venturer9 Loc: Newton, Il.

There's no point pretending the illegal seizure and release of America's sailors is anything other a huge propaganda victory for Iran - and a humiliation for the United States. Insofar as there was a strategic calculation behind Obama's outreach to the mullahs, it was that the nuclear deal and the lifting of sanctions would incentivize the Islamic Republic to start behaving like any other house-trained member of the community of nations. In other words, they'd stop pulling this stuff.

As it was, Joe Biden and John Kerry could not resist bragging that the swift resolution of this situation was testament to the new hunky-dory Washington-Teheran relationship. Vice-President Biden:

They released them, like ordinary nations would do. That's the way nations should deal with one another. That's why it's important to have channels open.

Secretary Kerry:

I'm appreciative for the quick and appropriate response of the Iranian authorities... and I think we can all imagine how a similar situation might have played out three or four years ago.

We don't have to imagine how a similar situation might have played out, you botoxicated buffoon, because it's played out before, with mind-numbing regularity. This time round they seized ten US sailors. Nine years ago they seized 15 Royal Navy sailors and Royal Marines. One of the Brits was of the female persuasion. Here's what I wrote in 2007:

The token gal was dressed up as an Islamic woman...

Does that sound familiar? Why, golly, here we are in 2016, and this time round the token US gal was also made to wear a hijab.

The Royal Navy guys were put on camera and interviewed about what great hosts the Iranians are - even though forcing your captives to participate in a photo-op is, as I wrote, "a breach of the increasingly one-way Geneva Conventions".

Does that also sound familiar? Well, whaddaya know? This week the Iranians broke the same Geneva Conventions with the same impunity. Why? Well, again from that 2007 column:

Power is only as great as the perception of power. The Iranians understand that they can't beat America or Britain in tank battles or air strikes so they choose other battlefields on which to hit them. That's why the behaviour of the captives gives great cause for concern: There's no point training guys to be tough fighting men of the Royal Marines when you're in a bloody little scrap in Sierra Leone (as they were a couple of years ago) if you allow them to crumple on TV in front of the entire world.

That goes for the US Navy, too. All day long Iranian TV has been broadcasting video of one of their captives, in apparent breach of the US military's code of conduct, apologizing, very generously:

"It was a mistake that was our fault and we apologize for our mistake," said the U.S sailor, who was identified by Iran's Press TV as the commander... "The Iranian behavior was fantastic while we were here. We thank you very much for your hospitality and your assistance."

I wonder what other videos Iran took. With the British hostages, I recall they mocked one of the lads because he reminded them of Mister Bean. I'm not sure that's specifically mentioned in the Geneva Conventions, but I reiterate my point: The ayatollahs can't - yet - beat our tanks and planes, so they pick battlefields where they can win, very easily. We should know that by now, and train our guys to act accordingly.

Let's go back even further - to an earlier hijacking of naval personnel. Here's me in The Daily Telegraph, back in 2004:

Six Royal Marines and two Royal Navy sailors were intercepted in Iraqi waters, forcibly escorted to Iranian waters, arrested, paraded on TV blindfold, obliged to confess wrongs and recite apologies, and eventually released.

But don't worry about any of that Geneva Conventions stuff:

If pictures had been unearthed of some over-zealous Guantanamo guards doing to our plucky young West Midlands jihadi what the Iranian government did on TV to those Royal Marines, two thirds of Fleet Street (including many of my Spectator and Telegraph colleagues) would be frothing non-stop.

Instead, they seem to have accepted the British spin that there's been no breach of the Geneva Convention because the Marines and sailors weren't official prisoners of war, just freelance kidnap victims you can have what sport you wish with.

Which is marginally less insane than the Biden-Kerry line that illegally seizing foreign sailors, forcing them to their knees and to submit to the dress codes of someone else's religion, using them for propaganda videos and making them issue public apologies testifies to how the new Iranian-American friendship is just peachy and going gangbusters.

In fact, the Iranians are doing exactly what they've always done. They got their nuclear deal, and it's business as usual. The only difference is that, a decade ago, they did it to America's allies but they never quite dared to do it to America itself.

Now they do.

http://www.steynonline.com/7420/the-humiliation

Mike

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

Pretty silly stuff. Our Navy was in territorial waters of the country of Iran, they were picked up (we would do as much in this country) and after investigation, were promptly released.

End of story. They weren't abused, or detained for 2-3 years; they weren't tortured; they were released with their weapons and their boat.

What more could ask?

BigWahoo Loc: Kentucky

I guess we should have started a war instead of having a peaceful resolution.

BigWahoo Loc: Kentucky

http://www.steynonline.com/7420/the-humiliation

Mike[/quote]

"Mark Steyn (born December 8, 1959) is a Canadian author, writer, journalist, and conservative political commentator. He is published in newspapers and magazines, and appears on shows such as those of Rush Limbaugh, Hugh Hewitt, and Sean Hannity."

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

I'm satisfied with peaceful resolution.

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

"Mark Steyn (born December 8, 1959) is a Canadian author, writer, journalist, and conservative political commentator. He is published in newspapers and magazines, and appears on shows such as those of Rush Limbaugh, Hugh Hewitt, and Sean Hannity."[/quote]

"There's no point pretending the illegal seizure and release of America's sailors is anything other a huge propaganda victory for Iran - and a humiliation for the United States. Insofar as there was a strategic calculation behind Obama's outreach to the mullahs, it was that the nuclear deal and the lifting of sanctions would incentivize the Islamic Republic to start behaving like any other house-trained member of the community of nations. In other words, they'd stop pulling this stuff." ((This quote by Steyn.))

If, in fact our Navy was within Iranian waters, the Iranian actions were not illegal. We would have done as much. It certainly wasn't a seizure, as this trouble-maker would have you believe. A nation has a legitimate concern about armed intrusions into its waters, and the boat and crew were release immediately (in international terms).

It is a propaganda victory in that Iran seems to have joined the community of Nations in its behavior, unlike its previous actions.

Only humiliation I can see for the US is the issue of navy ships wandering around other nation's waters. We don't know how that happened, mechanical failure, navigational error etc.

Of course Iran had to be certain the men were disarmed while they investigated the situation. Would we have left Iranians armed in a similar situation? I think not.

The men were fed. I wouldn't expect hamburgers or Chinese take-out in Iran.

The one woman on board was given Iranian clothing to wear; she was indecently dressed for Iran. I don't see any problem with that...only cultural differences.

I suspect the sailors were seals--they were exceptionally well armed, I think, and they were probably up to something and got caught.

In my book, it was all as civilized as one could wish, probably as a result of our late agreement with Iran over nuclear bombs.

I say, well done, everyone.

(And finally, later: I do have an ornery streak, and when someone in the room tells me "Let's you and him fight!," I become peaceful just to piss him off. I guess this is my attitude here. I resist being manipulated just to sell a few magazines for a fellow.)

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

The Iranian nuclear deal had one stated goal, to keep them from possessing a nuclear weapon. Nobody pushing the deal ever suggested that it would make Iran a good neighbor. They may eventually become a good neighbor, they may never become a good neighbor. That can be dealt with in future negotiations.

WNYShooter Loc: WNY

LOL, there always was going to be a peaceful solution, their reaction was not designed to provoke action, only for propaganda, ie. showing the world our warriors cowered under their guns.

Standard protocol would have been for them to escort the boats back to International waters, not board them with an armed raiding party, forcefully remove and detain the crew, then seize and hold the vessels.

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

Mike: It seems a little unclear, but I assume this post is entirely by the author you quote, and not your own commentary.

If you notice, he starts out talking about the current event, then changes to one several years ago, which did not involve the US at all.

It does not take any sophistication at all to see that his intention is merely to rile readers up through mis-direction and exaggeration.

I did another post on this article, but my summation is this guy is a trouble- maker trying to muddy the waters and roil the readers--all for his own personal profit.

I hate to be manipulated like this and always resist. Let him earn his bread and butter with honest endeavor, like other folks.

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

Gee, Thom, I though their behavior was just fine, though I agree with what you say.

I see it as an improvement in their behavior.

Just sayin'.

venturer9 Loc: Newton, Il.

"Mark Steyn (born December 8, 1959) is a Canadian author, writer, journalist, and conservative political commentator. He is published in newspapers and magazines, and appears on shows such as those of Rush Limbaugh, Hugh Hewitt, and Sean Hannity."[/quote]


WOW, that is amazing that you knew/know/looked it up all that information on Mr. Steyn..... thanks for the info..

Mike

davefales Loc: Virginia

An indisputable fact is that no one viewing UHH knows exactly where those boats were or why.

Checkmate Loc: Southern California

Another poor response. Name, rank and serial number. Does this ring a bell? Interviews with a Iranian TV station. Are you really that stupid. That dumbass in the WH (in Obama's case Whore House) and SOS Kerry said that he didn't apologize which proves that your POS lies everyday, even more than Dirtbagger and Nak Nak.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

I was not commenting on the situation with the sailors in particular. I just get tired of people saying the nuclear deal is a disaster because Iran did this or did that. If Iran develops a nuclear weapon it may be fair to say the deal didn't work but even then to call it a disaster one should have some evidence that things would have been better without the agreement.

Checkmate Loc: Southern California