bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

I've done PP for other local photographers that I know well, and it's been fun, and I've gotten to know several other local photographers that I really respect.

I had a new girl (to me) approach me, because someone told her that I did it, and am reasonable. Just like everything else, probably WAY too reasonable.

Here's how it turned out. (she's a shoot and burn photographer, but ended up paying me more than she made on the wedding, yes, there was that much work)

Gave me a disk of about 800 images.

I normally go through the first pass REALLY fast, and throw away any that are really off on focus, bad exposure, misfires, etc.

I went through, and ended up with about 20 images that I would "in a pinch" keep.

Called her, and let her know. She begged me to do "something" so she had enough to give her people. Mind you, she charged like $250, and I told her that quick editing would be $300.

Now, call me a snob, but I think I'm going to give her the disk (SD card) and her $300, and tell her that they paid for shoot and burn, and she should just give them the disk.

I hate taking more than she charged, and I hate that the couple isn't getting really nice photos for their wedding memories, but they were the ones that cheaped out on the photographer.

Here's the question. In my position, based on the "gentleman's agreement" with no firm contract. Am I being a jerk for backing out? I just honestly don't see how, without a LOT of composite work, switching faces, fixing (where possible, everything is jpeg) blown highlights or recovering under exposures, will be worth my time for $300.

I did say "minor" PP, and this will be anything but minor.
Thoughts?

hlmichel Loc: New Hope, Minnesota

800 images and 20 keepers?

Should she even be charging people?

Personally, I don't think it is worth your time--not by a long shot. Explain the situation to her and tell her you just don't have the time.

superpijak Loc: Middle TN

Sounds like you are feeling guilty, but you'll get over it. After all you really didn't have accurate knowledge of what you were diving into. I've never been in the situation you are describing, but I believe the customer is getting they're $250 worth. Yes post processing can save borderline images, not perform miracles. Based on what you are describing I would charge about $1,250 for what you are describing, and I'm not that good at it, ..... yet.

Bottom line in my opinion, give her the 20 maybes, and offer a partial refund of some form. After all, you need to cover your time spent.

BTW, you're not being a snob.
:shock:

jdubu Loc: San Jose, CA

Not being a snob about it at all. The reality is she knows what type of wedding photographer she is and the clients know what they paid for that kind of coverage.

Any expectations of premium work on either part is not your problem and guilt shouldn't play into your involvement.

I've shot a few weddings for friends and family and been to others with hired photographers just like most of us have.

My nephew was getting married and I was asked to help so that was the plan until a week prior when the bride's mom decided she wanted a pro. No problem for me, I'll bring my gear and be a happy guest with a camera for just my family.

Outside with a flash on camera, she was nowhere to be seen during the ceremony (turns out she was in the bar having a drink because it was too hot) Obviously a shoot and burn photographer during the rest of the time.

The bride's side of the family complained about the poor coverage and quality of all her photos (and they were really bad) so I gave them the PP'd shots of the ceremony and reception I had taken.

Do I feel guilty because my coverage was not as complete as it would have been as primary? No, because that wasn't the deal they set up. Besides, they used the photos and files to make up wedding albums and never once did I get a thank you from the bride or her family.

You have no skin in the game other than being a contractor doing repair work. If you were redoing a home remodel because of shoddy work by another, would you charge less because you feel sorry for the other parties involved? People should get their moneys worth, and so should you.

Make a proposal for what it would cost to actually do the heavy PP and it's up to them to accept or not.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

Thanks, all very good points. I tend to want to please everyone. I don't want to put down the girl, as I don't know her at all, just from our brief conversation. Considering that they had moved the wedding from outside, to inside a GARAGE, it would have been a challenge for anyone to get artistically beautiful images. But, I'd say at least 1/2 of the shots I "tossed" (I don't delete anyone else's images, I just put them in a "junk" folder) were just plain blurry. The hammer on the back wall was tack sharp, but the people were hard to recognize. I didn't look, but wondered if she wasn't trying to shoot in a cramped space, getting group photos with a 70-200 or something? I just don't know.

I do think I'll take a pass on it. I hate to burn a bridge with someone that may want to recommend me to someone else, but wow, I mean, from what I saw, and I've seen some rough images....this is probably about the roughest I've seen.

Thanks for the affirmations from my UHH family.
bk

superpijak Loc: Middle TN

Atta Boy
:thumbup:

greg vescuso Loc: Ozark,Mo.

I think if she wants to build a reputation she will have too do her own pp work because she isn't charging enough to out source. And if she only had 20 keeper she really needs to be practicing a lot more before she charges anyone anything because if you can't deliver good quality images your not ready to be photographing weddings yet. This is why I shoot my families wedding for them because I know they can only afford $300 and I want them to get good images of their special day that can't be reshot. So no you not a snob and if there aren't any more than 20 shots out of 800 I do not think any amount of Photoshop work is going to solve the problem. If the wedding got moved inside from outside she more than likely wasn't comfortable with flash photography and if your not comfortable with flash photography you so not take wedding photography jobs, because you could be a excellent natural light photographer but weddings get moved inside due to weather and a lot of the time to venues that are very difficult to shoot in.

Beercat Loc: Central Coast of California

OK, here is my take ...............

Run and don't look back ............... honestly

Here is the problem .......... once you touch the photos your connected to them. The family will connect you with the pictures, do you really want that? Please if after you fix it if the family doesn't like it and wants changes do you think your going to be able to charge more?

And your concern about burning bridges ........ this is a bridge you need to burn, do you want more of her work? I'll send you the gasoline, free ................ run, don't look back

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

haha :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
I guess I'm just lucky, I've never had anyone come back to me to redo any of the PP work. Probably because I don't do very much other than cull, fix exposure, crop, and maybe (just maybe, not usually) do some blemish removal or something. I'm actually pretty quick and ruthless about the culling, so it doesn't take a lot of time, so $300 isn't bad for a few hours work.

I've already tried to call her twice to let her know that "I just can't do anything with them" and will just give her all her money back. I do have maybe an hour or 2 invested, but to get out of it, I'll gladly just refund everything.

Bill Houghton Loc: New York area

I've done PP work for a few photargaphers, wedding and other, but it was never in magnitude your talking about. Simple things. Like changing a background, fixing a tooth. Removing wrinkles. And as beercat mention once you start you own those photos. I wouldn't have any quams about walking any.

Perhaps have her come over and show her want a wedding shoot should have start with and why your walking away.

greg vescuso Loc: Ozark,Mo.

Perhaps have her come over and show her what a wedding shoot should have to start with and why your walking away

This is good advice. She needs to know there is a certain quality you have to start with. Sorry I'm not trying to be mean.

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

I know you aren't trying to be mean. I think it is my "fatherly" style that wants to guide her, but not hurt her feelings. I did give the disk back, and just told her that what she gave me was going to take way too much time, as I've got weddings, headshots, and senior photos of my own, and that I have bitten off more than I could chew.

A problem here is that I normally will gladly mentor/tutor someone, just for the love of doing it. Unfortunately, the stuff that I saw in those photos just wasn't to the point where I would want to start with "this is the part you look through, and this is the part that you push to make the picture." I really do feel bad for the people that pay her, but I guess if they don't realize what you get for that kind of money, they soon will. Maybe if enough people have huge complaints about the shoot and burn types, word will get out, and people will be more willing to shell out a few more bucks to get quality.

Really kind of sad.

Bill Houghton Loc: New York area

I am curious, do you know what camera she was using, meaning was a top draw camera or a 42nd Street special. I'm thinking she was told by family member's that her work is fantastic. LOL

bkyser Loc: Fly over country in Indiana

D-3000, but she owned (not sure if it was what she was using) a Nikon 70-200 2.8 (not sure which, if any VR version, she was just telling me that she had gotten the 70-200 a few weeks before the shoot)
I have to say something about that part. I know that I've often told people that glass is more important than the camera body, so I can't fault her for purchasing pro glass and putting it on an older entry level body.

I'm sure you are correct, though. She probably has some "over supportive" friend or family that thinks they are doing her a favor by telling her how terrific she is.

Bill Houghton Loc: New York area

That could have been part of her problem, a lot of newer lenses will not work on older bodies. I hope she did a compatibility check. My personal opion the D3000 is entry level DSLR and wasn't intended as a professional box not that couldn't be used.