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The Bombing of Nagasaki - Interesting WWII Footage
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Feb 11, 2014 08:48:53   #
Crwiwy Loc: Devon UK
 
chienfou wrote:
Unfortunately we haven't made much progress. Nations are still seeking the power of the bomb. There's still talk about nations annihilating other nations. My religion is the only true one, so on & so on!. I can only repeat what has been said so eloquently in just one word, "IMAGINE!"


Sadly true, and decades after John Lennon wrote Imagine we can still only imagine.

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Feb 11, 2014 09:33:01   #
autofocus Loc: North Central Connecticut
 
I know for many it's hard to justify Hiroshima and Nagasaki, however, at the time this was probably the best, and only solution to bring this war to an end. As the US troops and allies were victorious moving northward from one island stronghold to the next, Okinawa was the final stop before moving to mainland Japan. Yes, the bombing of those two cities was horrendous, but it was estimated that millions of Japanese along with many allied forces would die if mainland Japan was to be attacked. The decision was the lessor of two evils, but in the long run it spared possibly millions. War is hell, and always has been, and it seems it will always be the nature of man

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Feb 11, 2014 10:10:20   #
W7AX Loc: Polson, Montana
 
Let's face it...war is hell in it's best form. But has been said before, the Japanese people at the time had one thing in mind....kill off as many of the enemy as possible any way you can. They used horrible tactics them selves for years against the Chinese and us as well. Fanaticism at it's worse. I think it was a necessary thing at the time and I remember it well. It brought the chapter to a close and quickly as well. As for the peaceniks...nice thought but it isn't going to happen as long as there are humans on this planet. Trying to be reasonable only works with reasonable people. We have enemies right now that need to be suppressed. If we don't, there will be horrible consequences for trying to be 'politically correct'. Think I'm wrong? Just wait and see.....

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Feb 11, 2014 10:15:33   #
RichieC Loc: Adirondacks
 
Crwiwy wrote:
There was a different attitude prevalent at the time;]

During the war "annihilationist and exterminationalist rhetoric" was tolerated at all levels of U.S. society; according to the British embassy in Washington the Americans regarded the Japanese as "a nameless mass of vermin". 200 Caricatures depicting Japanese as less than human, e.g. monkeys, were common. 200 A 1944 opinion poll that asked what should be done with Japan found that 13% of the U.S. public were in favor of "killing off" all Japanese: men, women, and children
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_bombings_of_Hiroshima_and_Nagasaki
There was a different attitude prevalent at the ti... (show quote)


Japanese interviewed have stated that if they had the bomb, they would have used it. They experimented widely with weapons of mass destruction, most notably in biological warfare. Chinese to this day, die of bubonic plague, which can be traced genetically to strains the Japanese used in experiments on deploying the disease. They could never figure out a way of distributing it. One instance, the infected bat houses they tried to float in the jet stream to the US, froze to death at altitude. They figured they would spread out once they hit the mainland and plague would spread.

AND you forget the Japanese attitude toward Gaijin, We were barbarians- beneath animals... The were extremely cruel to prisoners, showed no mercy at all, made the Nazis look like nice guys. They were preparing for the US invasion of their mainland by teaching anyone who could hold a sharpened stick to attack any American soldier... old men, children- the bombs saved millions of lives, and a large number of our soldiers- my dad was getting ready to be shipped out from Italy to Japan when they ended it. It would have been irresponsible and criminal not to use them with the only option, to sacrifice American lives. instead. Now think of the card Roosevelt played.. he had two bombs, and many months away from any more. Yet he used them both in fast succession- to give the Japanese the impression we could keep this up forever... He bluffed them. A truly brilliant ploy.

They believed we would roast and eat their children.

Cut and pasted by an eye witness. ( Link at end for rest of interview)


"WTJ: You also ended up witnessing some of the tragic suicides which happened at the cliffs. I hate to ask, but were they as shocking as I've heard?
Gabaldon: Many Japs, both military and civilians, committed suicide. It was sad to see children struggling with their parents pleading not to be thrown off the cliffs - "Please father, do not kill me. I do not want to die!" These parents were dangerous, desperate people who wanted nothing more than to kill the "American Savages" who they thought would roast and eat their children. "Hurley, look at all those people lined up at the edge of the cliff! They're jumping off by the numbers. My God, man, we've got to stop them. Let's go."

One group was about two hundred yards away from us. I shouted at them as we ran. "Tomare, tomare - seppuku shinaide. Kodomo korosanaide. Dozo, korosanaide.! " I'm begging them to stop killing their children. But I can see that as we approach they jump off in greater numbers. "Hurley, stop. If we get any closer they'll all jump off. I'll try talking to them again."

As we stop we can see four children thrown off. They were pleading with their parents not to kill them. It seems that the children had more faith in us than did their parents. There were about fifty in that group - it seems that there are about ten left. One who apparently is a leader is yelling at the rest I can't make out what he's saying but it is obvious that he's telling them not to surrender. The people look down at the rocks below and see their friends moaning down there. Just about then one of them grabs an infant and tosses him off. That seems to have been a signal because they all start jumping off. In a couple of minutes it's all over. The whole bunch lies down below either dead or dying.

Before leaving Saipan, I went to the Stockade to bid adios to the many people I knew there. There were actually hundreds who I had personally saved from sure death. One guy, Shimabukuro, was a special friend, and he had become my personal barber. "Guy-san, before you leave us, I want you to see someone here who you saved from jumping over the cliff. Do you remember that woman you grabbed right after she had thrown her baby to the rocks down below. The people who were there say that she screamed and fought you, but you held her down. Well, she lost her mind a few days after she was brought here to the stockade. It seems that when she realized that she had killed her child unnecessarily - that the Americans were not going to roast and eat the children - she became "hidari-maki" (lost her mind). Come I will take you to her." There she sat, motionless, just staring straight ahead. My God, what a pathetic sight. I should have let her join her baby that day at the cliffs.
This was truly the horror of war.
"


http://www.wtj.com/articles/gabaldon/


I am glad the Japanese are our allies now, same with the Germans- and for that matter the Great Brittan. We all make better friends then we do enemies.

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Feb 11, 2014 10:17:45   #
alf85 Loc: Northumberland, UK.
 
Such Pointless Glory.



THEY shouldered arms

Changed the clothes they wore

Boarded ships and sailed to war

Headed south and yomped for miles

Now they rest 'neath the Falkland Isles

Further north in the ocean deep

Young men lie in their final sleep

Jutland Ypres on the Somme

Dunkirk beach and the Stuka's bomb

Crete Tobruk El Alemein

Beneath the sand they still remain

India, Burma, Singapore

They will never leave that far-off shore

Gallipoli, the Sudan, Khyber Pass,

Flanders Field, and the choking gas

They took their leave and had a beer

Then left their bones in North Korea

In blocks of stone they carve their name

But the politicians grab the fame

When it is all said and done

Some family has lost a son

Some young wife would have it rather

Her children had not lost a father

What reason since life began

That man gets pleasure in destroying man.

COLIN BELL, North View, Forest Hall

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Feb 11, 2014 10:18:53   #
Poison Ivey Loc: Mtn Brook, AL
 
Ending the War quickly ended up saving millions of lives on both sides. Reading the plans of defending Japanese had everyone armed, children on up to Senior civilians!

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Feb 11, 2014 10:25:27   #
hondo812 Loc: Massachusetts
 
RichieC wrote:
Japanese interviewed have stated that if they had the bomb, they would have used it. They experimented widely with weapons of mass destruction, most notably in biological warfare. Chinese to this day, die of bubonic plague, which can be traced genetically to strains the Japanese used in experiments on deploying the disease. They could never figure out a way of distributing it. One instance, the infected bat houses they tried to float in the jet stream to the US, froze to death at altitude. They figured they would spread out once they hit the mainland and plague would spread.

AND you forget the Japanese attitude toward Gaijin, We were barbarians- beneath animals... The were extremely cruel to prisoners, showed no mercy at all, made the Nazis look like nice guys. They were preparing for the US invasion of their mainland by teaching anyone who could hold a sharpened stick to attack any American soldier... old men, children- the bombs saved millions of lives, and a large number of our soldiers- my dad was getting ready to be shipped out from Italy to Japan when they ended it. It would have been irresponsible and criminal not to use them the option to sacrifice American lives. instead. Now thinkof the card Roosevelt played.. he had two bombs, and months away from any more. yet he used them both in fast succession- to give the Japanese the impression we could keep this up forever... He bluffed them. Proof he wanted them to end the war right now.

They believed we would roast and eat their children.

Cut and pasted by an eye witness. ( Link at end for rest of interview)


"WTJ: You also ended up witnessing some of the tragic suicides which happened at the cliffs. I hate to ask, but were they as shocking as I've heard?
Gabaldon: Many Japs, both military and civilians, committed suicide. It was sad to see children struggling with their parents pleading not to be thrown off the cliffs - "Please father, do not kill me. I do not want to die!" These parents were dangerous, desperate people who wanted nothing more than to kill the "American Savages" who they thought would roast and eat their children. "Hurley, look at all those people lined up at the edge of the cliff! They're jumping off by the numbers. My God, man, we've got to stop them. Let's go."

One group was about two hundred yards away from us. I shouted at them as we ran. "Tomare, tomare - seppuku shinaide. Kodomo korosanaide. Dozo, korosanaide.! " I'm begging them to stop killing their children. But I can see that as we approach they jump off in greater numbers. "Hurley, stop. If we get any closer they'll all jump off. I'll try talking to them again."

As we stop we can see four children thrown off. They were pleading with their parents not to kill them. It seems that the children had more faith in us than did their parents. There were about fifty in that group - it seems that there are about ten left. One who apparently is a leader is yelling at the rest I can't make out what he's saying but it is obvious that he's telling them not to surrender. The people look down at the rocks below and see their friends moaning down there. Just about then one of them grabs an infant and tosses him off. That seems to have been a signal because they all start jumping off. In a couple of minutes it's all over. The whole bunch lies down below either dead or dying.

Before leaving Saipan, I went to the Stockade to bid adios to the many people I knew there. There were actually hundreds who I had personally saved from sure death. One guy, Shimabukuro, was a special friend, and he had become my personal barber. "Guy-san, before you leave us, I want you to see someone here who you saved from jumping over the cliff. Do you remember that woman you grabbed right after she had thrown her baby to the rocks down below. The people who were there say that she screamed and fought you, but you held her down. Well, she lost her mind a few days after she was brought here to the stockade. It seems that when she realized that she had killed her child unnecessarily - that the Americans were not going to roast and eat the children - she became "hidari-maki" (lost her mind). Come I will take you to her." There she sat, motionless, just staring straight ahead. My God, what a pathetic sight. I should have let her join her baby that day at the cliffs.
This was truly the horror of war.
"


http://www.wtj.com/articles/gabaldon/
Japanese interviewed have stated that if they had ... (show quote)



Just to clarify....Truman gave the order. Roosevelt was dead at that point.

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Feb 11, 2014 10:35:52   #
Ka2azman Loc: Tucson, Az
 
robert-photos wrote:
Yeah. ... What if they threw a war and nobody came.


Then who ever started it won!

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Feb 11, 2014 10:42:57   #
Fkaufman3 Loc: Florida, LA ie lower Alabama
 
Try being an American tourist in that Japanese town, and think of what your reaction is when visiting the Arizona memorial when Japanese tourists are all giggling and taking pictures of each other, very sobering, been there for both.

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Feb 11, 2014 10:49:52   #
yhtomit Loc: Port Land. Oregon
 
robert-photos wrote:
And that's a desirable result? I wonder how many of the over 40,000 that died on that day were children under the age of five.


The bomb,just like abortion is a necessary evil,get over it.

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Feb 11, 2014 10:52:42   #
One Rude Dawg Loc: Athol, ID
 
In a perfect world? They started it and we ended it and they wouldn't give you an inch of slack if they won. Remember the Batan death march. Thats why they call it war

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Feb 11, 2014 11:04:12   #
vj62 Loc: Fairfax, VA
 
In the early 70's while stationed on Guam I flew into Tianan several times once visiting that pit where they loaded the bomb . Then it was littered with beer cans and other trash and otherwise deserted. I did climb down into it and sometime later visited Hiroshima and the connection did not pass unnoted by me. Since then I see on Google that the pit is now better preserved as the historical site it is.

'tempus fugit'

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Feb 11, 2014 11:08:35   #
Ka2azman Loc: Tucson, Az
 
robert-photos wrote:
Cloudy weather elsewhere determined the death, destruction and fate of Nagasaki.

Not all that died or were maimed were guilty.... nor did they even have a voice. Many suffered for the sins of the few.


What of the sins projected upon the Koreans, what of the sins projected on the Chinese, what of the sins projected upon the Philippines, what of the sins projected upon the Hawaiian Island. Every one of these places and many more had innocent civilians (men, women, children) killed, maimed, wounded by the poor Japanese invading army.

If the many suffered for the few, it was their heritage that caused it. They believed the emperor was a god, and they would die for his safety.

Poor, poor , Japanese. Where is your symphony for those who the Japanese tortured in their medical experiments. Took civilians and gave them horrible diseases just to watch them die by the tens of thousands. Wounded them and maimed them to do medical experiments upon the innocent. That's men, women and children. The Japanese did this for many years before they bombed Pearl. The reason they didn't get the treatment like the Germany in the Nuremberg Trials is because the US wanted their records from these experiments.

The Germans civilians around the concentration camps were held responsible for not doing something about what was going on. They were forced to help burry the dead, and give aid to those that were still alive.

Poor, poor Japanese.

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Feb 11, 2014 11:24:34   #
autofocus Loc: North Central Connecticut
 
Ka2azman wrote:
What of the sins projected upon the Koreans


I have to believe that lately, Korea, Inc has gotten great satisfaction in now eating in Japan's rice bowl. Japan once was perceived to be one of the world's best suppliers of cars, electronics, optics, cameras, etc. But you can now look at the great products that are coming out of Korea, and competing directly with Japan. Samsung, LG, Hyundai, KIA, to name a few. Revenge is sweet, and takes on many forms!

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Feb 11, 2014 11:32:11   #
autofocus Loc: North Central Connecticut
 
Several years ago a good friend of mine was telling me of an experience he had while serving in the military, and on leave in Japan. He, along with a bunch of other military buddies were in a Japanese restaurant when a group of local students came over to the table and asked why the US had bombed Japan at Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Much to my friend's surprise, these local students had no knowledge that Japan had actually started the war by bombing Pearl Harbor. A classic example of revisionist re-writing history in order to paint a different picture.

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