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Mirrorless or not?
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May 27, 2024 18:05:26   #
woodyH
 
I don't have either but do have a professional friend who does. She says the 8 solves the 'problems' which come with the 9. Don't knows what they are, altho weight & bulk may be a part; it would seem worthwhile looking at both cameras with that skepticism in mind.

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May 27, 2024 18:15:04   #
photoman43
 
Brionjames wrote:
I have been toying with updating to mirrorless, z8 or z9.
I have nikon currently, and although my lenses will not work without an adapter, I don't think there is anything out there that will beat the nikon z cameras.
But do I need to go z9, or will z8 be all I need?, I shoot mostly wildlife, birds, and the odd sunset, and landscape.
Money is limited, so at first I will be using my current lenses with adapters, I have a few native prime lenses, and a couple of zoom lenses, including a nikon 200/500 , and a sigma 60/600, and a 50/500 bigma.
Anyone got any advice, from what I have read the z8 is just a smaller z9, with only a few less features.
It is so difficult to decide, as this will most likely be my last camera purchase.
I have been toying with updating to mirrorless, z8... (show quote)


I am late to the response game. Only you can decide if a Z8 or Z9 is the mirrorless body for you. $, size and weight are issues for some. So are other features. I got the Z9 when there was no Z8. Today I would still get the Z9 as I prefer the built in battery grip for a more robust and longer lasting battery and for shooting verticals. And my D850 and D500 both have battery grips. I use all three with F mount and Z mount tele lenses (Z9 only).

Regarding lenses, I think you may need $$$ for some new Z mount lenses. Try using your existing lenses with the adapter to see if the images meet your standards. Do not be surprised if may need to upgrade some of your glass regardless of which Z body you get--Z8 or Z9.

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May 27, 2024 18:15:36   #
Thomas902 Loc: Washington DC
 
"The things you’re paying Z8 prices for... are not really useful for IR photography".
Really Jim Ward Photography? And just how many commercial assignments have you shot that predicated the use of IR Imagery?

FYI: I've worked for both the Maryland Geological Survey and the Washington County, Maryland Planning Commission during which time I was paid to shoot Color-Infrared (CIR) aerial photography

BTW; Color-infrared (CIR) aerial photography is often called "false color" photography because it renders the scene in colors not normally seen by the human eye--is widely used for interpretation of natural resources. Atmospheric haze does not interfere with the acquisition of the image.

Live vegetation is almost always associated with red tones. Very intense reds indicate dense, vigorously growing vegetation. As plant vigor decreases, the vegetation appears as lighter shades of red and pink, various shades of greens, and possibly tans.

Bare soils appear as shades of white, blue, or green in most agricultural regions. In general, darker shades of each color indicate moister soil.

Jim Ward Photography unless you have extensive experience in CIR I believe you may owe Larry Page an apology.
Sadly UHH abounds with those claiming expertise yet when pressed they deploy arm waving rather than validation imagery.

Speaking of which... posted below is Color-infrared (CIR) aerial photography out of my Nikon F2 with a 50mm f/2.0 Nikkor and Y48 Yellow Filter. This June 1972 mission was during Hurricane Agnes to document potential flood damage to Washington County's Historical Stone Arch Bridges... More specifically the one over the Antietam... a.k.a. Battle of Antietam the bloodiest conflict in the History of the United States. It was said that the Antietam ran red with blood through Sharpsburg.

Note: These structures where constructed with approaches lower than there arch clearance which saved them from total destruction during Hurricane Agnes in 1972, the deadliest storm ever to hit Maryland.

I was shooting out of the copilot's seat on a two place helicopter and it was during horrific turbulence...
The craft was being bounced around like a "Candle in the Wind" way more excitement than I had ever planned for. However the Washington County Engineer with extremely pleased with the images.

I suggest that you please post you IR imagery Jim Ward Photography to validate your expertise in IR...
Thank you for your thoughtful consideration here...


(Download)

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May 27, 2024 18:31:18   #
bwana Loc: Bergen, Alberta, Canada
 
Longshadow wrote:
"...you might want to consider a mirrorless system since it has pretty much taken over the market."
????

So if something takes over the market it must be good, eh?
Forget investigating something's attributes/detriments to see if it will work for you and make one's own decision.
Just follow the crowd.
Requires no thinking or analyzing.

Or have they taken over the market because manufacturers have quit/reduced making DSLRs.....
And good sales hype.

A bit of both. They're 1) great cameras and 2) manufacturers have reduced making DSLRs.

bwa

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May 27, 2024 18:45:53   #
larryepage Loc: North Texas area
 
bwana wrote:
A bit of both. They're 1) great cameras and 2) manufacturer have reduced making DSLRs.

bwa


One complicating factor that I didn't mention in my first response is that it can be a challenge right now to find nice D850s or D500s, in particular. D500s in particular, are many times heavily used and not well cared for. Some have obviously been dropped, and some have bent front plates, meaning that lenses do not mount perpendicular to the sensor. I buy D500s to give as gifts, but have suspended all sight-unseen purchases for now and now will only buy cameras that I can inspect first.

D850s aren't quite as bad, but I've encountered several that are dirty and just cosmetically poor.

So if you go that direction, shop carefully.

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May 27, 2024 18:49:13   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States
 
bwana wrote:
A bit of both. They're 1) great cameras and 2) manufacturer have reduced making DSLRs.

bwa

Oh yea, I forgot, latest and greatest...

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May 27, 2024 19:46:29   #
Vladimir200 Loc: Beaumont, Ca.
 
I don't care at all about keeping up with the Joneses. When my son-in-law asked me a year ago if I was going to trade in my D850 and accompanying lenses for a mirrorless camera, I told him: "Absolutely no.........are you crazy?" . Now, for the present: I've had my Z8 for about 5 months now and love it along with my two Z lenses. Bottom line: Sometimes it is not what we "need", but what we "want". My justification? I'm about to turn 81 and I decided I "wanted" the Z8 and by golly, I'm going to get it. BTW (I'm smiling while I'm typing this). I worked hard all of my life and I deserve it (more smiling). I absolutely love the Z8 and coming from a D850, that's saying a lot. I think Nikon was targeting the D850 users with the Z8. Anyhow, the Z8 auto focus is crazy accurate. It will also get you 20 shots per second in RAW at burst.That will stop action when grandson playing sports. If you want to go more crazy, it will get you 30 in jpeg, and even more with other settings. So, all I can say is we're all having photo fun regardless of whatever model we're shooting with. Oh, btw, a friend bought the Z9 as soon as it came out and then sold it and purchased the Z8 when it came out. Z8 cheaper and lots of us really have no use for the heavier weight and extra expense of the vertical grip on the Z9. Again, here is our (photographers) motto: We don't need sound reason when we are hit with GAS......we just do it :). Have fun.

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May 27, 2024 20:25:26   #
bwana Loc: Bergen, Alberta, Canada
 
Vladimir200 wrote:
I don't care at all about keeping up with the Joneses. When my son-in-law asked me a year ago if I was going to trade in my D850 and accompanying lenses for a mirrorless camera, I told him: "Absolutely no.........are you crazy?" . Now, for the present: I've had my Z8 for about 5 months now and love it along with my two Z lenses. Bottom line: Sometimes it is not what we "need", but what we "want". My justification? I'm about to turn 81 and I decided I "wanted" the Z8 and by golly, I'm going to get it. BTW (I'm smiling while I'm typing this). I worked hard all of my life and I deserve it (more smiling). I absolutely love the Z8 and coming from a D850, that's saying a lot. I think Nikon was targeting the D850 users with the Z8. Anyhow, the Z8 auto focus is crazy accurate. It will also get you 20 shots per second in RAW at burst.That will stop action when grandson playing sports. If you want to go more crazy, it will get you 30 in jpeg, and even more with other settings. So, all I can say is we're all having photo fun regardless of whatever model we're shooting with. Oh, btw, a friend bought the Z9 as soon as it came out and then sold it and purchased the Z8 when it came out. Z8 cheaper and lots of us really have no use for the heavier weight and extra expense of the vertical grip on the Z9. Again, here is our (photographers) motto: We don't need sound reason when we are hit with GAS......we just do it :). Have fun.
I don't care at all about keeping up with the Jone... (show quote)

Well stated! Probably the reason for my switch from Canon DSLRs to Sony Mirrorless. It felt good!

bwa

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May 27, 2024 23:32:58   #
SuperflyTNT Loc: Manassas VA
 
larryepage wrote:
Depends on what you are shooting, besides, no interest in a Z6 or Z7. Just don't like them after extended testing.


Depends on what you’re shooting? I think I can safely say nobody shooting IR is shooting at high frame rates.

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May 28, 2024 00:33:21   #
SuperflyTNT Loc: Manassas VA
 
Thomas902 wrote:
"The things you’re paying Z8 prices for... are not really useful for IR photography".
Really Jim Ward Photography? And just how many commercial assignments have you shot that predicated the use of IR Imagery?

FYI: I've worked for both the Maryland Geological Survey and the Washington County, Maryland Planning Commission during which time I was paid to shoot Color-Infrared (CIR) aerial photography

BTW; Color-infrared (CIR) aerial photography is often called "false color" photography because it renders the scene in colors not normally seen by the human eye--is widely used for interpretation of natural resources. Atmospheric haze does not interfere with the acquisition of the image.

Live vegetation is almost always associated with red tones. Very intense reds indicate dense, vigorously growing vegetation. As plant vigor decreases, the vegetation appears as lighter shades of red and pink, various shades of greens, and possibly tans.

Bare soils appear as shades of white, blue, or green in most agricultural regions. In general, darker shades of each color indicate moister soil.

Jim Ward Photography unless you have extensive experience in CIR I believe you may owe Larry Page an apology.
Sadly UHH abounds with those claiming expertise yet when pressed they deploy arm waving rather than validation imagery.

Speaking of which... posted below is Color-infrared (CIR) aerial photography out of my Nikon F2 with a 50mm f/2.0 Nikkor and Y48 Yellow Filter. This June 1972 mission was during Hurricane Agnes to document potential flood damage to Washington County's Historical Stone Arch Bridges... More specifically the one over the Antietam... a.k.a. Battle of Antietam the bloodiest conflict in the History of the United States. It was said that the Antietam ran red with blood through Sharpsburg.

Note: These structures where constructed with approaches lower than there arch clearance which saved them from total destruction during Hurricane Agnes in 1972, the deadliest storm ever to hit Maryland.

I was shooting out of the copilot's seat on a two place helicopter and it was during horrific turbulence...
The craft was being bounced around like a "Candle in the Wind" way more excitement than I had ever planned for. However the Washington County Engineer with extremely pleased with the images.

I suggest that you please post you IR imagery Jim Ward Photography to validate your expertise in IR...
Thank you for your thoughtful consideration here...
i "The things you’re paying Z8 prices for...... (show quote)


And how often has super fast focus and high frame rates been important to your IR photography? I’m sure the Z8 would make a fine IR camera. But it’s also true that Nikon makes other Z models that would be just as good for a lot less money.

Reply
May 28, 2024 07:13:02   #
ClarkJohnson Loc: Fort Myers, FL and Cohasset, MA
 
IMHO, all the griping about mirrorless being forced on us helpless consumers overlooks the basic fact that DSLRs are mechanical devices, relying on a mirror flapping up and down in very precise ways. It was clear to me years ago that mirrorless technology would become the standard for cameras.

Have a problem with your DSLR? Well, we can replace the shutter mechanism with the same thing, until that one (inevitably) fails. I once had to replace the shutter on a D500 after about 170,000 shots (earlier than “normal” but not covered by warranty, of course). Mechanical devices are inherently prone to malfunction despite our care and best intentions.

Last month, I shot 47,000 shots in two weeks while birding in Costa Rica, and my Z9 wasn’t even breathing hard. Over and above the benefits of WYSIWYG and faster fps and focus magic and pre-capture, properly designed electronic mechanisms take the issue of wear and tear out of the equation. Why would anyone want it any other way?

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May 28, 2024 07:30:04   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States
 
ClarkJohnson wrote:
...
..
Last month, I shot 47,000 shots in two weeks while birding in Costa Rica, and my Z9 wasn’t even breathing hard. Over and above the benefits of WYSIWYG and faster fps and focus magic, properly designed electronic mechanisms take the issue of wear and tear out of the equation. Why would anyone want it any other way?

Maybe those of us who don't take millions of shots a year have no need to worry about it.......
But you feel that everyone should? Regardless of how much they shoot?

Not all of us need WYSIWYG, a thought incomprehendible to some.
Same for having a frame rate equal to movies. I guess a lot of important stuff can happen in 50 milliseconds.

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May 28, 2024 08:22:30   #
Archboo3 Loc: Central Florida
 
I when Z8 from D850. I shoot everything you shoot. Shot an air show a few months back Z8 did great

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May 28, 2024 08:29:33   #
GLSmith Loc: Tampa, Fl
 
Nikon maintains a full list of DSLR lenses which will work with either a Z-8 or Z-9 via adapter. Also as you're on the "Other side of the pond", prior to dropping a wad of Euro's, you might want to check with MPB.com They sell very high quality used camera bodies & lenses, & various camera gear at discounted prices with a good warranty as well as a return policy. They also sell here in the states. I've used them for over 3/12 years without issue. If they do not have in stock what you're wanting, I believe they may have a "sign up for alerts".
Perhaps to help you decide if the Z-8 or Z-9, checkout KenRockwell.com He is a member here & a very well known private reviewer on all Nikon bodies & lenses, or you can check out Thom Hogan another very well known tester https://www.bythom.com/reviews--books/mirrorless-camera-reviews-.html

Have a pint or two of Theakstons Old Peculiar for me...Ta

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May 28, 2024 08:29:36   #
Canisdirus
 
The only reason not to shoot mirrorless is money.

They are easily better cameras in many ways...not really debatable anymore.

So one either takes the plunge coin wise...or stays put.

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