Drums.n.Flutes

I need to purchase a printer capable of very decent photographic reproduction. 11X14 would be desirable but I'm afraid my very limited budget won't permit it so I would settle for up to 8X10. I would also have to use the printer for general use. Suggestions? Second hand options? Printer ink costs issues? I used to have a Canon but the price of inks became prohibitive.

charles tabb Loc: Richmond VA.

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I would go to B&H on the Web for advice and look there into the Canon P-100. It's Very inexpensive after the rebate. (Talk to them)
the ink is not too pricy from LD Products for it. Also on the web.

Then buy the lowest price multifunction on the web and get the ink from Cartridge World or Linkyo.

Don't let anyone tell you that not using the Mfg.'s ink will void their warrenty, It simply is not true.

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

While you CAN use a general purpose printer for occasional photo printing, it isn't the best tool in the box. Ink tends to be very expensive in those small cartridges. Sometimes those printers don't last long, because their ink maintenance tanks fill up quickly and cannot be changed. (That tank collects all the ink used for head cleaning, which is done frequently during photo printing.)

Epson tends to make the best printers that will be used for a combination of both photo and office printing. Get one with four to six separate tanks of Claria or DuraBrite inks. And try to find one with a user-replaceable maintenance tank. HP printers are probably worst for photo printing, but quite good for office printing. Canons are decent for each.

Using a photo printer for office printing is generally expensive because pigmented inks are expensive.

How often will you print? (Printing a few 8x10s weekly will keep print heads from clogging.)

What is your anticipated monthly output? (If it's fewer than 20 sheets of 8x10, maybe you should use a lab.)

What is your budget for the printer? (Canon Pro 100 is about the lowest end of the really respectable photo printer market. You can find good deals on it. But ink and paper will cost you FAR MORE in the long run than any printer.) Review your options on Canon's and Epson's web sites. Forget other brands; they aren't truly serious about PHOTO printing.

At sizes of 8x10 and smaller, a good professional color lab makes more sense. Unless you need LARGE, ARCHIVALLY PERMANENT prints, or WIDE COLOR GAMUT prints, owning a printer is not going to save you any money on photo printing. It WILL give you immediate feedback, privacy, and total control over quality. However, that control must extend to the disciplines listed below.

Paper and ink cost around $1.10 to $1.50 per square foot. That's for top quality OEM ink and OEM or professionally-sourced paper.

If you buy a decent printer, don't put crappy ink in it! It WILL clog eventually. Cheap inks often will not produce the same color balance or archivally permanent results. There ARE professional sources for reliable third party inks. They are usually large Internet dealers selling printers, inks, and papers, and have plenty of downloadable ICC profiles. They also tend to have lots of educational resources on their sites.

Unless you calibrate your monitor with a HARDWARE/SOFTWARE solution at least monthly, creating and enabling a custom ICC profile for it at that time, you will waste lots of money on paper and ink.

Monitor calibration and profiling kits can be had for $100 to $250. They are made by X-RITE and DataColor. They will save you whatever you spend on them in NOT wasted ink, paper, and time (or lab bills).

The most important things you can do to ensure you get your money's worth out of a printer are:

Use a white balance tool at the camera to set exposure and custom white balance. Use sRGB color space for JPEGs. You can use a wider color space (Adobe RGB or ProPhoto RGB) for 16-bit TIFFs if you want.

Use a decent monitor suitable for photo editing. It must be capable of displaying 100% of the sRGB color gamut, and preferably 80% to 100% of Adobe RGB.

Calibrate and profile your monitor. NEVER tweak monitor controls after calibrating it and profiling it, unless you are calibrating and profiling it again!

Use the correct ICC profiles for your printer, inks, and paper. Each combination is unique!

Set your post-processing software so you can use Soft Proofing or a Simulation Profile. This will display a view on your monitor that is closest to what the printer will print. If you use a lab, get their printer profiles to use as proofing profiles for each of the papers you want them to use.

bsprague Loc: Lacey, WA, USA

I noticed this week that LD has Pro-100 ink. Have you used it much?

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

While third party ink definitely won't void warranties, using it can be a "printer Russian roulette" game.

A few years back, I watched my wife ruin four of the same Epson printers with third party inks from Cartridge World, before she started buying Epson ink. We ruined an HP office printer with third-party refilled inks from Cartridge World, too.

I've had good luck with some third party high end photo printer inks (Lyson Cave Paint), and know others who have as well, but we all bought them from large, reputable, *professional* inkjet supply sources such as Ink2Image. Interestingly, some of those dealers (LexJet comes to mind) quit carrying third party inks because they had so many complaints about printer failure or color inconsistency.

Caveat Emptor.

bsprague Loc: Lacey, WA, USA

LD Products appears "large, reputable and professional". I'm using their toner in a cheap Brother laser printer and have started using it in Epson Workforce WF-3620. I use neither for photo prints and continue to stick with Canon ink for my Canon Pro-100 because I've bought into there marketing info about longevity, etc.

Back to the topic...of what printer to buy if on a limited budget.

The current deal is that the Canon Pro-100, a printer specifically for photographic prints, is selling for $400. It comes with $45 worth of paper, $125 worth of ink and a $250 American Express Card rebate. They are paying you $20 to take the printer and try it out.

After trying out the printer, you can usually find paper on sale somewhere. The ink not. A big 13x19 uses about $3 worth of Canon ink. If you buy LD cartridges, the ink cost drops to about $1 per large print.

An advantage of the Pro-100 is that it uses dye inks which seems to help keep it from clogging. That is good because I don't print often. In fact, I print so infrequently that ink costs are inconsequential. If I did start volume printing, it would be tempting to try the cheap ink.

If the cheap ink ruins the printer, I would let Canon pay me $20 to take a replacement.

charles tabb Loc: Richmond VA.

At this time LD is all that I'm using in my Canon p-100 and I have become very happy with the results I'm getting.
I have been happy with their products, except for one time I had a problem with one cartridge and they told me they would send me another and never did.
Of course being 78 years old I don't think I'll be around long enough to check on their inks longevity.
Because of this, I don't really give a toot and won't argue with them again. <GRIN>
I'm still happy with their products.

I'm going to Alaska next May.
I hope to bring something nice PICS home.

Charles

charles tabb Loc: Richmond VA.

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I may be wrong but I was told that the P-100 closes up it's print heads when turned off.
If true that alone would keep print heads from drying to a large degree.

burkphoto Loc: High Point, NC

The two ink technologies behave differently. Dye inks contain fewer head-clogging particles (dyes are microscopic/molecular). So closing off the print heads is a good strategy.

Pigment inks (used in the best photo printers) contain solid color pigments, suspended in solvents. Pigment inks should be used completely within six months of opening the cartridges, and discarded thereafter. Pigment printers almost never clog if used daily. But let them sit for two weeks, and you're in for a bout of head cleaning routines at best, line flushing at worst.

We had several wide format Epsons in the lab where I used to work. We learned to run them some each week, just to keep the pigments in the ink from settling out in the lines feeding the heads from the cartridges. They ran flawlessly when we were printing 16 or 20 hours a day, continuously.

jerryc41 Loc: Catskill Mts of NY

You should find something useful in the links below. Cost and print quality often rise together.

https://www.photoworkout.com/best-home-use-photo-printers/
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,1872566,00.asp
https://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/best-photo-printers/
http://www.computershopper.com/printers/photo

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,1872566,00.asp
https://www.lifewire.com/best-photo-printers-to-buy-4066817
http://www.pcmag.com/reviews/photo-printers

toxdoc42

I wrote to Epson about how often the heads seemed to clog. I don't print photos that often and have aN inexpensive black and white laser printer for routine business printing. They told me that I should power off the printer when I am not using it. Surprisingly, that has made a world of difference. Knock on wood, I printed a couple of 8 X 10s the other day, no fuss, no muss after a month of non-use!

stage36

I agree about Epson and going long periods without printing in color. I have never had a problem with a month or more--it still prints perfectly. I like Canon printers but always had the reverse with them. After a couple of weeks I had to do several head cleanings before I could get a decent color print.

toxdoc42

I have always used Epson. Sadly, When Costco and Walmart stop carrying the 69 cartridges, I will need to replace the printer. I will probably stay with Epson.

gvarner Loc: Central Oregon Coast

If you need one to also do general use, you're looking at something like a 4 in 1 inkjet with 5 cartridges. I like my Epson XP-820. I think it does up to 11x14. Dedicated photo printers have much higher quality but only do photos. Most use at least 7 cartridges, two of them dedicated to rendering true gray scale in B&W prints. I go to commercial printing if I have anything that I want for real high quality out point.

Drums.n.Flutes

Thanks for a great deal about which to think.