Tilting stacking rails
Jan 20, 2017 02:31:21 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
I've designed, built (machined), and programmed a set of (CNC like) rails for stacking. Stacking is an advanced topic which I'm not really ready for, but I wanted to design/build it for a project (I'm an engineer, that's what we do for fun).
I've got it running, but I realized one normally needs to tilt a camera for macro or close-up photography. I have a Manfrotto ball head. I intended to mount my rails (similar to StackShot) on top of a Manfrotto tripod. But the camera and rails need to be tilted to capture the subject. So is there an example of the StackShot and a ball head setup that I could study? I can simply mount the ball head on top of my rails (I don't yet have a bracket on top of my rail carriage). Or, the rails could be mounted on top of ball head. I need an example before I do some final work on my rails, like the mounting to the ball head, or a bracket to mount on top of my rails. Ideas or links to pictures of setups using something like the SnapShot rails?
I've got it running, but I realized one normally needs to tilt a camera for macro or close-up photography. I have a Manfrotto ball head. I intended to mount my rails (similar to StackShot) on top of a Manfrotto tripod. But the camera and rails need to be tilted to capture the subject. So is there an example of the StackShot and a ball head setup that I could study? I can simply mount the ball head on top of my rails (I don't yet have a bracket on top of my rail carriage). Or, the rails could be mounted on top of ball head. I need an example before I do some final work on my rails, like the mounting to the ball head, or a bracket to mount on top of my rails. Ideas or links to pictures of setups using something like the SnapShot rails?
Jan 20, 2017 02:53:52 #
Start on page 1, and work your way through to last page: Macro Equipment Set-Ups at http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-32754-1.html
Jan 20, 2017 06:55:06 #
I use a tripod with a leveling ball head on which I have a 3-way geared Manfrotto head. This is my stacking or macro head and that's pretty much all I use it for. It allows for fine adjustments and is very solid. With macro, adjustments are small and I find that this capability is preferred over a traditional ball head. I'm sure you can find a picture of it online; it's the Manfrotto 410. I'll get a picture posted in this thread of the entire setup tonight. Love to see your setup once it's done....
Jan 20, 2017 08:27:54 #
the purpose of the rail is to move the camera along the axis of the lens. Any mis-allignment between lens axis and rail axis is counter productive.
mount rails to head but never place a ball head between rail and camera.
mount rails to head but never place a ball head between rail and camera.
Jan 20, 2017 10:13:15 #
I'm assuming that you will be doing stacking in the field. This is a very good post with equipment photos near the very end. Hope this helps.
http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-258435-1.html
http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-258435-1.html
Jan 20, 2017 11:06:26 #
Thanks for thinking of us photographers of the wee things. I use a Nikon MP-6 bellows adapted for a Rodenstock Rodagon-N 80 mm enlarging lens on the front standard and adapted to accept a Sony a7RII on the rear standard. I would really like to find a bellows with some shift and maybe a little rise on it.
Jan 20, 2017 12:20:51 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
I've read it before, perhaps a year ago, when I started selecting macro lenses and equipment. I'm in the process of reading it again.
Jan 20, 2017 12:25:14 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
LoneRangeFinder wrote:
That's a nice head! I hadn't ran into it before. Yes, I'd appreciate seeing a picture of in in use. You put your rails on top of it right?I use a tripod with a leveling ball head on which I have a 3-way geared Manfrotto head. This is my stacking or macro head and that's pretty much all I use it for.
I'll get a picture of my rig posted soon. I still need to drill and tap its base for the 3/8"-16 thread that Manfrotto uses. Probably also some 1/4"-20 threaded holes.
Jan 20, 2017 12:29:42 #
you might consider a hole/pin for a locator stud to prevent spinning.
Jan 20, 2017 13:08:34 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
oldtigger wrote:
That's a good point, it looks like it would get unwieldy with a ball head on top of the rails, and then the camera on top of it.mount rails to head but never place a ball head between rail and camera.
The StackShot has a 'goose neck' bracket on top of the carriage, I haven't made a part like that yet. I have a spacer plate on top of my carriage, just enough to lift the Manfrotto quick release clamp up above the plate on the end of the rails.
I've posted an 'in progress' shot of my camera rails. Two temporary angle brackets are attached. The control box will be seperate, it will house the electronics, power supply (AC/battery?) and the stepper motor driver.
The bottom plate needs 3/8"-16 threaded holes for the tripod mount. Manfretto quick release is on top. The threaded screws on the left that attach the motor will be replaced with hex spacers.
I was thinking of adding a 'goose neck' on top of the carriage, with the quick mount on top of that. I've trial mounted a Nikkor 105mm macro lens, and the lens is clear of the rails. So do I need a goose neck like the StackShot has?
Jan 20, 2017 13:22:58 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
naturepics43 wrote:
Nice rig! Thanks for the link. I can see a Manfrotto ball head. I'm going to have a lot to pack around!I'm assuming that you will be doing stacking in the field. This is a very good post with equipment photos near the very end. Hope this helps. http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-258435-1.html
Jan 20, 2017 13:28:18 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
.
oldtigger wrote:
To prevent the quick release from spinning? I'll have to take it apart, I think I saw some additional holes on the bottom of the quick release. Thanksyou might consider a hole/pin for a locator stud to prevent spinning.
Jan 20, 2017 13:36:03 #
KM6VV wrote:
I'm not an engineer, but I would say no to the goose neck. With the weight of the lens already pushing down on the top front bushings & lifting up on the rear one's, I would think the goose neck would act as a lever & multiply this pressure. Please correct me if I'm wrong.So do I need a goose neck like the StackShot has?
Jan 20, 2017 13:44:24 #
KM6VV wrote:
Whoa up there dude.... The Manfretto quick release is a "cam over design" and very quickly loses its ability to prevent twist on a camera. Your macro shots will not tolerate that small amount of movement. You can shim the mount or luck into a tight one but it will shift over time. use a clamp type mount if you must.... Manfretto quick release is on top. ...I was thinking of adding a 'goose neck' on top of the carriage, with the quick mount on top of that. ...?
Those rails, short as they are are bouncy for the same reasons xylophones work, so keep any gooseneck short to reduce the torque bending the rails. Balancing the camera over the carriage seems to reduce stiction but there are some who feel being off balance preloads the system and acts to dampen vibration. Build some preload into your lead screw for accuracy of positioning.
Jan 20, 2017 13:48:38 #
KM6VV
Loc: Central Coast, CA
naturepics43 wrote:
Yes, I think you're right. As long as I can tilt the rails w/ the camera, and there are no clearance issues, I think it'll work. It might be that the goose neck is needed to allow the knob to secure the camera body to the rails. The quick release obviates that.I'm not an engineer, but I would say no to the goose neck. With the weight of the lens already pushing down on the top front bushings & lifting up on the rear one's, I would think the goose neck would act as a lever & multiply this pressure. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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