E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

OK...so it's the summer and the height of the wedding season and everyone is busy. There is an old saying that if you want anything gettin' done, ask a busy person! Or something like that! Now is the time when we are most involved in our work so there are new images, new problems, new things to share and learn...ideas...business issues and all of that. So...why is it so quite around here?

Me? I am running around my studio like a one-armed wallpaper hanger. Seems it is feast or famine. Right in the middle of the wedding and grad rush, all my commercial clients showed up with rush jobs...stuff they were procrastinating on all Winter long when I could have used the work! Not complaining, just saying! Then I come home at night, do all the family stuff, do the grand-kids thing, watch a bit of TV and then I look forward for a little forum time and y'all are giving me nothin' to do! No questions, no complex troubleshooting issues, no wedding horror stories, no lighting predicaments not even a fight to break up! This is getting boring! My lovely wife says that I am breaking things, just so I can fix them!

Even a once story about a wedding that went off like clock work with a bride and groom who looked like movie stars and were super cooperative. Some of you must have some cool tips, tricks and money saving ideas like how to make a light modifier out of Popsicle sticks and and wax-paper? ANYTHING!

I have an idea! I'll call it "STUMP ED"...ask me any (photographic) question and see if I can't come up with the right answer or solution. Or...just tell me what you want me to write about...I have a bad case of writers block lately!

HELP!

Ed

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

I'm with you Ed. Been working on finishing up a few albums, had 4 family photo shoots in the last 2 weeks, and still dealing with the flood issues and other damage. I would love to see some more posts. I think it's good news that we are busy, but on the other hand, it is always a little disappointing when I click on the wedding forum and there's nothing there.

I will try to find something fun and interesting to share as soon as I can.

BermBuster Loc: Hi Desert S.Cal

I've been involved in a hair pulling photoshop composite for a product advertisement... But troubleshooting the computer & a glitchy Wacom cord are making me crosseyed!
OK - I have a Question (Always have questions)...... How do you pose & light ... brides and guests .... To flatter them? Lets say The somewhat beyond skinny? But also the skinny~bony bride and maids??
My go to... On the beyond skinny: I try to use short lighting to slim the face, I try to get a little above to decrease proportions below... & I try to cover the belly...flowers, kids or slide them behind someone else. I never shoot strait on. try to keep arms away from body. Usually try to bend leg closest to camera.
For the skinny-bony, I broad light the face, and will shoot waist level for full length, eye level for headshots. Usually hands on hips to simulate a waist line.
Not too long ago I had some 'beyond skinny' bridesmaids, in very unflattering short thin dresses. I really didn't do a good job flattering them. But I used up my tricks :(
Anyways - What do you guys do?

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

Gotta tell you, this one made me giggle just a bit. IN my neck of the woods, not sure if there is such a problem. We tend to grow 'em big and "corn fed"

About 5 years ago, I shot a wedding (out of town....shock!!!) where the bride was as you describe "beyond skinny" she had very pronounced collarbones, and the only way to not have her look like a skeleton was to turn her back towards the main light, to keep the collar bones in the shadows. The light, vs shadow is what really made them look almost sharp! As for lighting the face, I'm sure some will disagree, but even as skinny as she was, I still think short light looked more flattering. Maybe just because when I see broad light, it looks like everyone else's photos with on camera flash.

As always, it is just my opinion, and by all means, different subjects and different photographers require different styles to get the look they want.

BermBuster Loc: Hi Desert S.Cal

Well I moved to mid-west and I'm finding I didn't shoot enough 'Large' people.Corn fed is a great description :) Out west the beyond skinny is the norm & they tend to have the deep sunken eyes, easy to raccoon them.
Good idea about turning away from main light and using short lighting. I'll give that a try.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

GREAT QUESTIONS!

Although we are mainly concerned with (candid) wedding photography here, the issues of corrective aesthetic techniques have to do with traditional PORTRAITURE. When we apply traditional studio and location techniques to any type of photography such as wedding formals or even fashion work, we are bringing in the aspects of lighting control and posing techniques and methodologies. If we are working with flat on-the-camera flash or uncontrolled available light, there is little we can do to cope with difficult facial features or body types- it becomes a hit and miss or happenstance situation. If we cover weddings in a strictly photo-journalistic style, again, there is little or no control other than the serendipitous finding of the right light or perhaps finding a flattering camera angle on the fly.

This does not mean that we need to carry an entire "portrait studio" to a wedding or relentlessly pose folks in stiff unnatural positions. What with the time and logistical constraints of a typical wedding coverage, we must adopt and develop a number of fast, painless and abbreviated lighting and posing techniques- let's say the "Reader's Digest condensed version" of the more complex methods that are applied in a studio or location environment where there are no rushed or or time-constrained schedules.

LIGHTING: The aesthetic control we can exercise over facial and body elements have to do with the placement of highlights and shadows. This necessitates some kind of off-camera DIRECTIONAL lighting when we are using flash or any kind of controlled artificial light. When we are using available or natural light, such as when working out-of-doors, with widow light or other existing light conditions, we must be able to either recognize and find unmodified DIRECTIONAL light or or by means of reflectors or gobos (light blocking devices), replicate directional lighting by additive lighting (pumping in directional light with reflectors) or subtractive lighting (blocking light and creating shadows) or adding light from an off camera flash unit. It is possible to replicate the effects of a fairly complex studio setup with just a few of theses simple aforementioned tools. The lighting ratio, that is, the differential or contrast between the highlights and shadows will determine the intensity of the aesthetic effect as well as the dramatic impression or KEY of the final image.

Very basically, highlights tend to emphasize or bring out any particular facial feature or body shape and shadows tend to hide or de-emphasize theses elements. A broader light pattern shed on a very slim individual or a very narrow face will simply show more mass. This kind of light is oftentimes referred as BROAD LIGHTING, that is lighting where the main light source is placed on the NEAR side of the subject in relation to the camera position. A narrower lighting pattern, commonly called SHORT LIGHTING, where the main light source is placed on the FAR side of the subject in relation to the camera position tends to have a more slimming effect on heavy set body types and very round or heavy facial structures. This is all very elementary but it is a good starting point. Sometimes lighting jargon gets too complicated so if you want to emphasize or bring out a certain element- light it up! If you want to
de-emphasize or call attention away from an element- hide it in shadow.

Before we get in to more specific methods, let's talk about a little customer psychology, ego and vanity. I have seen allot of wedding pictures of very heavy-set brides, bridesmaids, grooms and groomsmen. Regardless of their size many of the ladies still select very revealing gowns, low-cut, sleeveless, off the shoulder etc.- not exactly the best choices, aesthetically speaking. Also, big guys with baggy clothing, shirt tails out, low rise trouser hanging there below the belly, etc.- not flattering. They just let it all hang out, so, what do the expect in their photographs? Will the complain that the "look too fat" or will they take the attitude that "it is what it is" and be happy with nice expressions and happy photos? Some big folks know how to dress well for their size and know how to minimize the appearance of ther weight. Perhaps theses folks would expect more aesthetic correction in their photographs.

Skinny folks? Same thing! I have seen girls who gotta be suffering from anorexia nervosa- at least judging by their appearance. So what do they do? Some of them select a skin tight gown with a neckline that exposes their protruding collar bones, toothpick-like arms and might even choose a Mantilla (Spanish) type veil that narrows ther face even more! Some ladies, however, will select a fuller gown with more flare and fabric and find a style that is more flattering to their body mass, or lack thereof. How about a 6'4" groom in a vertical pinstripe morning suit and a top hat- looked like a utility pole! Yes! I have had to deal with that!

Now folks, please excuse my sarcastic sense of humor- I am not making fun of folks and in fact, I am very emphatic and concerned about my clients who may have obesity or eating disorder issues or just propel who may not feel happy in their own skin, so to speak or are overly self conscious. I want to help everyone enjoy there wedding and the results of ther photography. I want to instill self confidence in them and confidence in me, knowing that I will do my best to address any issues- it makes them feel more at ease and makes my job easier. There are also ethnic and cultural connotations to theses situations. There are certain cultures where being or appearing too skinny is a sign of poverty or depravity and/or being a bit on the "zoftig" side connotes affluence and a better lifestyle! Go know! I can write a book! So- what do I do? In consulting with my clients, well before the wedding date, I simply try to find out ALL OF THEIR EXPECTATIONS. The folks with serious concerns will usually bring them up in our conversations. If the are early bookings, some of them even ask me for a bit of fashion advice or suggestions- stuff like gown or tux styles or bouquets shapes and sizes. If the don't say anything, I may just inquire about ther gown or floral selections and most of the time any issues will surface. The more information I have, the better I can serve them. Even if I detect an "aesthetic nightmare" in the making, I know what to expect and how to work around it- or at least try I can to strategize in advance!

Yes- I photographed a 5'2" 350 lb. bride with a hoop-skirted low cut dress, carrying a parasol and a huge bouquet! The groom? That 6'4" guy with the stovepipe hat! All in a day's work. They had a great fun wedding and, thank goodness, they loved their wedding photos!

Techniques: Slender brides and ladies. It's important to remember that every person has their own NORMAL body weight and height- it has to do with genetics, bone structure, metabolism and all of that biological stuff. Very thin people can look and be perfectly healthy and happy. Being thin is not necessarily indicative of an eating disorder or an illness. In the fashion word, THIN is usually IN! Some brides will go on a weigh-loss diet and attend a gym program just so they can look fit and svelte in their wedding dress. Broad or somewhat flatter lighting like "butterfly" lighting" is flattering to thinner body and facial structures. In posing, avoid dead on side views but allow more of the frontal area of the body to face the camera. The body should still be turned away form the light source to preserve detail in the whites and effect a more feminine pose (for brides). Slightly flatter lighting patterns will not over emphasize protruding collar bones which are made more prominent by the shadows that they cast. Sometimes the veil can be used to soften the lines of the collar bones. The veil can also be used to cover very thin exposed arms. One leg- outstretch sideways can add body to the skirt of the gown and shoe off its shape.

BIG girls and boys: A low key and short lighting formulation is best for heavy set subjects. A modified butterfly (loop), Rembrandt and even a split lighting pattern is a wise choice for heavy body styles and round faces. In some instances, some form of natural framing or vignetting such as a "Y" shaped tree, foliage, or an elegant piece of furniture or outdoor trellis can "hide" part of a very wide body. A dead-on frontal or side body position is NOT advisable- sort of a 45 degree stance is better. Be very mindful of posture and clothing detail. Slouched posture can even make well tailored clothing appear as ill-fitting. Poor posture can also bring on "midriff-bulge"- no bride, bridesmaid or mom likes that! Shirts that are not tucked in, vests riding upward, baggy pants and low waistbands tend to exacerbate pudgy appearances. I explain that folks can do any old thing for the party but should allow me to tidy things up for the formals. Most clients appreciate that!

Double chins can be remedied in closeup and 3/4 length portraits by having the subjects lean forward at the waist, raising their chins and by adjusting the camera position upward to accommodate the proper view of the face. Theses movements and adjustments must be done slightly or the will appear uncomfortable and unnatural.

I don't know too many folks who really want to look like someone else. Most people just want to appear at THEIR best, especially in their wedding photographs. I like to glamorize my portrait subjects as much as I can without having the results look outright artificial. A certain amount of post production retouching can "stretch" of "fill out a body" or face but this must be done very subtlety and minimally or it will seem almost grotesque. Anything you can do in the camera and with the lighting and posing is better and more authentic.

Much of this can be applied to individual and bride and groom (combined) portraits. When we get into groups, it is more difficult to address each subject's particular issues on a separate basis. Oftentimes the best pose and lighting can be established for the central subject (such as the bride) and the other folks worked around her. Sometimes a compromise lighting can be established as well.

Some genera rules and suggestions:

Always place the thinner side of the face on the highlight side and the heaver side on the shadow side of you lighting pattern- most faces are not symmetrical and will have one side heave that the other. Quick facial analysis: Look at the face under flat lighting and determine which side of the face is heavier.

Try for natural poses and stances. Get folks into place and see how they sand and then make some simple and easy modifications. Don't "manhandle" your subjects by pushing and stretching them into unnatural poses. Always be encouraging and never indicate verbally that a pose or a stance is not good or awkward, just gently direct and change it. Sometimes it pays off just to shoot a pose before modifying it so that people don't feel they have failed or disappointed you. This sounds crazy but sometimes folks are nervous enough about their wedding day and posing for pictures- they can easily become flustered or unhappy. Make it as FUN as possible and always be complimentary- even when they mess up or crack up! Putting everyone at ease is half the job. Oftentimes, clients will LOVE a shot to death, even if it does not look like something out of a fashion magazine but has a romantic or joyous story to tell!

Other issues:

Long or very angular noses: Stick with full face views, avoid profiles, shoot level or slightly lower camera height. Sometimes an angular nose makes for a fine character portrait but back yourself up with some straight-on full face angles.

Deep set eyes: Make sure you main light source is not too high and that the eyes are well illuminated with good catch-lights. Underexposed eyes lack luster, twinkle, shadow detail and color saturation. Deep shadows in the orbital area of the face (the eyes sockets) make subjects look tired, as if they have a black eye (shiner), drawn or weirdly mysterious.

Very big ears! One of my executive business portrait clients has really big protruding ears. In his own words: "I look like a big taxicab commin' at ya with both front doors open"! Would you believe...double sided tape? 2/3 face pose- looked great!

One eye larger than the other: Place the subject in a 2/3 face position with the smaller eye further from the camera- this will seem more like ordinary perspective. In editing, subtly enlarge the smaller eye- not too much.

Many moons ago, my first boss and mentor told me that "All of our brides and groom are not gonna look like Clark Gable and Heady Lamarr but it is our job to get them as close as we can to there! OK- so I am dating myself so let's say Mr. and Mrs. George Clooney! Call me "old school" but I still believe in that theory. After all- are the couple not King and Queen for a Day- they should be looking great!


I hope this helps! With kind regards, Ed

jaysnave Loc: Central Ohio

Thanks for the call for action Ed. Hopefully, I don't lose my wedding group membership for telling you this, but I have been busy doing all kinds of crazy stuff other than weddings. Climbing around construction sites (should not be doing that), food pics for a Mexican restaurant, Country singer promo pics, and was just talked into doing video (I swore that off 2 yrs. ago) for a corporate event. Another construction site tomorrow morning. Hope it rains.

Anyway, I will go for stumping Ed in the next couple of weeks hopefully.

jaysnave Loc: Central Ohio

For the not so skinny another trick is to have their partner hide some of the girth. It is tough to do that tactfully. There is also liquify but careful not to get too carried away and make them something they are not.

BermBuster Loc: Hi Desert S.Cal

Jay, thanks for the tip! Liquify is really handy :)
ED! Thanks for taking the time and putting in so much detail!
I agree we are trying to emulate the studio as best we can in the field. But, Having no training in studio or proper portraiture - I appreciate you explaining how to do it in studio & what to shoot for in the field. I really like your examples of real life situations.
No matter how much I cringe at the attire, I still strive to make it the best I can... maybe they will see themselves as never before because no one cared enough to try.
A couple questions...When one eye is bigger than the other, was that a typo to put the smaller eye "away" from camera? Or is that desirable?
And the skinny bride kicking a leg out .."can add body to the skirt of the gown and shoe off its shape".., Can you explain this? Are we trying for a bell shape? Or to do this, would it be better to have the bride on a bench? Just curious.
Thanks again!

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

Aaaand, if they are both big, always err on the side of making the bride look slimmer.

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

The eye thing: I place the smaller eye FURTHER from the camera in a 2/3 view of the face. Think of the PERSPECTIVE issue lie in a landscape shot of a winding road leading up a hill to a barn. We perceive objects like fence posts in the foreground as being larger and distant objects being smaller. The road seem to narrow at the end nearer to the barn even of the road is the same width all the way up.So.. if the far eye seems a bit smaller, it seem more natural to the viewer. Some would think that the smaller eye should be nearer to the camera and will therefore seem larger. Thing is, in most portrait we are using a normal to longer focal length at moderately far distances so there would not be enough foreground distortion to enlarge the near eye. If there were, it would also distort the other facial proportions. In the case where we place the smaller eye further away, we are not depending on optical distortion but visual perception of perspective. Then a bit of retouching helps the situation.

Jay:WORRY NOT about you non-wedding activities. Good on you that you can diversify you business offerings!

Technically, although I am a full-time photographer and have owned a number of studios over the years, wedding photography, nowadays, is mostly my weekend gig. My "day job is commercial photography where I do product work- mostly food and beverage stuff, industrial and construction progress and theatrical work for actors, models and musicians. Throw in some family and executive portraiture too. So...I can relate to all of your current jobs. More power to you and keep up the good work! I find that my other work brings lots of ideas and techniques to my wedding work. Gotta tell ya... weddings and fine portraiture are still my first love- they were my entry level to the business but a guy's gotta make a living and 2 days a week just ain't enough volume- gotta pay the rent!

Kindest regards, Ed

E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada

Kicking the leg out thing:

All poses should stat at the feet whether the subject is sitting or standing. The position of the legs and feet effect the balance and posture of the entire body, enables the subject to pivot easily and hold a pose comfortably. The basic position starts with having the subject extend the leg and foot, nearest the camera, bend the knee and place his or her weight on the back leg and hip. In the case of a bride, the leg position helps define the shape of the gown so she can move the front leg sideways to accommodate the style of her dress. The toe of the near shoe should show to complete the pose. A person standing with both feet close together will have difficulty balancing, holding a pose or defining her dress. When instructing you subject in this pose, make sure she is comfortable and well balanced and not feeling that she is going to fall over- if she is not comfortable not you need to modify the position.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

I did a shoot with a really nice, but fairly large 14 year old girl last night. She was almost as tall as me 6', and probably wider than me..and that's saying something. I think her mother was blown away by what changing the foot position and giving a slight twist did to make her shape go from "apple" to having a waist. After positioning the feet, and angle. I move up to the arms, and always make sure that there is a gap between the elbow and waist, even if the waist is round, it tends to "thin out that area" because you can see daylight.

I could not get the girl to smile when we met. She did NOT want her photo taken AT ALL. After a couple of minutes of working her like a model, she started really vamping it up. Her mom came over to me as I was putting my equipment back in the bags, and had a tear in her eye. She said she's never had a good photo of this daughter. Her other daughter is very thin and athletic, and this one has real esteem issues, and she said that her daughter "opened up like a flower" when working with me. That was a real compliment!

Not sure if anyone here is interested in how I'm getting these early to mid teen photo shoots scheduled, it's something I set up with a local orthodontist.

The orthodontist gives out gift certificates for a photo shoot and an 8x10 (not free, a gift certificate...free says my work is worth nothing) The orthodontist payment for the sitting fee and 8x10 is paid "in kind" by allowing me to advertise in her practice. I put an 8x10 in her office of each person who redeems the gift certificate, with a plaque stating it was done by ME. That gets my name out there.

When they call to schedule, I let them know that the doctor paid for a sitting fee, so that includes just the child (usually, it can be an adult but not often) but if they want, we can do family photos while they are there, and it still won't cost them anything. I treat them as any other paying customer. After all, the advertising I'm getting from the doc, is the payment. That kind of exposure is expensive if you try to set something up in a mall. This orthodontist has 8 offices, and that's a LOT of people that sit in waiting areas looking at the photos that keep changing on the walls.

The real trick (not a trick) is to do good enough photos that they want larger than 8x10 (which they pay the difference for) and to buy additional copies. My agreement with the orthodontist is that I won't do any high pressure sales at all, and I don't do that anyway.

When they come to my house to order (they don't EVER do online proofing for these) They walk in and see my 20x30 up to 30x40 photos (I'm going to print a 40x60 at some point) of my family. They will also see a "lonely" 8x10, so they see the difference. I don't recommend they go larger, and almost every time, they ask me, "how much is that size?" Yes, some come in, pick the 8x10, and leave. Honestly, I think even that is a good thing. I ask everyone to provide feedback to the orthodontist, so she knows that I'm holding up my end of the deal. They are also telling friends that I didn't try to push them into something big.

Anyway, the key take away here is that
1. Never give away anything at all for free. It devalues your work.
2. Advertising is a good form of "trade" for sitting fees. Don't let yourself get caught in the "well, they didn't pay for this, so I can just do a real quick job. You HAVE to treat them as if they paid for your most expensive sitting fee, no matter what.
3. If you pressure someone, that word will get around, and they will avoid you like the plague. Let your work be good enough that they will ask you how much it is for larger prints, or packages.
4. You sell what you show is 100% correct. I've been told that you should never show 8x10's or 5x7's because you will sell what you show, but I think that since grade school, we have been taught that the "big print" in those packages is the 8x10, so that's what we think of as "the big one." Showing an 8x10, next to 20x30s lets them see just how beautiful a portrait can be. I don't show everything from 5x7 through 20x30. I show a couple of large ones, and the 8x10. If you show all sizes, they may want to settle for the middle. If you show huge (40x60), and large (30x40) They may order the 30x40, or possibly "one size down) at 20x30. It's human nature to not buy the largest, but also not the cheapest. Make the "middle size" larger, and that's what they will want.

Anyway, if anyone wants more detailed info on what I do with the orthodontist offices, I'd be happy to share. I did try the same thing with a car dealership, but there just wasn't enough traffic. Couldn't find any doctor's offices that were interested. I even tried OB doctors for newborn prints, or maybe maternity shoots, but could never get my foot in the door.

I've considered trying local restaurants, and offering the same thing, and they could give out "x" many for "regulars" in exchange for setting up a display in the waiting area, but in the end, there are only so many regulars.

Anyway, hope that gives some inspiration.
Does anyone else have any unique ideas that they would like to share?

I actually love this stuff, trying to think outside the box.
bk

jaysnave Loc: Central Ohio

Just have to say Posing is such a skill that few photographers have refined including me. One well known photographer once said that portraits are 20% photography and 80% psychology. Thanks for the inspiration both in posing and marketing.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

For me, I think the key is treating everyone like they are the most important client you will ever have.

Concentrate on what makes each person beautiful, and do your best to show that in it's best light. If you bring forward their beauty, the rest fades to the background.

Ed describes posing much better than I ever could. I actually end up demonstrating it, depending on the subject, I may "overact" it, to get some smiles at how stupid I am. I never mind being the reason for a smile, even if it's because I'm a dork.