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Waterfall cream - Techniques?
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Apr 7, 2019 09:03:55   #
sb Loc: Florida's East Coast
 
The top photo may be impaired by haze, but it also looks like the focus was on the dirt in the foreground.

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Apr 7, 2019 09:48:01   #
mizzee Loc: Boston,Ma
 
I would use a plain old 6 or 10 stop Nd. I tried the variable Nd but moisture got in between the elements and I couldn’t get rid of it. Also make sure your tripod is plenty sturdy!

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Apr 7, 2019 10:54:03   #
SpyderJan Loc: New Smyrna Beach. FL
 
Bill Munny wrote:
Might try this method, which will cause a lot of grumbling from others.

Bracket your shots with the shutter speed around 1/250 or higher. Do not change anything and take at least 5 shots, maybe up to 10 shots or more. Make sure your camera is on a sturdy tripod (you can get vibration from the water if the falls are close and surging). Do this method for different locations of the same waterfall. Then, when you get home, do your post processing with stacking (this is not an HDR stack method since you have changed nothing). The only thing that changed is the water. When doing the stacking try it with 3, 5, 7 and 10 files, and you will find the right number of files to use. I really like doing this because you don't have a bunch of shake and no messing around with the ND filters. Good luck and if you do use this method I would love to see your results.
Might try this method, which will cause a lot of g... (show quote)


Great idea Bill. I am going to try that.

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Apr 7, 2019 10:59:02   #
Dr.Nikon Loc: Honolulu Hawaii
 
An ND10 does and will do wonders ...😎👏👏👏

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Apr 7, 2019 11:26:05   #
Chuckwal Loc: Boynton Beach Florida
 
Excellent set the water looks good i use a ND2 and dehaze the 1st
you're on the right track look on u tube
chuck

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Apr 7, 2019 12:52:00   #
Bill Munny Loc: Aurora, Colorado
 
crazydaddio wrote:
Will try it....I would think that the wind would need to be 0 with leaf movement etc wrecking the bracketing. I suppose you could go into photoshop and mask the water area with the bracketed shots and then just use one of shots to do the unmasked areas around the water so the tree/leaf/cloud movement would be eliminated...


When you set up the stacking, check mark the "remove ghosting" box. That will help alleviate leaf movement and wind movement. You want the water movement so try it without the ghosting box checked also. See which is more desirable to you.

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Apr 7, 2019 13:29:16   #
willaim Loc: Sunny Southern California
 
Use the lowest ISO your camera provides and if the ND filter gives you some trouble use a polarizing filter. Slow shutter speed and steady the tripod.

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Apr 7, 2019 14:07:14   #
bwana Loc: Bergen, Alberta, Canada
 
crazydaddio wrote:
Looking for some techniques for creating that creamy waterfall look.
I will post what I do and others please chime in with any other techniques.
Posting some pics here and if you pixel peep you will see there is the effects of vibration or lens issue...not sure which. I was using my 70D with 24-70F4LIS lens so not the highest quality setup and I was in a rush so the trek guide pushed the button for me (2 sec delay). if you look at the little petals on the rocks you can see the effects of the lens or camera movement. Generally pleased given the setup time I had but I am not sure how much better they can be. I don't know what I should expect.
The tall waterfall was with a 5dMkiv with 70-200 on a tripod.
What would I do differently to get better/sharper pics?
(they are heavily edited in LR ...no Photoshop).

So far, here is what I do:
Tripod
ND Variable filter
Mirrorlock up
Triggered or 10sec delay (allow any mirror slap vibration or "human shutter button pushing" to settle out.
Tried to stay out of the wind. (there was very little to none)

Q:
1) How much does the quality of the tripod contribute to the shake? (I had my BeFree travel tripod which is well undersized I think.)
2) Would shooting with a prime make a difference in the sharpness? (ie I am expecting to much pixel peeping goodness from the 24-70 and the 70-200?)
3) Do I need to be using a 50mp sensor camera to capture more detail?
4) How much does the ND filter affect sharpness/detail (using a Hoya Variable ND circular filter)

Any additional tricks or techniques would be appreciated.

Thanks.
Looking for some techniques for creating that crea... (show quote)

I used to shoot long exposures with tripods and ND filters; no more!

I now just shoot lots of normal exposures (subs), and align and stack them. Depending on the number of subs you use in your postprocessing you can pretty much get any final result you want, from rough'ish to totally smooth.

You also don't have to worry about your human target moving during a long exposure; simply overlay the best sub on the final image.

This approach is also very useful if you have a lot people milling around in front of your target. Space your subs a few seconds, or even minutes apart then use HDR to process your image. The people in front of your target are considered 'ghosts' and removed from the final result; beautiful.

I use Affinity Photo for all my stacking and HDR processing.

bwa

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Apr 7, 2019 15:12:34   #
crazydaddio Loc: Toronto Ontario Canada
 
rond-photography wrote:
I have a question first of all - did you shut off image stabilization on the tall falls? On a tripod, that can cause blurriness as the camera tries to stabilize a stable image.
It appears to be a hazy day. Misty, perhaps. That will also give you the blur seen throughout the photo. Not a bad thing - I often get up on a foggy day and jump in the car to shoot! You will never get ultra sharp photos in those conditions, though. It is like shooting through a pane of glass with a slight fog on it.
Also, F18 could be less sharp, but to get the low shutter speed, probably the best you can do.

In the photo with the people, I see it could be a little sharper. Once again - image stabilization on? Is the ND filter introducing haze? Try some shots with and without and compare.

Last, yes, your tripod could do it. I have a MeFoto travel tripod and when I rented a Nikon D700 to try before deciding on my Olympus, I found that the tripod is definitely not up to the task of such a heavy camera. I got a much better, carbon tripod (Feisol) and not much will move it.
I have a question first of all - did you shut off ... (show quote)


IS was on I believe but I may have shut it off as I was trying different methods (IS on/off, F8-F18, playing with ISO/SS/ND gradient to see which combo was most effective for getting the blur and still getting the exposure I wanted.

It was a hazy day and yes, its several miles away across the canyon. There was haze and that for sure could have affected the AF. (I tried Liveview and Mirror down AF with triggers and also withg 10sec timer on the shuttger release.

...and I like the fog too....
see photo I got on the same day at the top of the Na Pali coast :-)

....will look into the tripod upgrade I think...


(Download)

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Apr 7, 2019 15:16:52   #
crazydaddio Loc: Toronto Ontario Canada
 
tcthome wrote:
Sometimes keeping your hand with slight downward pressure on your set up helps with vibration on a tripod. I think Moose Peterson ( & maybe Steve Perry) have vids on you tube on this subject. I gave tried this with a longer lens & it does work.


Thanks.
I do this with my monopod when shooting sports/BIF as iit helps me isolate the target but thought that my own body movements even with the downward pressure would mess-up a longer exposure shot on a tripod.

(Works great for trying to find the receiver in a football game through the viewfinder and getting the spot-AF on the target....wasnt sure it would be as good given the lack of sturdiness of the travel tripod. I will try it next time nonetheless....can't hurt and I have lots of "film" :-)

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Apr 7, 2019 15:18:07   #
crazydaddio Loc: Toronto Ontario Canada
 
mizzee wrote:
I would use a plain old 6 or 10 stop Nd. I tried the variable Nd but moisture got in between the elements and I couldn’t get rid of it. Also make sure your tripod is plenty sturdy!


hmmm...will check for moisture.....never thought of that...

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Apr 7, 2019 15:46:49   #
Chris Hayes
 
Go to Steve Perry's website or search YouTube for his video on using a tripod. He also has a video on waterfalls i believe. Moose Peterson uses the same technique. Sturdy Tripod light downward pressure on the lens right above the tripod.
Buy the best and sturdiest tripod you can fund. Anything less will disappoint you, just be prepared to carry the weight.

Chris

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Apr 7, 2019 16:27:37   #
crazydaddio Loc: Toronto Ontario Canada
 
Chris Hayes wrote:
Go to Steve Perry's website or search YouTube for his video on using a tripod. He also has a video on waterfalls i believe. Moose Peterson uses the same technique. Sturdy Tripod light downward pressure on the lens right above the tripod.
Buy the best and sturdiest tripod you can fund. Anything less will disappoint you, just be prepared to carry the weight.

Chris

It's a good technique and I use it on my monopod when shooting sports/wildlife (I dont have a Gimbel/Gitzo setup....although all my research and this thread is convincing me I will have to spend the $ to get a properly stabilized setup to shoot long exposure)

Rather than speculate (like I did to the previous poster), I watched Steve Perry's video on the subject and he has confirmed for me that the "downward pressure" for a long lens is for shooting sports/BIF/or non-moving wildlife stabilized down to about 1/15 sec @600mm. I am shooting at around 0.3 to 2sec...not exactly "long exposure" but probably longer than I want anything to be "touching the setup" ....whether my hand, eye socket, fingers on the shutter, wind etc. Hence I use Mirror-up with trigger or mirror-up with 10sec delay. (Focus in Liveview and shoot in Non-live view mode so I dont need to touch the setup to trigger the photo).

...and SteveP uses IS (or VR in his nikon case) to further help stabilize in the case of shotting wildlife.

The IS activates at half press but is otherwise off, if shooting long exposure, does the IS turn off after 2 sec in the long exposure? I can see this having a negative effect unless the IS stays on between the shutter opening and closing...I will need to research that unless someone has the answer.

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Apr 7, 2019 16:37:21   #
Chris Hayes
 
Agreed.
Steve is a wildlife shooter and a such his advice is best for such situations. Obviously for landscapes a locked down ball head or gimbal is much better. The point i was originally making is its the tripod that forms the basis for all such photography. I copied Steve with his Gitzo/Wimberly set up and have been very happy with it. I use a larger ball head for fixed landscape shots, when i do them.
I love the Gitzo, but its a heavy and cumbersome beast to lug around, so it gets left at home unless i am traveling by car. Air travel leaves the Gitzo left at home.
I just confess when i use the Nikon 200-500 i leave the VR on and have not seen any issues with it on. Usually its just that i forget to turn it off.

Chris

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Apr 7, 2019 21:38:22   #
Blair Shaw Jr Loc: Dunnellon,Florida
 
What a great last image of the two people. Lovely technique.

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