Largobob

A day or so ago, I posted an opinion/video by Carl Sagan. At that time, the video link would not attach. Here is what I posted then, and the video link for your consideration. If you let the video run....you will hear Carl's opinions on pseudo-science. Personally, I tend to agree.... Has huge implications to Climate Change Theory. Your opinions?

This excerpt from Carl Sagan's book Pale Blue Dot (1994) was inspired by an image taken, at Sagan's suggestion, by Voyager 1 on Feb 14, 1990. From a distance of about 6 billion km Voyager 1, which had completed its primary mission and was leaving the Solar System, was commanded by NASA to turn its camera around and take one last photo of Earth across a great expanse of space, at the request of Carl Sagan. The accompanying words, written 27 yrs ago are still relevant today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO5FwsblpT8

And his last interview:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO5FwsblpT8" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8HEwO-2L4whttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO5FwsblpT8

G Brown Loc: Sunny Bognor Regis West Sussex UK

A very interesting man, Thankyou for bringing him to my notice.
It is sad that America, in the forefront of science has such a poor opinion of the educational science system. And that Politicians are maybe making decisions based upon scant scientific knowledge. It probably is not just The USA either, The UK has its own science skeptics and unbelievers.
It is sad that religion,based upon the knowledge so very long ago, plays a major part in deciding what is 'good science' and what is bad. And that it has such a huge influence in 'how people think' especially in a modern world where information is so easily found.
Perhaps it is time that we all should reassess the kind of education our children are given as well as the financial burden Further Education places as a barrier to seeking understanding of our modern technological and science based world.

DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA

Unfortunately, politics has degraded to the management of instantly achievable goals. Science is rarely capable of affording instant results or advantages. Science forms the basis for future improvements.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

Very nice.

Smudgey Loc: Ohio, Calif, Now Arizona

It's about money. Industry, and government is willing to look the other way and refuse to believe the obvious in the name of profit. Future generations will suffer unless common sense prevails and we are miles away from that now.

sirlensalot Loc: Arizona

I doubt it has much to do with religion. My life experience is demonstrating (to me) it is all about power and greed. Politicians are not the only ones to blame for many are just another version of us. We all share the greedy and sometimes self-destructive gene. The only difference is opportunity or lack thereof. It seems to be a little more out of control lately and more about personal needs and wants than a willingness to direct our efforts towards the common needs of our civilization. No argument, just saying its hard to blame a "country" when in fact it is us that enables them via our apathy.

Amielee Loc: Eastern Washington State

Let me start by saying that my original education was in science and the scientific method and I have a great respect for it. Still science does not answer many questions, what it does do is generate more questions. I remember some old scientific truths that are no longer valid and if they were questioned at the time the questioner would have been branded a heretic. Often we give science to much credit and it is best to wait for overwhelming evidence before accepting a fact as true. I think that is the real substance of this interview. And sometime truth is a synthesis of different disciplines.

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

As I pointed out on the other thread Dr. Sagan pontificates on things he can't possibly know for certain. If anyone disagrees then they are a "denier" of science.

Dr. Sagan tried to explain the universe without invoking God but as I mentioned before, God is necessary for Dr. Sagan to even DO science. There are things that science requires that cannot be justified in a purely material world such as the uniformity of nature.

The laws of nature are uniform. They do not (arbitrarily) change, and they apply throughout the whole cosmos. The laws of nature apply in the future just as they have applied in the past; this is one of the most basic assumptions in all of science. Without this assumption, science would be impossible. If the laws of nature suddenly and arbitrarily changed tomorrow, then past experimental results would tell us nothing about the future. Why is it that we can depend on the laws of nature to apply consistently throughout time?

The secular scientists cannot justify this important assumption.

But the Christian can because the Bible gives us the answer. God is Lord over all creation and sustains the universe in a consistent and logical way. God does not change, and so He upholds the universe in a consistent, uniform way throughout time (Jeremiah 33:25).

DirtFarmer Loc: Escaped from the NYC area, back to MA

Science uses the razor of Ockham frequently (named after William of Ockham, a franciscan friar from the 1300s). It basically states that among competing theories, the simplest one should be used. The consistency in the laws of nature is the simplest theory. Assuming variability would introduce unneeded complexity.

Of course theories are just that. Theory. They may explain phenomena being studied but they are not the final answer. And no competent scientist would claim to have discovered ultimate truth. The best that can be done is successive approximation based on further observation.

And it may in the future be necessary to assume a variability to the laws of nature, either in space or time or both. That would not be a failure of science nor do I believe it would be inconsistent with the writings of Jeremiah.

pbfuller

My wife and I just watched this and are totally blown away! Thank you and Merry Christmas to you!

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

That doesnt address the issue. The problem is that though folks recognize them and use them they cannot be grounded in a universe without God.

None of what you wrote addressed that.

BBurns Loc: South Bay, California

Thank you for posting this. I never tire of its message.
This is close to home for me. I was privileged to meet Carl on a number of occasions.
I worked on Hubble, the Shuttle and many other missions.
My work, my fingerprints and my signature are on the Moon, Mars and beyond.
I hope in some small way that I have helped move us forward.
Carl was one of the founders of The Planetary Society, started in 1980, of which I am a Charter Member.
The walkways at its headquarters in Pasadena, CA are paved with donated bricks. Buy a Brick Program.
Mine will remain long after I am gone.

tomcat

Thank you for so eloquently stating this. I am a retired scientist and have spent most of my life doing research in human physiology and especially blood chemistry. I can tell you that there are more scientists and doctors that know there is a God in Heaven and that the earth and all of the living creatures here are the products of an intelligent design than there are the unfortunate ones that don't believe. There are things that I could spend pages on proving to you about functions of the human body that could not have possibly evolved but had to have been intelligently designed from the very beginning to function this way. Two of them in particular: the human red blood cell is 6 microns in diameter. The smallest capillaries are less than 1 micron in diameter before they continue to reduce their size and totally lose their vessel structure. So in the course of blood flow, do you have any idea how a 6 micron blood cell can make its way through a 1 micron diameter tube? Try imaging a ping-pong ball trying to pass through your garden hose. This is an incredible design of the red blood cell: it is biconcave, shaped like a Lifesaver, so that it will roll up like a spindle and shoot through the vessel until it needs to expand on the other side. Quite a cute little designed piece of machinery that God put in our bodies. So if you are an evolutionist, can you explain how the human body had to wait for a biconcave cell to evolve before we advanced further? How many cell designs would you figure that mother nature would have tried out before the correct one was finally evolved? Or do you believe the evolutionary hogwash......? A second point in support of intelligent design. Did you know that the human body has an incredible sodium-potassium ion pump that can move potassium ions across a cell membrane against the concentration gradient? So again, did we wait for this mechanism to evolve before we climbed out of that "evolutionary amino acid pool"? No, most of you didn't know these things and most of you are just simply not aware of what the human body is doing millions of times per second to sustain our life. Only the fool has said that there is no God. And only a fool would believe that our ultimate superior design had to undergo countless cell division mutations to arrive at what we have now.

rpavich Loc: West Virginia

Nicely said. Thanks for chiming in.

However...get ready for lots of objections. Folks don't object because they need more evidence, they have all they need; God said so, they just suppress that knowledge in their unrighteousness. I know I did before I was saved...I was atheistic most of my life.

If you haven't heard this story, I'll tell it to you.

A man goes to the doctor and the doctor says "what seems to be the problem?"
The man says "I'm dead!"
The doctor says "no, your not" and they argue back and forth with the man not budging no matter what evidence the doctor brings out.
The doctor finally hits upon an idea...he asks the man "tell me...do dead men bleed?"
The man says "of course not...dead men don't bleed" so the doctor pricks the man's finger and he begins to bleed.
The man sees the blood and exclaims "Well! I guess dead men DO bleed after all!"

No amount of evidence can be brought forth to convince the unbeliever...they will always invoke some kind of rescuing device so that they can continue on their path. Only God can change that.

tomcat

This was a very cute story. I'd love to share it with some friends of mine. As far as people not believing, I fear that most of the reasons are that they don't want to acknowledge their fate---they are going to die and then burn in Hell if they refuse to accept God as their Savior. I think it's like the refusal to accept cancer and dealing with treatment when you get the first diagnosis. You'd rather put off the inevitable death and ultimate fate and enjoy a carefree life as you want to live it without any responibility and then deal with the death later. I just don't understand the reasoning behind all the energy wasted trying to find answers that are already so evident.