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Romney's Attempt to Sell Snake Oil
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Oct 5, 2012 13:26:24   #
Bmac Loc: Long Island, NY
 
captkruts wrote:
I would like some one to answer this for me. How much further a head would this country be right now, if the obstructionist republican congress had not abdicated their duties and responsibilities to the people of this country for the last three and a half years? Just think where we could be right now if they would sit down and all work together with the President to try and fix things!


Again..It has been enumerated in many threads & posts how The Democrats had control of Congress the last two years of the Bush Administration & the first two years of the Obama Administration, and that's both houses of Congress. That's a fact, not opinion or interpretation. 8-)

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Oct 5, 2012 13:30:55   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
The problem is less that of lying and more that of the Republicans in Congress being obstructionists. You can't lead a herd of cats. The Republican Party has gone off the deep end, with the stated goal not of helping the President accomplish anything and not with the goal of improving the welfare of the people, but mainly with the goal of making Obama a one-term president. To me, that is close to treason.



Bmac wrote:
Hunter Lou 1947 wrote:
Your running out of time. You've only got 33 days to campaign against the President. So you better dream up some more crap filled mostly with lies. So let's hear some more lies today.


No, the country is running out of time. The Outstanding Public Debt as of 05 Oct 2012 is: 16,160,319,891,313.97. The estimated population of the United States is 313,629,948 so each citizen's share of this debt is $51,526.71.

Why do some folks use the term lies & lies simply when others disagree with them? Was this fellow lying when he said:

"The fact that we are here today to debate raising America 's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the US Government cannot pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government's reckless fiscal policies. Increasing America 's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that, "the buck stops here.' Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better."
~ Senator Barack H. Obama, March 2006

The national debt was at $10.6 trillion when President Obama took office. 8-)
quote=Hunter Lou 1947 Your running out of time. Y... (show quote)
The problem is less that of lying and more that of... (show quote)


You see Richard you go and get me liking some of your posts because you stick to facts and numbers and then you go an put up a crappy one like this... When has the president ever tried to work with congress other than when he had Pelosi and Reid running both houses... With this president and his crew it has either been my way or the highway and then he has used his henchmen in the press to compose his narrative... Actually McConnell did not speak those words until after a bitter debate in late 2010 and he was taken out of context...

From the WaPo Factchecking site....

Quote:
The Facts

McConnell made his remarks in an interview that appeared in the National Journal on Oct. 23, 2010 — nearly two years after Obama was elected president. The interview took place on the eve the of the midterm elections. The interview is relatively short, so we will print it in its entirety, with key portions highlighted............


When seen in full context, McConnell’s quote is not really as shocking as the snippet that is frequently repeated by Democrats.

Generally, Democrats suggest that McConnell believed that no problem is bigger than getting rid of Obama, but it is clear that he is speaking in a political context — that the goals of Republicans could not be achieved unless Obama is defeated in his race for reelection. A case in point: the health care law could not be overturned unless Obama is defeated.
Moreover, McConnell goes on to say that he does “not want the president to fail” and cooperation was possible “if he’s willing to meet us halfway on some of the biggest issues.” McConnell in fact cited an extension of the Bush tax cuts — and Obama did strike such a deal shortly after the midterm elections.

Here’s how McConnell explained his remarks in a speech after the election, when Republicans had taken over the House of Representatives and made huge gains in the Senate:
“Let’s start with the big picture. Over the past week, some have said it was indelicate of me to suggest that our top political priority over the next two years should be to deny President Obama a second term in office. But the fact is, if our primary legislative goals are to repeal and replace the health spending bill; to end the bailouts; cut spending; and shrink the size and scope of government, the only way to do all these things it is to put someone in the White House who won’t veto any of these things. We can hope the President will start listening to the electorate after Tuesday’s election. But we can’t plan on it. And it would be foolish to expect that Republicans will be able to completely reverse the damage Democrats have done as long as a Democrat holds the veto pen.”
The Facts br br McConnell made his remarks in an ... (show quote)

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Oct 5, 2012 13:33:56   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Bubu wrote:
I must speak and leave the thread because I don't like to talks politics, but most of the damage and slowed improvement has come from the staggering, unbelievable lack of responsibility of elected republicans with hands down attitude in government. They have not been working for the people that elected them and those they have a responsibility to. They deserve to stay at home, unemployed and without healthcare and return their unearned salaries to the people.

What do they win with this attitude? What is the fear? My thinking is, it is personal gain. All of them have something to gain in contacts and deals they may want to continue performing while at their posts, unknowingly to us. It is self preservation of their salaries and BIG entitlements we subsidize with our taxes. In the meantime, they are oblivious to the suffering of a disappearing middle class (sliding down to poor) and aging citizens of all political affiliations. They have practically said: You can go to hell; and that is not fair.

It is easy to let the government go down as ineffective by rejecting to do their jobs and then blame it on the only one trying to do something.

The perspective of having a professional lier and vulture capitalist in office that outsources jobs and closes companies for his personal gain, a man who likes to fire people and will kill every advancement into the 21rst century we have collectively made as a nation, is irreconcilable with having an intelligent community of voters. If he wins, the American voters are blind.
I must speak and leave the thread because I don't ... (show quote)


Why did you even take the time to type this if all you were going to do is drop a big pile of smelly Bull Sh** in the middle of this thread...

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Oct 5, 2012 13:34:08   #
Bmac Loc: Long Island, NY
 
Bubu wrote:
I must speak and leave the thread because I don't like to talks politics, but most of the damage and slowed improvement has come from the staggering, unbelievable lack of responsibility of elected republicans with hands down attitude in government. They have not been working for the people that elected them and those they have a responsibility to.


Actually, they have been working for the people who elected them. The Republicans took control of the House because the people elected them to stop the Obama policies which they disagreed with. Why else would people elect them?

Obama had plenty of time, without opposition, to cut the deficit as he said he would.

Again..It has been enumerated in many threads & posts how The Democrats had control of Congress the last two years of the Bush Administration & the first two years of the Obama Administration, and that's both houses of Congress. That's a fact, not opinion or interpretation. 8-)

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Oct 5, 2012 13:37:43   #
Hunter Lou 1947 Loc: Minnesota
 
captkruts wrote:
I would like some one to answer this for me. How much further a head would this country be right now, if the obstructionist republican congress had not abdicated their duties and responsibilities to the people of this country for the last three and a half years? Just think where we could be right now if they would sit down and all work together with the President to try and fix things!


There's no doubt about it. We've lost a golden opportunity. The obstructionists are the one's to blame for the slow recovery. They from the get go refused to work with the president on many items. I hope the people remember this when they go to the polls in 33 days. We all need to remind ourselves of the fact.

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Oct 5, 2012 13:39:00   #
Bmac Loc: Long Island, NY
 
Hunter Lou 1947 wrote:
captkruts wrote:
I would like some one to answer this for me. How much further a head would this country be right now, if the obstructionist republican congress had not abdicated their duties and responsibilities to the people of this country for the last three and a half years? Just think where we could be right now if they would sit down and all work together with the President to try and fix things!


There's no doubt about it. We've lost a golden opportunity. The obstructionists are the one's to blame for the slow recovery. They from the get go refused to work with the president on many items. I hope the people remember this when they go to the polls in 33 days. We all need to remind ourselves of the fact.
quote=captkruts I would like some one to answer t... (show quote)


Again..It has been enumerated in many threads & posts how The Democrats had control of Congress the last two years of the Bush Administration & the first two years of the Obama Administration, and that's both houses of Congress. That's a fact, not opinion or interpretation. 8-)

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Oct 5, 2012 13:41:37   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
You are absolutely right. And he tried and tried and tried to consult with Republicans -- you know, he really does believe that bipartisanship is good for the country -- and constantly got rebuffed. He made the mistake, in my opinion, of paying attention to the Republican members of Congress for more than the first few months. I would have simply disregarded them very quickly. However, he and the Democrats did finally -- over Republican objections and obstructionism -- achieve something enormously important. And the fact that it is enormously important can be measured by the extraordinary volume of the howls from the Repuiblicans. He got Obamacare passed.

"It has been enumerated in many threads & posts how The Democrats had control of Congress the last two years of the Bush Administration & the first two years of the Obama Administration, and that's both houses of Congress. That's a fact, not opinion or interpretation."

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Oct 5, 2012 13:44:36   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
This (below) is true. Obama made a serious mistake, and I felt it was a mistake after the first few months of his presidency. He tried way too hard to have bipartisan agreement from a group of people whose aim was not to agree.

"Again..It has been enumerated in many threads & posts how The Democrats had control of Congress the last two years of the Bush Administration & the first two years of the Obama Administration, and that's both houses of Congress. That's a fact, not opinion or interpretation."

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Oct 5, 2012 13:46:39   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
You are absolutely right. And he tried and tried and tried to consult with Republicans -- you know, he really does believe that bipartisanship is good for the country -- and constantly got rebuffed. He made the mistake, in my opinion, of paying attention to the Republican members of Congress for more than the first few months. I would have simply disregarded them very quickly. However, he and the Democrats did finally -- over Republican objections and obstructionism -- achieve something enormously important. And the fact that it is enormously important can be measured by the extraordinary volume of the howls from the Repuiblicans. He got Obamacare passed.

"It has been enumerated in many threads & posts how The Democrats had control of Congress the last two years of the Bush Administration & the first two years of the Obama Administration, and that's both houses of Congress. That's a fact, not opinion or interpretation."
You are absolutely right. And he tried and tried ... (show quote)


Obama made little to no efforts to compromise... I remember one of what he thought at the moment as his most stellar quips... "Elections have consequences.... I won" and then he started the march down the road to bury his narcissistic self.

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Oct 5, 2012 13:48:14   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
BlurryEyed, I remember differently. Obama's mistake -- I perceived it then -- was to try too hard to compromise. I think your "memory" is incorrect.


Obama made little to no efforts to compromise... I remember one of what he thought at the moment as his most stellar quips... "Elections have consequences.... I won" and then he started the march down the road to bury his narcissistic self.[/quote]

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Oct 5, 2012 13:52:09   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
BlurryEyed, I remember differently. Obama's mistake -- I perceived it then -- was to try too hard to compromise. I think your "memory" is incorrect.


Obama made little to no efforts to compromise... I remember one of what he thought at the moment as his most stellar quips... "Elections have consequences.... I won" and then he started the march down the road to bury his narcissistic self.
[/quote]

LOL Richard, I did not see him offering any compromise other than to Mary Landrieu and Bill Nelson...

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Oct 5, 2012 13:55:33   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
LOL Richard, I did not see him offering any compromise other than to Mary Landrieu and Bill Nelson..."

BlurryEyed, I remember differently. Obama's mistake -- I perceived it then -- was to try too hard to compromise. I think your "memory" is incorrect.

LOL all you want, BlurryEyed. Your eyes and your mind were undoubtedly shut. I remember what I saw and what I felt about it at the time. You must have been off having Tea with the Tea Party.

LOL Richard, I did not see him offering any compromise other than to Mary Landrieu and Bill Nelson..."

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Oct 5, 2012 13:59:41   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
LOL Richard, I did not see him offering any compromise other than to Mary Landrieu and Bill Nelson..."

BlurryEyed, I remember differently. Obama's mistake -- I perceived it then -- was to try too hard to compromise. I think your "memory" is incorrect.

LOL all you want, BlurryEyed. Your eyes and your mind were undoubtedly shut. I remember what I saw and what I felt about it at the time. You must have been off having Tea with the Tea Party.

LOL Richard, I did not see him offering any compromise other than to Mary Landrieu and Bill Nelson..."
LOL Richard, I did not see him offering any compro... (show quote)


Not a member, but was I supposed to feel insulted by that remark? I have substantially supported many of the arguments that I have made here and you simply choose to ignore them as you have no rebuttal and then come up with something like this.... I know that it is hard to support this president with anything other than emotion and talking points.

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Oct 5, 2012 14:04:03   #
Richard94611 Loc: Oakland, CA
 
BlurryEyed, I am not supporting my position just with arguments that you just don't like. I am supporting my argument with my very clear memory of the situation. You can tell everyone you like as many times as you like that the contrary was true. But it wasn't and your assertions to the contrary will never make your statements true (though it might convince a few fools).

I am going to have to leave this discussion for a few hours. That'll give you time to think more clearly.

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Oct 5, 2012 14:22:36   #
Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.
 
Richard94611 wrote:
BlurryEyed, I am not supporting my position just with arguments that you just don't like. I am supporting my argument with my very clear memory of the situation. You can tell everyone you like as many times as you like that the contrary was true. But it wasn't and your assertions to the contrary will never make your statements true (though it might convince a few fools).

I am going to have to leave this discussion for a few hours. That'll give you time to think more clearly.


I need no time to think clearly, as I too remember the first years of the Obama presidency and his efforts to ram through the ACA which was polling at about a 75% negative at the time... My recollection is that the president sat on his hands as Pelosi and Reid told the republicans in congress that their input into the bill was not needed or welcomed, Pelosi when so far as to change the locks on the conference rooms so as to not allow republican congressmen to enter... Republicans were not allowed to read drafts and only received copies of the 2350 page bill the day before the vote.... Let's see that is a bill so voluminous that democratic rep John Conyers said that it would be a waste of his time to read the bill...

Is this the cooperation and olive branch to which you speak?

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