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Closeup, not macro tips, for outdoor flowers
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Jun 8, 2019 08:51:13   #
Wasabi
 
kymarto wrote:
My personal tips are two: do not be afraid to use large apertures and try to shoot against the light, or at least with something other than flat light with the sun at your back. I use old vintage lenses for the bokeh, but this applies also to modern lenses. Here are a few examples


Your flowers are beautiful. I also use a Sony camera and have a few older lenses. I will have to practice with more thoughtful patience. What lens did you use to get those shots?

Wasabi

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Jun 8, 2019 09:09:42   #
pithydoug Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY
 
Taz1 wrote:
Have a Nikon d7500, lenses: 70-300 3.5-5.6 zoom, 80-200 2.8 zoom, 85 1.8, and a couple of kit lenses. Love to do closeup photos of flowers. Got great results with a pocket Canon, but would like to take up this hobby with my Nikon for better results. Any tips on which lens in my bag would be good for closeup flower pics and settings to use? Would like to get more practice before looking into a macro lens. Help would be appreciated.


A set of extension tubes will really let you get close-up.

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Jun 8, 2019 09:36:00   #
Kaib795 Loc: Maryland, USA
 
kymarto wrote:
My personal tips are two: do not be afraid to use large apertures and try to shoot against the light, or at least with something other than flat light with the sun at your back. I use old vintage lenses for the bokeh, but this applies also to modern lenses. Here are a few examples


I don't actually shoot creatively like this but more to show, in detail, the flowers ... usually at all stages in one shot. But that being said, I really like your red flowers where you have some in the background in various stages of focus. These are very well done and creative. Thanks for sharing, I will try this as there are many old film lenses at my disposal with wide apertures waiting for these shots. Cheers

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Jun 8, 2019 10:02:16   #
CO
 
Gene51 wrote:
At a maximum ratio of 1:5.9 it hardly fits into the widely accepted "macro range" of 1:2 or larger, regardless of how loosely Nikon interprets their lenses.

True "macro" Nikkor lenses have not existed since the 70s when they were made as part of the Multiphot Photomacrographic System. They were 19mm, 35mm, 60mm and 120mm and had a image circle that could cover 4x5 None of those lenses focused to infinity, but if you had the entire set, you could focus from 1:1 down to 40:1 (the image on the film/sensor is 40x larger than real life.

This makes every other lens made by Nikon technically a Micro-Nikkor, but they do make a distinction in that all of their lenses with the Micro designation do focus to infinity all the way down to 1:1 ratio.

http://www.savazzi.net/photography/macronikkors.htm

https://nikonrumors.com/2010/12/14/guest-post-nikkor-19mm-f2-8-macro-lens-review.aspx/
At a maximum ratio of 1:5.9 it hardly fits into th... (show quote)


I'm very aware that the 1:5.9 ratio does not fit into a macro range. Did you read the OP's original post? Read what he is saying. He wants to know which of his current lenses would be best to practice with before he purchases a macro lens. He wasn't asking about future lenses.

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Jun 8, 2019 10:17:05   #
abc1234 Loc: Elk Grove Village, Illinois
 
While everyone here wants to get close to the subject, I get away from it. My typical setup is a Canon 80D with a Sigma 70-200, f/2.8, on a tripod. The focal length is 200 mm and I move the camera closer or further to compose. I generally shoot one flower at a time and like bokeh to remove distractions from the background. If you are lucky, an insect will stop by. This setup gives much better detail than being close. The aperture is usually about f/5.6 which optimizes the optical sharpness, gives decent depth of field which is much less critical when shooting close. The shutter is about 1/200 to eliminate any motion of the flower due to air movement. ISO is auto.

With this camera, I bracket +/- 2/3 stop and set the shutter mode to high speed. One push of the shutter button gives you three bracketed shots in the blink of an eye. I prefer shooting on overcast or cloudy days when the light is very soft. Otherwise, the contrast can get out of control. Shooting after the rain is nice because of the water droplets remaining on the petals. Rainless days are good too. Just bring a spray bottle and mist the flower.

The dehaze and clarity settings in LR are great for bringing out details.


(Download)


(Download)

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Jun 8, 2019 10:21:18   #
agillot
 
buy a macro extension tubes set , will work on any size lens , i sometime use it on a older 800mm to get closer ., for nikon , the part number is MK-N-AF-1-B , brand name MEIKE . come in 3 sizes , you use 1 or all 3 depending on the magnification you want .very inexpensive , well made .

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Jun 8, 2019 10:31:40   #
Todd G
 
I used my 55-250 then a 24mm pancake before I got 2 macro lens which are great for flowers. I use them a lot for that. I have a 35mm and a 105mm I'm hoping for some cool bug pics when I travel later. Not much bugs here in San Diego

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Jun 8, 2019 10:33:19   #
Kaib795 Loc: Maryland, USA
 
abc1234 wrote:
While everyone here wants to get close to the subject, I get away from it. My typical setup is a Canon 80D with a Sigma 70-200, f/2.8, on a tripod. The focal length is 200 mm and I move the camera closer or further to compose. I generally shoot one flower at a time and like bokeh to remove distractions from the background. If you are lucky, an insect will stop by. This setup gives much better detail than being close. The aperture is usually about f/5.6 which optimizes the optical sharpness, gives decent depth of field which is much less critical when shooting close. The shutter is about 1/200 to eliminate any motion of the flower due to air movement. ISO is auto.

With this camera, I bracket +/- 2/3 stop and set the shutter mode to high speed. One push of the shutter button gives you three bracketed shots in the blink of an eye. I prefer shooting on overcast or cloudy days when the light is very soft. Otherwise, the contrast can get out of control. Shooting after the rain is nice because of the water droplets remaining on the petals. Rainless days are good too. Just bring a spray bottle and mist the flower.

The dehaze and clarity settings in LR are great for bringing out details.
While everyone here wants to get close to the subj... (show quote)


All great suggestions, of which I use them all. The idea of using a telephoto lens opens the doors for those without the Macro lens and can dabble right away. "Some" simply like the drop of DoF and use big telephotos and just don't want a Macro. I find using a Macro has one distinct advantage, all the different angles you can shoot from, say under the flower (where you cannot get far enough away using a telephoto. But it's all good in that it opens new doors to your photography and keeps the creative mind flowing. Many who do the telephoto shots hand carry the camera. With the Macro lens, to get really sharp pictures, I'm using a tripod. Again, two different ways to approach the shot. If you never take it ... you'll never know what could have been. Soon after many pictures, you'll know what you need and get your perfect lens.



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Jun 8, 2019 10:37:37   #
BebuLamar
 
Gene51 wrote:
At a maximum ratio of 1:5.9 it hardly fits into the widely accepted "macro range" of 1:2 or larger, regardless of how loosely Nikon interprets their lenses.

True "macro" Nikkor lenses have not existed since the 70s when they were made as part of the Multiphot Photomacrographic System. They were 19mm, 35mm, 60mm and 120mm and had a image circle that could cover 4x5 None of those lenses focused to infinity, but if you had the entire set, you could focus from 1:1 down to 40:1 (the image on the film/sensor is 40x larger than real life.

This makes every other lens made by Nikon technically a Micro-Nikkor, but they do make a distinction in that all of their lenses with the Micro designation do focus to infinity all the way down to 1:1 ratio.

http://www.savazzi.net/photography/macronikkors.htm

https://nikonrumors.com/2010/12/14/guest-post-nikkor-19mm-f2-8-macro-lens-review.aspx/
At a maximum ratio of 1:5.9 it hardly fits into th... (show quote)


Manual Focus Micro Nikkor (Pre AI and AI lenses) only focus to 1:1 with an extension tube.

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Jun 8, 2019 11:12:10   #
kymarto Loc: Portland OR and Milan Italy
 
Gene51 wrote:
At a maximum ratio of 1:5.9 it hardly fits into the widely accepted "macro range" of 1:2 or larger, regardless of how loosely Nikon interprets their lenses.

True "macro" Nikkor lenses have not existed since the 70s when they were made as part of the Multiphot Photomacrographic System. They were 19mm, 35mm, 60mm and 120mm and had a image circle that could cover 4x5 None of those lenses focused to infinity, but if you had the entire set, you could focus from 1:1 down to 40:1 (the image on the film/sensor is 40x larger than real life.

This makes every other lens made by Nikon technically a Micro-Nikkor, but they do make a distinction in that all of their lenses with the Micro designation do focus to infinity all the way down to 1:1 ratio.

http://www.savazzi.net/photography/macronikkors.htm

https://nikonrumors.com/2010/12/14/guest-post-nikkor-19mm-f2-8-macro-lens-review.aspx/
At a maximum ratio of 1:5.9 it hardly fits into th... (show quote)


Actually Nikon (and others) made specialized lenses that were both faster and for closer focus and with more resolving power than the Macro Nikkors. One was the Repro Nikkor (85mm f1.0) made specifically for 1:1 copying. Another was the CRT Nikkor-O 55mm f1.2, specifically for photographing oscilloscope traces at 1:0.5x, but also usable closer.

The real champs were the Ultra Micro Nikkors, ranging from 17 to 165mm, which were some of the highest resolving lenses ever produced, with average resolution of 200-300 lp/mm (40 lp/mm is already considered excellent with the best modern lenses). These lenses were used for photomasking for old printed circuit boards. They were made for various purposes at various magnifications, some of them for extreme macro work.

I have a few of these lenses, and will show you the results with a modern mirrorless camera, many at longer focusing distances to take advantage of their unique bokeh.

Repro Nikkor 85mm f1.0
Repro Nikkor 85mm f1.0...
(Download)

Repro Nikkor 85mm f1.0
Repro Nikkor 85mm f1.0...
(Download)

Repro Nikkor 85mm f1.0
Repro Nikkor 85mm f1.0...
(Download)

CRT Nikkor 55mm f1.2
CRT Nikkor 55mm f1.2...
(Download)

CRT Nikkor 55mm f1.2
CRT Nikkor 55mm f1.2...
(Download)

Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4
Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4...
(Download)

Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4
Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4...
(Download)

Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4
Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4...
(Download)

Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4
Ultra Micro Nikkor 165mm f4...
(Download)

Drop of water falling into a fountain pool with Ultra Micro Nikkor. This is a crop of 20% of the frame, just to demonstrate the incredible sharpness of this lens
Drop of water falling into a fountain pool with Ul...
(Download)

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Jun 8, 2019 11:14:56   #
abc1234 Loc: Elk Grove Village, Illinois
 
Kaib795 wrote:
All great suggestions, of which I use them all. The idea of using a telephoto lens opens the doors for those without the Macro lens and can dabble right away. "Some" simply like the drop of DoF and use big telephotos and just don't want a Macro. I find using a Macro has one distinct advantage, all the different angles you can shoot from, say under the flower (where you cannot get far enough away using a telephoto. But it's all good in that it opens new doors to your photography and keeps the creative mind flowing. Many who do the telephoto shots hand carry the camera. With the Macro lens, to get really sharp pictures, I'm using a tripod. Again, two different ways to approach the shot. If you never take it ... you'll never know what could have been. Soon after many pictures, you'll know what you need and get your perfect lens.
All great suggestions, of which I use them all. Th... (show quote)


I started with the Canon 100 mm macro which was a very sharp lens. I had to get very close which meant depth of field was very shallow and working with a tripod was all but impossible. Holding the camera steady while the flower was moving in the breeze was quite a challenge. After hundreds of shots and several years, I tried the telephoto approach. It worked great and I sold the Canon.

If you get what you want with your close setup, fine. I offer my approach only as an alternative..

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Jun 8, 2019 11:22:04   #
Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington
 
via the lens wrote:
The lens you choose depends on the vision you have for the end result and the variables taking place that day. Each shoot is different. Get a vision, choose the correct lens, and practice. There is no one lens that is perfect.
I would add to Connie's excellent advice: no one can suggest "settings" without knowing the weather and lighting conditions and what you want as a result. Three examples:

1. If the wind is blowing, you'll either choose a faster shutter speed to prevent subject blur, or you'll take advantage of the wind and do a more artistic interpretation with slower shutter speed.

2. Your depth of field is controlled by aperture. You may want a very shallow depth of field, just a tiny bit of the subject in focus, or you may want the entire composition in focus.

3. It's all about the LIGHT! Do you need/want an exposure that will keep a shadowed background dark? An example posted this morning by Islandgal - the last photo in the set: https://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-595549-1.html

Do controlled tests, analyze the results, and learn.

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Jun 8, 2019 11:26:16   #
olemikey Loc: 6 mile creek, Spacecoast Florida
 
boberic wrote:
I shoot flowers with an 18-200 lens so your 80-200 is far more than acceptable. A coupla hints. Get as close as is possible, use a tripod. Shoot as high an ISO as is necessary to use high shutter speeds. Flowers move, even in a slight breeze thst the reason for higher speeds. Watch for "petal clipping" it can happen. Pic included. Those blue flowers annoy the hell out of me


They do jump around don't they!! Breeze can be so slight you hardly feel it and the petals are fluttering. Good light, or reflected light and high shutter speed (at least equal to or greater than lens focal length), float the ISO (or float with limit established, or don't if you don't want to), stop down to at least the sweet spot and see what you get. The 80-200 is great, and I bet that 85 makes a fine flower portrait! Have fun!

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Jun 8, 2019 11:45:09   #
Islandgal Loc: Vancouver Island, British Columbia. Canada
 
kymarto wrote:
Actually Nikon (and others) made specialized lenses that were both faster and for closer focus and with more resolving power than the Macro Nikkors. One was the Repro Nikkor (85mm f1.0) made specifically for 1:1 copying. Another was the CRT Nikkor-O 55mm f1.2, specifically for photographing oscilloscope traces at 1:0.5x, but also usable closer.

The real champs were the Ultra Micro Nikkors, ranging from 17 to 165mm, which were some of the highest resolving lenses ever produced, with average resolution of 200-300 lp/mm (40 lp/mm is already considered excellent with the best modern lenses). These lenses were used for photomasking for old printed circuit boards. They were made for various purposes at various magnifications, some of them for extreme macro work.

I have a few of these lenses, and will show you the results with a modern mirrorless camera, many at longer focusing distances to take advantage of their unique bokeh.
Actually Nikon (and others) made specialized lense... (show quote)


Incredible beauty as always kymarto.

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Jun 8, 2019 12:19:27   #
Architect1776 Loc: In my mind
 
Taz1 wrote:
Have a Nikon d7500, lenses: 70-300 3.5-5.6 zoom, 80-200 2.8 zoom, 85 1.8, and a couple of kit lenses. Love to do closeup photos of flowers. Got great results with a pocket Canon, but would like to take up this hobby with my Nikon for better results. Any tips on which lens in my bag would be good for closeup flower pics and settings to use? Would like to get more practice before looking into a macro lens. Help would be appreciated.


Your 80-200 will do most flowers well unless they are quite small.
I find that the breeze has a tendency to make it difficult to get photos unless it is one of those absolutely calm early mornings. It helps to use a flash, preferably not the built in one,to freeze any slight motion then wait between "gusts". A tripod helps as well and I try to use an aperture to give enough DOF to have most the flower in focus. When close, most likely, the background will not be sharp at f8 with the flower mostly sharp.
Practice with settings is best for you to do. Exposures are free now, not like film days. So experiment with hundreds of combinations and see what suits you personally.
Have fun.

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