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Confused? Long exposures not working out for me.
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Feb 16, 2015 15:43:51   #
minniev Loc: MIssissippi
 
SteveC_ wrote:
Thank you all for your input. I do use an ND4 filter and I have been shooting at ISO 200, which I'll drop down to 100 ISO and give it a shot. I have been shooting at f/22 and my last exposure was at 1/6 sec.

But I'm just not satisfied with the shot. When I see other photo's that look surrealistic and the water looks like smoke flowing that's the look I'm trying to accomplish.

I have edited my photo's in HDR but it just doesn't do the picture justice. Maybe I'm not using the HDR feature correctly. I take a series of three to four shots and then use HDR to bring them together then I have to play around with the settings to get the funkiness out of the picture until it looks like a photograph and not an over/under exposed shot that looks terrible.

What am I missing here? People say that and swear by HDR but I just don't really see what it does besides change the color and the softness/hardness or the strength of the detail in the picture.
Thank you all for your input. I do use an ND4 filt... (show quote)


Why don't you post a photo of yours that you're not entirely happy with and a link to one that looks the way you wish yours looked. Then we'll try to help you figure out a pathway. Personally, I don't think HDR will give you what you're describing here though, I think it's gonna be a ultra slow shutter with enough ND to keep anything from being blown out, and some specific post processing work. Probably will need to do this kind of shooting late/early with heavy cloud cover, too.

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Feb 16, 2015 15:56:22   #
mborn Loc: Massachusetts
 
SteveC_ wrote:
Thank you all for your input. I do use an ND4 filter and I have been shooting at ISO 200, which I'll drop down to 100 ISO and give it a shot. I have been shooting at f/22 and my last exposure was at 1/6 sec.

But I'm just not satisfied with the shot. When I see other photo's that look surrealistic and the water looks like smoke flowing that's the look I'm trying to accomplish.

I have edited my photo's in HDR but it just doesn't do the picture justice. Maybe I'm not using the HDR feature correctly. I take a series of three to four shots and then use HDR to bring them together then I have to play around with the settings to get the funkiness out of the picture until it looks like a photograph and not an over/under exposed shot that looks terrible.

What am I missing here? People say that and swear by HDR but I just don't really see what it does besides change the color and the softness/hardness or the strength of the detail in the picture.
Thank you all for your input. I do use an ND4 filt... (show quote)


Post a photo

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Feb 16, 2015 16:27:39   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
SteveC_ wrote:
Thank you all for your input. I do use an ND4 filter and I have been shooting at ISO 200, which I'll drop down to 100 ISO and give it a shot. I have been shooting at f/22 and my last exposure was at 1/6 sec.

But I'm just not satisfied with the shot. When I see other photo's that look surrealistic and the water looks like smoke flowing that's the look I'm trying to accomplish.

I have edited my photo's in HDR but it just doesn't do the picture justice. Maybe I'm not using the HDR feature correctly. I take a series of three to four shots and then use HDR to bring them together then I have to play around with the settings to get the funkiness out of the picture until it looks like a photograph and not an over/under exposed shot that looks terrible.

What am I missing here? People say that and swear by HDR but I just don't really see what it does besides change the color and the softness/hardness or the strength of the detail in the picture.
Thank you all for your input. I do use an ND4 filt... (show quote)


You are merging two totally different image processing techniques that produce widely different effects. HDR is simply to record a broad dynamic range - as in a sunset with the sun still in it, or a landscape where there are considerable number of bright clouds. You shoot at least 2 exposures or more, recording all the highlights at the expense of shadows, and all the shadows at the expense of the highlights, and merge them together. Tone mapping, the other part if HDR, is where you compress the tonal range of a 32 bit file into a 16 or 8 bit file. Many HDR processors also provide control over clipping, microcontrast, HDR "effect" saturation, black and white levels- to provide either a very natural looking image or one that is IMHO - pretty weird and abstract.

An ND4 filter is quite weak at just two stops, and it is usually not enough. Usually for daylight shots, you will need an ND400, and or ND32 or 64 for best results.

And you might really want to consider the damage done to your image by using F22.

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Feb 16, 2015 17:26:06   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
Thank you for your advise, I have copied it and will try it when I go out next time. I have used the metering on my camera but I guess I'm not really sure how or what I'm trying to do with it. Still learning spot metering. Anyway I have played around with the metering on my camera body and will try to figure out how to change the stops to the plus or minus.


The first picture is the one I took and the other one is what I'm trying to achieve. See the difference.





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Feb 16, 2015 17:28:13   #
minniev Loc: MIssissippi
 
SteveC_ wrote:
Thank you for your advise, I have copied it and will try it when I go out next time. I have used the metering on my camera but I guess I'm not really sure how or what I'm trying to do with it. Still learning spot metering. Anyway I have played around with the metering on my camera body and will try to figure out how to change the stops to the plus or minus.


The first picture is the one I took and the other one is what I'm trying to achieve. See the difference.


What were your settings on your photo? If you can, reload it and check the box that says "store original right beside the "choose file" box so we can see the exif info and the larger version, that'll help us help you...

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Feb 16, 2015 17:39:53   #
TheDman Loc: USA
 
SteveC_ wrote:
Thank you for your advise, I have copied it and will try it when I go out next time. I have used the metering on my camera but I guess I'm not really sure how or what I'm trying to do with it. Still learning spot metering. Anyway I have played around with the metering on my camera body and will try to figure out how to change the stops to the plus or minus.


The first picture is the one I took and the other one is what I'm trying to achieve. See the difference.


The difference I see is that one is in direct, harsh sunlight while the other is in a dark forest. There's your first clue...

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Feb 16, 2015 17:50:16   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
ok here it is:


(Download)



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Feb 16, 2015 17:52:50   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
True I see that now as well. Thanks lets keep going....:o)

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Feb 16, 2015 17:57:29   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
Aw ok that's tells me a lot, thanks. So my f-stops should be less maybe?

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Feb 16, 2015 18:33:39   #
minniev Loc: MIssissippi
 
SteveC_ wrote:
ok here it is:


Initial thoughts - you do have too much light as you suspected. You've lost detail in the brightest parts of the water. Worse, it has gone gray on you. Not sure if this is capture or processing.

1. The day is way too bright - sunny cloudless summer day, mid morning. Should have tried just before sunrise, just after sunset, or on a gloomy heavily clouded day. At mid morning on a day like this you have many enemies: too bright, white water, too much reflectivity, harsh shadows, color casts.
2. Need better camera control of light: ISO at 100 or camera's lowest, stronger ND filter.
3. Shutter speed might have worked. My wild guess is that 1/2 second would be better.
4. Tripod is a necessity, but be sure to turn off stabilization while on tripod.
5. Shoot in raw. You will have more leeway to regain some lost detail in the highlights. In jpeg, it is just gone.
6. Try using a lens hood or shade the lens. Take off any excess glass such as a UV filter.
7. Though an aperture of 22 is not ideal, that is not the cause of this problem. If you have to go to 22 to get the effect you want, do it. Worry about diffraction later.
8. I do not think HDR will help.
9. Checking the histogram and blinkies after each shot will tell you a lot. I usually don't use spot metering on waterfalls unless there is a part in bright sun that I'm trying to protect, kind of like I do with a white bird, but it might have helped you here.

The good news is that this fountain can give you many chances to reshoot and try different things. When I planned my first trip to a waterfall-laden area, I made frequent trips to the local zoo which has a few ugly fake waterfalls in exhibits. I know people thought I was nuts shooting those hideous things with no animals around, with a tripod, but it helped me figure some things out before I headed out on my trip.

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Feb 16, 2015 18:35:08   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
So from my understanding f/22 will washout the photo but a lower f/stop helps the photo a great deal. Plus using a ND 32/64 or 400 will help accomplish the results that I'm looking for. Am I on the right track here?

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Feb 16, 2015 18:39:55   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
Great thank you so much, you have given me a lot of variables that I can try. I see where I have made my mistakes and have gone to ebay a purchased new ND filters in the range that will help me greatly.
I'm on the right track now with all of your help and input.

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Feb 16, 2015 18:42:13   #
SteveC_ Loc: Oklahoma
 
I want to thank all of you for your help and input it has been a great help to me. Now the rest is up to me to go and practice and keep trying and with all of the suggestions I have received I can't fail...LOL

If any of you still have information you want to give please feel free to do so. God bless you all....

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Feb 16, 2015 18:46:24   #
minniev Loc: MIssissippi
 
SteveC_ wrote:
So from my understanding f/22 will washout the photo but a lower f/stop helps the photo a great deal. Plus using a ND 32/64 or 400 will help accomplish the results that I'm looking for. Am I on the right track here?


Most lenses suffer from diffraction problems by f22, but the problem in your photo is not diffraction, it is overexposure which can be helped by a small aperture and stronger ND filters, lower ISO and more appropriate shooting conditions. There is some difference in language that people use to describe the strengths or identify ND filters. Here is a link that can help you understand which language is equivalent to which language. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutral_density_filter

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Feb 16, 2015 18:50:47   #
noel Loc: Virginia
 
SteveC_ wrote:
Aw ok that's tells me a lot, thanks. So my f-stops should be less maybe?


In the first photo which is taken ih sunshine you need to further
darken the scene with additional ND filters and increase your
shutter speed to a second or more..
the second photo shows a already dark scene, the water spot-metered and the speed is probably around 1-5 seconds.My 2 cents.......

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