop monitors are useful for color photo adjustment.
> Your monitor MUST be calibrated and profiled to an international standard. The monitor is your reference when adjusting images.
> Use OEM inks, OEM papers, and OEM profiles (in the driver software) to start.
> Use OEM inks, third party papers, and manufacturer-supplied profiles for each paper.
> Let the printer driver OR your software application control color, BUT NOT BOTH! "Double profiling" ruins color output, so when using third party papers, DISABLE the printer color management and let your imaging software match the profiles. When using OEM papers, you usually have a choice. Just make sure you choose only ONE.
Here's the color workflow for RAW:
> Camera saves raw data
> Computer OS or software provides a camera-specific profile. It processes the raw data to a bitmap image, using the raw profile to convert color to a "connection" or "working" color space profile (such as ProPhoto RGB). (A color "space" is the range or gamut of color saturation a device can display or contain.)
> Computer OS or software uses monitor profile to process the image FROM the working color space TO the monitor color space. You see that result. If your monitor is correctly calibrated and custom profiled, you see an accurate view of your file.
> At print time, computer OS or software uses printer/ink/paper-specific profile to process the image FROM the working color space TO the printer/ink/paper-specific color space.
> When exporting a processed image to an image file, the computer OS or software uses the output profile you specify to process the image FROM the working color space TO the chosen color space (sRGB for the Internet and most photo labs, Adobe RGB for some high-end service bureaus and offset print shops, or ProPhoto RGB for high end workflow in a studio).
Please note that none of my comments refer to the use of most small office/home office, NON-photo quality inkjet printers intended for plain paper documents. Those really shouldn’t be used if you want photo prints that last, or prints with great color.
Epson or Canon?
Both make printers that yield great color. Both use the old Gillette razor company (and Kodak) marketing strategy — supply the printer (or camera) at or near cost, so you can make a fortune on the consumables!
Epson has been serving the pro photographer printer market a bit more intensely. They got a bit of a head start on HP and Canon. So yes, Epson is more well known among pros, when it comes to printers. But Canon is no slouch. They have a great line of both dye ink and pigment ink printers.
I don't know what your budget looks like, but you can get an idea of the costs by going to the manufacturer web sites:
Epson:
https://epson.com/For-Home/Printers/Photo/c/h120
https://epson.com/For-Work/Printers/Photo/c/w120
Be sure to use their ink finder page to check ink costs and calculate your cost per ml of ink!
Canon:
https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/products/list/professional-large-format-printers/professional-inkjet-printers/professional-inkjet-printers
Don't rely on manufacturer web sites for anything more than retail costs. You can probably find printers like the Canon PIXMA PRO-100, a popular dye ink printer, on sale at B&H or Adorama for a LOT less than $500. They often bundle it with paper, ink, and a rebate that essentially makes the printer either free, or very affordable. Check Lexjet and similar inkjet supply vendors for third party consumable pricing.
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