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auto-focus thru double-pane window
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Dec 14, 2014 23:36:02   #
SquareRoot Loc: southeast Missouri
 
Is a camera's auto-focus compromised when shooting thru double-pane window glass? If so, is it worse when the camera is not orthogonal (perpendicular) to the glass?


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Dec 14, 2014 23:39:14   #
Nikon_DonB Loc: Chicago
 
When shooting through the window glass put the lens up flush against the glass for best results. Thus eliminates the possibility of extra reflections or flash.

Nice pics.

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Dec 15, 2014 05:41:55   #
Revet Loc: Fairview Park, Ohio
 
When I was driving through the mountains in Colorado and my wife didn't want to pull over every 30 secs for me to get out and get a photograph, I put a circular polarizer filter on and I got some great shots through the car windshield

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Dec 15, 2014 07:17:30   #
tainkc Loc: Kansas City
 
The answer is no. It will focus through double pane glass just fine. Just have Windex handy to keep the window clean.

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Dec 15, 2014 08:58:22   #
Morning Star Loc: West coast, North of the 49th N.
 
tainkc wrote:
The answer is no. It will focus through double pane glass just fine. Just have Windex handy to keep the window clean.


I didn't even have Windex handy, nor would I have had time or chance to use it for this woodpecker:
http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-260150-2.html
I saw him land as I walked into the diningroom. My camera was still sitting on the table where I'd left it. I didn't bother to even check the settings.
We'd had a lot of rain and the outside of the double-paned glass doors wasn't exactly clean. I was about 4 feet inside the door, the woodpecker about 3 feet outside.

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Dec 15, 2014 09:12:22   #
dsmeltz Loc: Philadelphia
 
tainkc wrote:
The answer is no. It will focus through double pane glass just fine. Just have Windex handy to keep the window clean.


The Windex idea is dependent on how clean you keep your car. However, it is always a good idea to have Windex and duct tape on hand. Between the two of them, you cover most emergencies.

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Dec 15, 2014 11:03:49   #
Armadillo Loc: Ventura, CA
 
SquareRoot wrote:
Is a camera's auto-focus compromised when shooting thru double-pane window glass? If so, is it worse when the camera is not orthogonal (perpendicular) to the glass?


Wayne,

The short answer is no.

The long answer is no, because the auto focus in most digital cameras work on a phase relationship between neighboring pixels. If you could look through a microscope at the image sensor and pinpoint two neighboring pixels; one bright an done dark, you would see the blurred result of poor focus. When the auto focus performs its magic you would see an increase in contrast between the two pixels. Pin sharp focus is obtained when maximum contrast is achieved between the two contrasting pixels.

In PP you can see a similar effect when applying the Sharpness control to an image. You can see the contrast increase, and if you over process with sharpness you can see a border appear around the contrasting elements of the image.

Shooting through double pane windows can cause a lot of other unwanted problems, and most of these will look like poor focus because they are on the glass surface. Mirrored reflections between the inner surfaces of both glass panes, photographer reflections from one pane, outdoor light reflecting form a pane, dirt, smudges, etc.

Michael G

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Dec 15, 2014 11:19:52   #
James R. Kyle Loc: Saint Louis, Missouri (A Suburb of Ferguson)
 
Armadillo wrote:
Wayne,

The short answer is no.

The long answer is no, because the auto focus in most digital cameras work on a phase relationship between neighboring pixels. If you could look through a microscope at the image sensor and pinpoint two neighboring pixels; one bright an done dark, you would see the blurred result of poor focus. When the auto focus performs its magic you would see an increase in contrast between the two pixels. Pin sharp focus is obtained when maximum contrast is achieved between the two contrasting pixels.

In PP you can see a similar effect when applying the Sharpness control to an image. You can see the contrast increase, and if you over process with sharpness you can see a border appear around the contrasting elements of the image.

Shooting through double pane windows can cause a lot of other unwanted problems, and most of these will look like poor focus because they are on the glass surface. Mirrored reflections between the inner surfaces of both glass panes, photographer reflections from one pane, outdoor light reflecting form a pane, dirt, smudges, etc.

Michael G
Wayne, br br The short answer is no. br br The l... (show quote)

+++++++++++++++++++

YES!!!

Either Open the window, Break the glass out, or do not shoot... That is unless you wish to just have a "snap-shot".

And for the guy that has a wife that does not wish to stop every now and then.....
It cost me a lot to do this and I do Not recommend to any married guy...

But I got a divorce.

And I will not respond to others about THAT.

I just do not shoot through any Glass Out Side of the Glass In My Lenses.

Nuff Said.

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Dec 15, 2014 11:40:55   #
Morning Star Loc: West coast, North of the 49th N.
 
James R wrote:

Either Open the window, Break the glass out, or do not shoot... That is unless you wish to just have a "snap-shot".

All three of those "solutions" would have caused me to miss this shot (See: http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-260150-2.html and scroll down a bit to the woodpecker)

James R wrote:

I just do not shoot through any Glass Out Side of the Glass In My Lenses.

I'm happy to shoot through glass, even double-paned glass, if the occasion arises and I can't get the shot any other way. And if that turns my "photo" into a "snapshot", so be it. At least I'll have it recorded, rather than having nothing!

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Dec 15, 2014 12:45:52   #
Armadillo Loc: Ventura, CA
 
Morning Star wrote:
I'm happy to shoot through glass, even double-paned glass, if the occasion arises and I can't get the shot any other way.


Morning Star,

It is perfectly okay to shoot through double pane glass windows when the need requires the shot. By doing so, be aware there may arise problems that you cannot see before the shutter snaps, or even after the image is processed. Aside from all the problems, I mentioned earlier, the nature of the glass material itself might produce problems you never considered before. The most noticeable effect, and the easiest to identify, is the reduction in contrast, when shooting through window glass.

You can test this effect yourself by picking an outdoor scene with a glass window half way open. Take the test shot through the window so half the shot is through the open window and half is through the glass.

When you see the reduced contrast you may be able to compensate for the lower contrast in PP, but it is always much better to get the capture right in camera, than to rely on PP to correct errors in the capture.

Michael G

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Dec 15, 2014 12:55:05   #
dbk31hp Loc: Muskegon, MI
 
I shoot bird photos through double pane slider glass as my feeders are in close proximity with my deck so there's no keeping them perched if I go outside. I have gotten many really good images (as long as the window is clean) and no problems at all with auto focus.

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Dec 15, 2014 15:20:25   #
jackpi Loc: Southwest Ohio
 
Morning Star wrote:
I didn't even have Windex handy, nor would I have had time or chance to use it for this woodpecker:
http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-260150-2.html

I didn't find a woodpecker at the link you provided.

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Dec 15, 2014 16:53:13   #
Morning Star Loc: West coast, North of the 49th N.
 
jackpi wrote:
I didn't find a woodpecker at the link you provided.


He's there, but you have to scroll down a bit. Also, as I told my 4-year old granddaughter, "His long name is "Northern "Red-Shafted" Flicker" but we call him "Woodpecker" (as does everyone else around here).

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Dec 15, 2014 17:00:34   #
Nikon_DonB Loc: Chicago
 
Cool looking bird.

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Dec 15, 2014 21:45:21   #
tainkc Loc: Kansas City
 
dsmeltz wrote:
The Windex idea is dependent on how clean you keep your car. However, it is always a good idea to have Windex and duct tape on hand. Between the two of them, you cover most emergencies.
Yeah, I forgot to mention the duct tape.

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