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What is your worth?
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Feb 22, 2021 00:43:36   #
Cheese
 
clint f. wrote:
That is exactly what the IRS does.


Tax rates are set by politicians, not the IRS; and we all know that they are, without exception, beyond reproach both morally and ethically.

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Feb 22, 2021 05:12:19   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Rongnongno wrote:
As a photographer, what is your worth?

Folks here do not seem to understand marketing and how to approach the upper end market.

It all about how much you think your time AND TALENT is worth. If you think it is average, print a price list and go for it. You will not go far and will have to work your *** off in order to make a decent living.

If on the other end you are good (you do not need to be extraordinary) and are introduced to the right folks by the right person basically two events a month makes the same amount you do shooting three/four events a weekend or a week for a month.

If you know you are in demand and highly recommended you set your price depending on your client's means and demands. In this case there is no price list, ever. The price fluctuates and usually goes up with time and 'weird demands'.

Once upon a time I was in demand by the Ross Perot entourage. These folks do not nickel and dime but have specific requirements both in time, location and more often than not have expensive demands to deal with. Not request, DEMANDS. Either you do it or you lose an opportunity. There is no price on this type of service. It all depends on how capable you are and how you come across.

So the real questions are:
WHAT IS YOUR WORTH?
Then
How do you come across?
And finally
Who do you know who can introduce you to a STILL very lucrative market?

The only ethic issue here is DELIVER. If you do not you are burned, end of it. Even smaller markets close on you. These folks will make you or break you, just like that, they have the reach.

The gravy train lasted two years and ended when we moved to Italy.
As a photographer, what is your worth? br br Folk... (show quote)


My worth is whatever a client or collector is willing to pay me - which results in a wide range of value - from zero to $2500/day - depending on venue and level of difficulty. In some cases, you couldn't pay me enough to take a job - like when I get Bridezilla, or Mother of Bridezilla - or the not that rare combo package. If I get even the slightest whiff of trouble, I run as fast as I can in the opposite direction.

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Feb 22, 2021 07:31:52   #
traderjohn Loc: New York City
 
User ID wrote:
I find that the usual mind set of the idjitz that freak out over mega-mega $$ art sales tends to revolve around the price of groceries. Groceries such as substrate and ink, and perhaps amortization of the hardware involved.

These walnut brains have zero bidnez commenting on the “art market”, given that they have zero grasp of artistry. Note that I said “grasp of artistry” and not “grasp of art”. Such “big money” is not “buying art”. It’s rewarding artistry, and promoting its continued existence in a hostile environment.

“Art” they believe they grasp. “Art” is a shot in a botanical garden that exhibits gobs of bokeh. If they themselves can routinely knock out such magnificent drivel, how can anyone else’s work be held in absurdly higher esteem ?

I operate and live at a very high level of artistry. While my $$ rewards for that are less than newsworthy, I celebrate newsworthy mega$$ sales. Such sales, despite being sullied by “investment value”, remind me that somewhere some few people put their money where their mouth is as supporters of the great value of artistry to civilization.

Such sales are like the statues of heros and great leaders, in that such sales are material monuments to the importance of something. That something is artistry.

++++++++++++++++++++++

I spoze there will be a comment asking me to define artistry. To that I reply that if you hafta ask you’ll never understand the answer, so please go away. Others may comment that I’m kinda arrogant. To that I reply that your grasp of the obvious is truly quite remarkable ;-)
I find that the usual mind set of the idjitz that ... (show quote)

"I spoze there will be a comment asking me to define artistry. To that I reply that if you hafta ask you’ll never understand the answer, so please go away. Others may comment that I’m kinda arrogant. To that I reply that your grasp of the obvious is truly quite remarkable ;-)"
I would not ask for a definition of your concept of what art is. Why would anyone who uses a piece of equipment that is composed of plastic, a variety of metals, glass, an electronic sensor, and a "card' made up of more plastic and electronic components and employes all of these manufactured components to take a variety of pictures now takes this card that stores these images and places it in yet another piece of electronic equipment to see what the pictures look like? Then he imports these pictures into a program devised by someone else's genius and moves a variety of sliders with yet another piece of electronic equipment; a Wacom tablet and pen or a mouse. Makes who knows how many adjustments yet decides he needs to use yet another software program to make the picture "pop" after that he is happy and gazes lovingly at his creation and declares look at my artwork. I am an artist. No. You are a photographer. Your need for ego gratification demands you be more than what you are.

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Feb 22, 2021 09:55:08   #
Rongnongno Loc: FL
 
Gene51 wrote:
My worth is whatever a client or collector is willing to pay me - which results in a wide range of value - from zero to $2500/day - depending on venue and level of difficulty. In some cases, you couldn't pay me enough to take a job - like when I get Bridezilla, or Mother of Bridezilla - or the not that rare combo package. If I get even the slightest whiff of trouble, I run as fast as I can in the opposite direction.

Bridezilla and the like are serious cause for concern. I ran from them but also learned to profit from them... At a certain level their arrogance and demands become a serious source of revenues...

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Feb 22, 2021 10:08:35   #
Rongnongno Loc: FL
 
traderjohn wrote:
"I spoze there will be a comment asking me to define artistry. To that I reply that if you hafta ask you’ll never understand the answer, so please go away. Others may comment that I’m kinda arrogant. To that I reply that your grasp of the obvious is truly quite remarkable ;-)"
I would not ask for a definition of your concept of what art is. Why would anyone who uses a piece of equipment that is composed of plastic, a variety of metals, glass, an electronic sensor, and a "card' made up of more plastic and electronic components and employes all of these manufactured components to take a variety of pictures now takes this card that stores these images and places it in yet another piece of electronic equipment to see what the pictures look like? Then he imports these pictures into a program devised by someone else's genius and moves a variety of sliders with yet another piece of electronic equipment; a Wacom tablet and pen or a mouse. Makes who knows how many adjustments yet decides he needs to use yet another software program to make the picture "pop" after that he is happy and gazes lovingly at his creation and declares look at my artwork. I am an artist. No. You are a photographer. Your need for ego gratification demands you be more than what you are.
"I spoze there will be a comment asking me to... (show quote)

You describe a technician. You are not wrong, I am one. I will never pretend to be an artist. Yet, even for a good technician having an eye for details and a vision is an essential part of being a photographer. This 'vision' thing is what introduces the 'artsy' part.

Now, having a super inflated ego for many reasons is not rare in the photographic world as it is in the world of painting, sculpting, performing acts and who knows what else.

This thread is not about ego but about knowing where you stand among the competition and the market you are dealing with. The moment you sign a contract for a job is the moment you check your ego at the door. You become an employee, a contractor, a mercenary. You place yourself in a subservient position.

Once the job is done, the client appreciation may stroke your ego, but for the next job everything is in question. It not only keep you on your toes but forces you to improve as monotony in style will quickly bore your 'audience'. Those who do not adapt because they do not know how or are too lazy to learn become the 'flavor of the month' or more pointedly 'one hit wonder'.

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Feb 22, 2021 10:19:29   #
User ID
 
DHenard wrote:
4 million for 1 picture!!! I would have sold several thousand for a lot less.

Wrong. Totally wrong. It is NOT the price of merely one picture. Artistry is not a commodity, not a widget. Try to get that through your skull.

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Feb 22, 2021 12:09:08   #
Abo
 
Paul Diamond wrote:
If you measure your worth in 'worldly values', what you might gain is worldly worth.

IMHO, you should aim higher, much higher. What have you achieved? What have you accomplished? What have you changed for the better? - What have you added? What have you originated? Where is your creativity? Where is your soul?

These are answers worthy of the last days of your life. I'm still working on mine. And, I expect to be working on them during the last day of my life.

Aim higher. Be bolder. Do good without the notice or recognition of others. Help without expecting glory. Encourage without appreciation. Love without receiving love in return.
If you measure your worth in 'worldly values', wha... (show quote)


I agree Sir. One should ask; "What is my karmic worth?"

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Feb 22, 2021 12:40:04   #
User ID
 
Abo wrote:
I agree Sir. One should ask;
"What is my karmic worth?"

Depends on your bokeh.

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Feb 22, 2021 12:57:41   #
E.L.. Shapiro Loc: Ottawa, Ontario Canada
 
Art? Am I an artist? I consider that is a hard-earned title. I would not bestow it on myself. If my clients want to call me an artist, I will take that as a compliment, but that's up to them!

Problem is, I am a COMMERCIAL photographer. Folks and corporate entities have to hire me or contact me to perform work. They have to commission me to make their portraits. I do not usually produce work and speculate on sales. I have occasionally sold pieces that I made for my own edification or self-expression. I have taken on the photo-decor commission to proved scenic, floral, or still life images for office decor for dental, medical, legal and other business offices and establishments.

I try to tale an artist's or artful approach to all my work. I don't display at galleries or art or craft shows.
I have, on occasion, display a personal image on my studio showroom wall and had a client purchase it.

For me, the "art business" is an entirely different arena. I think it is more complex than my commercial word. Some folks buy "art" because they enjoy and appreciate it, others will buy the work of name artists for investment. I have had clients hire me to photograph valuable paintings for the record, authentication, and/or evaluation and insurance purposes. Believe it or not, someof these folks had no appreciation or even a liking for someof the art itself. They were more interested in the value based on the artist's reputation, or demand for their work. Others purchased it for prestige value.

So...when it comes to making suggestions as to how to evaluate your work as "art", I have no experience to offer and I can only resort to my methodology of formulation of prices for commercial photograhy.

Of course, your reputation the quality of your product, the perceived superiority of your work to that of your competition all factor into what you can charge. Waht ever processes or approaches you decide to employ, it shouldn't be based on ego. You must do your homework and market research and apply your findings scientifically and methodically.

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Feb 22, 2021 14:03:23   #
Abo
 
User ID wrote:
Depends on your bokeh.




I accidentally omitted "value" as in

one should ask "What is my Karmic value worth?"

or perhaps just... "what is my Karmic value?"

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Feb 22, 2021 18:53:09   #
DHenard Loc: Northeast Tennessee
 
What is art to one is simply a picture of a river to another. To each to his/her own.

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Feb 22, 2021 20:12:35   #
User ID
 
Abo wrote:


I accidentally omitted "value" as in

one should ask "What is my Karmic value worth?"

or perhaps just... "what is my Karmic value?"


Still depends on your bokeh .....

Same answer, expanded meaning.

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Feb 22, 2021 20:15:06   #
User ID
 
DHenard wrote:
What is art to one is simply a picture of a river to another. To each to his/her own.


And your child or spouse that you love is, to other eyes, nothing more than just another sack of salt water and proteins. So it’s crazy that there’s a marketplace ... the insurance industry ... that allows that sack to be valued over a million $$.

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Feb 22, 2021 20:38:10   #
DHenard Loc: Northeast Tennessee
 
It is amazing isn't it?

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Feb 23, 2021 10:26:58   #
Abo
 
User ID wrote:
Still depends on your bokeh .....

Same answer, expanded meaning.


"User (what's in a name?) ID" thinks Karmic value depends on bokeh. LOL

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