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"Why are Camera Lenses So Big and Heavy?"
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Nov 4, 2018 13:08:14   #
imagesintime Loc: small town, mid-America
 
PHYSICS

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Nov 4, 2018 14:46:33   #
Photocraig
 
zzzynick wrote:
If you can't hold a camera and a lens, hit the gym. Muscle up. Buy a tripod, or you could always take up knitting.


Wait. Your time will come, too.

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Nov 4, 2018 15:22:16   #
User ID
 
tomad wrote:

So if I understand the article correctly, I think I have the answer
to smaller, lighter lenses on FF cameras. Put the sensor in the
lens with connections to the cameras electronics like now for
autofocus, etc. With the sensor in the lens it can be very close to
the inner element eliminating much of the "flange focal distance"
plus making the lens shorter so a low light aperture would also
require a smaller front element. Of course lenses would be more
expensive.
br So if I understand the article correctly, I th... (show quote)


Your idea has long ago been executed and is still in use,
but WITHOUT assigning a unique sensor to every lens.

In use, the sensor is dismountable from the back of the
lens, and lives in the camera body. Each lens can reach
as deeply into the body as necessary to wind up at the
optically most appropriate distance from the sensor.

IOW, you were inventing a solution to a problem that
doesn't exist. I think maybe possibly you are assuming
that a lens's rear elements must never protrude at all
beyond the rear lens flange and thus extending beyond
the body flange, and into the camera body quite close
to the sensor ? Such design prohibitions do not exist.
Plenty of lenses protrude well past the mount flanges
and rather close to the sensor.

`

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Nov 4, 2018 15:35:47   #
User ID
 
adm wrote:


........ recently watched another one of Tony Northrup's videos
saying that "Micro 4/3 is Dead." I think he is wrong ............



The part of your post that bugs me is the word "another" :-(

If you've seen ONE of his videos, or even the the first minute
of one of his videos, why would you view "another" ? ? ?

You "think" he is wrong ? You don't even have to actually pay
attention to the detils or content of a T&C video to realize it's
just pompous click bait.

OK, I can see how you hesitate, how you say "I think" instead
of saying "it's verrry obvious" .... cuz odd bits of accuracy and
fact are bound to be sprinkled into his show. Law of probability
assures us that will happen even if only by accident.

If you feel compelled to watch T&C videos, at least realize that
it's best taken as a comic satire of actual expert commentary.
It's pretty much the "SNL News" of the photo industry.

`

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Nov 4, 2018 16:05:11   #
JD750 Loc: SoCal
 
jerryc41 wrote:
It's too bad I wasn't allowed to post the link.


There are certain sites that we are prohibited from posting on UHH, and even spelling them out doesn’t work.

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Nov 4, 2018 16:33:55   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
User ID wrote:
Your idea has long ago been executed and is still in use,
but WITHOUT assigning a unique sensor to every lens.

In use, the sensor is dismountable from the back of the
lens, and lives in the camera body. Each lens can reach
as deeply into the body as necessary to wind up at the
optically most appropriate distance from the sensor.

IOW, you were inventing a solution to a problem that
doesn't exist. I think maybe possibly you are assuming
that a lens's rear elements must never protrude at all
beyond the rear lens flange and thus extending beyond
the body flange, and into the camera body quite close
to the sensor ? Such design prohibitions do not exist.
Plenty of lenses protrude well past the mount flanges
and rather close to the sensor.

`
Your idea has long ago been executed and is still ... (show quote)


Here is an example, the Canon FL 19mm lens extending close to the Film (Sensor).


(Download)

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Nov 4, 2018 16:43:18   #
Bipod
 
Architect1776 wrote:
Very good article and explains why M4/3 lenses can be fast and small with the effective focal length double a FF camera of the same mm.

Camera lenses aren't big and heavy--unless you want:

1. Larger format (without vignetting)
2. Faster lens
3. Aberrations corrected
4. Structural strength and durability
5. Zoom

Any (or all) of the above will make the lens bigger and heavier

1-3 make image quality better. So they are good things.

4 makes the lens last longer, which is a good thing.'

5 sacrifices image quality (constrast, speed, sharpness) for not having to chane
lenses. For certain types of photography that require that focal length changes
be done quickly --- action, some photojournalism, some events, and some wildlife --
zoom lenses are a necessity.. But usually a zoom is just a convenience:
cutting corners.

Also, "big and heavy" is relative--we should ask, "compared to what?"

A miniature format (= "full frame") photographer complaining about
large heavy lenses in a room full of medium format photoraphers, large format
photographers, or astronomers will not get a lot of sympathy.

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Nov 4, 2018 16:55:32   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
Bipod wrote:
Camera lenses aren't big and heavy--unless you want:

1. Larger format (without vignetting)
2. Faster lens
3. Aberrations corrected
4. Structural strength and durability
5. Zoom

Any (or all) of the above will make the lens bigger and heavier

1-3 make image quality better. So they are good things.

4 makes the lens last longer, which is a good thing.'

5 sacrifices image quality (constrast, speed, sharpness) for not having to chane
lenses. For certain types of photography that require that focal length changes
be done quickly --- action, some photojournalism, some events, and some wildlife --
zoom lenses are a necessity.. But usually a zoom is just a convenience:
cutting corners.

Also, "big and heavy" is relative--we should ask, "compared to what?"

A miniature format (= "full frame") photographer complaining about
large heavy lenses in a room full of medium format photoraphers, large format
photographers, or astronomers will not get a lot of sympathy.
Camera lenses i aren't /i big and heavy--unless... (show quote)


70-200mm f2.8 all seem to be about the same size and weight with Canon the smallest and lightest.
You can always do relative all day long and that is a silly and futile premises you state. Yes, an 18 wheeler is larger and heavier than a smart car but is a lightweight compared to the crawler that hauls NASA rockets to the launch pad. All is relative.

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Nov 4, 2018 16:57:51   #
I Derfdog
 
The transparent aluminum will probably have no chromatic aberration.
chrisg-optical wrote:
https://www.howtogeek.com/393047/why-are-camera-lenses-so-big-and-heavy/

...but appears at the top of a google search.

Ah yes the laws of physics....lens makers try to optimize with material choice (metal v plastic) and choice of maximum aperture. Maybe someday there will be a material to replace glass (other than plastics, maybe a crystalline form of graphene - diamond, or "transparent aluminum" ?) and will be significantly lighter. In the meantime, we have smaller formats such as M43, and gyms to workout for the larger formats
https://www.howtogeek.com/393047/why-are-camera-le... (show quote)

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Nov 4, 2018 16:59:21   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
I Derfdog wrote:
The transparent aluminum will probably have no chromatic aberration.


Ask Scotty, he knows how to make it.

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Nov 4, 2018 18:23:08   #
I Derfdog
 
Scotty says it's transmissivity will be 110% as an added bonus.
Architect1776 wrote:
Ask Scotty, he knows how to make it.

Reply
 
 
Nov 4, 2018 18:53:27   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
I Derfdog wrote:
Scotty says it's transmissivity will be 110% as an added bonus.



Reply
Nov 4, 2018 18:55:59   #
adm
 
User ID wrote:
The part of your post that bugs me is the word "another" :-(

If you've seen ONE of his videos, or even the the first minute
of one of his videos, why would you view "another" ? ? ?

You "think" he is wrong ? You don't even have to actually pay
attention to the detils or content of a T&C video to realize it's
just pompous click bait.

OK, I can see how you hesitate, how you say "I think" instead
of saying "it's verrry obvious" .... cuz odd bits of accuracy and
fact are bound to be sprinkled into his show. Law of probability
assures us that will happen even if only by accident.

If you feel compelled to watch T&C videos, at least realize that
it's best taken as a comic satire of actual expert commentary.
It's pretty much the "SNL News" of the photo industry.

`
The part of your post that bugs me is the word &qu... (show quote)


I did not have time to give you the full context in my earlier post but I watched it to make a comment on another forum. Predictable as it may be, I wanted to be 100 percent certain of what I was responding to. Interestingly, you are the only other person I know of that caught the tongue in cheek or comic element in TN's video. That seemed to be lost on everyone else I am aware of that commented on the other forum. The picture of him holding the huge FF DSLR and lens and the much more manageable M4/3 camera was a dead giveaway. "SNL News" of the photo industry is a good analogy.

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Nov 4, 2018 21:50:09   #
DaveyDitzer Loc: Western PA
 
zzzynick wrote:
If you can't hold a camera and a lens, hit the gym. Muscle up. Buy a tripod, or you could always take up knitting.

how is this helpful?

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Nov 4, 2018 21:59:47   #
DaveyDitzer Loc: Western PA
 
Architect1776 wrote:
Very good article and explains why M4/3 lenses can be fast and small with the effective focal length double a FF camera of the same mm.

I looked at the Oly 25mm f1.2 lens which weighs in at 410g. My Nikkor 50mm f1.4 D lens is 8 oz or about 225g. So weight savings my not be quite as expected. PS, my 35mm f1.8 Nikkor DX is about the same weight. So I have lighter lenses and in the case of my D5300 little to no weight penalty for a larger sensor.

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