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Photo editing software - not subscription based
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Dec 2, 2019 17:51:24   #
mwsilvers Loc: Central New Jersey
 
FotoHog wrote:
Fair enough, performance improvements are all part of a product upgrade, as it should be. And we expect to pay a fair price for it. But what we are really talking about here is that we have just another example of the all too familiar corporate greed in the universe of business.

My latest annual upgrade to version 3 of DXO PhotoLab Elite cost me $44.95 on Black Friday. My annual update to ON1 Photo Raw 2020 cost me $80. Each program provided a significant number of upgraded and new features. Hardly corporate greed.

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Dec 2, 2019 17:56:31   #
FotoHog
 
mwsilvers wrote:
My latest annual upgrade to version 3 of DXO PhotoLab Elite cost me $44.95 on Black Friday. My annual update to ON1 Photo Raw 2020 cost me $80. Each program provided a significant number of upgraded and new features. Hardly corporate greed.


Methinks the issue was regarding Adobe . . .

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Dec 2, 2019 18:03:06   #
xt2 Loc: British Columbia, Canada
 
buzzyd wrote:
So, let's have it, what would you recommend that is not subscription based - so no LR, PS, CC for example.

Just a bit of detail -- I shoot mostly raw (Nikon DLSR both DX and FX). I also shoot IR, so support for those kinds of editing would be useful as well.

Thanks for the recommendations!


Luminar 4 & Capture One are excellent. Try their free trials to decide for yourself...you will love being off the subscription train.

Merry Christmas!

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Dec 2, 2019 18:06:04   #
AndyH Loc: Massachusetts and New Hampshire
 
Blenheim Orange wrote:

I think Adobe's marketing plan is a hustle. That is my opinion. That may not matter to some people, or they may think that somehow Adobe is actually "earning" close to $2,000,000,000 a year and "deserves" that.

It is not easy at all to "complain" about Adobe, or about Microsoft, as far as that goes. Both companies have a massive army of unpaid but almost cult-like and fanatical defenders.

Mike


$2 billion / $120 per subscription =16.7 million users? It must be pretty good....

Andy

PS: My response was to Paul (ChgCanon) and was intended to be humorous. He is the one who always posts facetious gems about full frame as an aspirational goal. I don't care what software you, or anyone else, rents. I just find that renting the best available for a Hamilton per month, is a bargain. I also don't care how much money Adobe makes, as long as they're delivering the product I want at a price I'm happy with.

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Dec 2, 2019 18:09:26   #
chevman Loc: Matthews, North Carolina
 
BigDaddy wrote:
The costs of delivering and maintaining software has got to be one of the cheapest of any industry.

I agree with you and quit a few others in this thread on the reasons NOT to rent Adobe software products. I would also like to point out that professionals running a business can and most likely do write off the rental cost as an operating expense and therefore don’t care about the rental charge. For those that have photography as a hobby or occasional photo shoot for a small charge and don’t own a business the rental charge is impractical and not good value, unless one is absolutely loaded and has to have the latest and greatest as soon as it is available. There are other perpetual license software that is very good for the more casual user. Oh! And lots of pros don’t use Adobe.

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Dec 2, 2019 18:17:05   #
AndyH Loc: Massachusetts and New Hampshire
 
chevman wrote:
I would also like to point out that professionals running a business can and most likely do write off the rental cost as an operating expense and therefore don’t care about the rental charge. For those that have photography as a hobby or occasional photo shoot for a small charge and don’t own a business the rental charge is impractical and not good value, unless one is absolutely loaded and has to have the latest and greatest as soon as it is available.


Ten bucks a month would certainly send most of the members here to the poorhouse. I never considered myself "absolutely loaded", but I guess I must be.

OTOH I'm not sure that all those fancypants pros really need that expense deduction. If they're down to $120 profit, they'd probably be better off with Gimp… It's free.


Andy

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Dec 2, 2019 18:26:36   #
CHG_CANON Loc: the Windy City
 
There's only two types of people in the world: buyers and subscribers.

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Dec 2, 2019 18:27:33   #
Blenheim Orange Loc: Michigan
 
AndyH wrote:
Ten bucks a month would certainly send most of the members here to the poorhouse. I never considered myself "absolutely loaded", but I guess I must be.

OTOH I'm not sure that all those fancypants pros really need that expense deduction. If they're down to $120 profit, they'd probably be better off with Gimp… It's free.


Andy


You keep missing the point. Of course $10 a month is affordable for most people. An optional annual upgrade priced at $120 that did not require you to allow Adobe access to your machine would eliminate my criticism of their marketing strategy. Of course, Adobe would then need to make some actual substantial improvements to the product if people had a choice about whether or not to "upgrade" and send them money.

It is completely in Adobe's hands going forward what the pricing will be, whether or not you will see any improvements, whether or not the software will be stable, how much of your computer's resources will be hogged by their software, and whether or not your machine will be adequate for running their software. I understand that it is not easy to get away from them should you choose to do that, as well.

Mike

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Dec 2, 2019 18:34:01   #
chevman Loc: Matthews, North Carolina
 
AndyH wrote:
Ten bucks a month would certainly send most of the members here to the poorhouse. I never considered myself "absolutely loaded", but I guess I must be.

OTOH I'm not sure that all those fancypants pros really need that expense deduction. If they're down to $120 profit, they'd probably be better off with Gimp… It's free.


Andy

I have plenty of money Andy I just don’t want to waste it. I have LR6 and several editors that work just fine and i doubt that most if not all whom I would share my prints with would ever know what photo app I processed it with. Most business owners will take advantage of all the resources they can to save or earn a buck or they won’t stay in business very long. I’m not in business and many others who like photography and computer work don’t need to have the aggravation of paying a rental charge when they can own the software that brings them enjoyment. If you like to rent GO FOR IT.

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Dec 2, 2019 18:52:12   #
AndyH Loc: Massachusetts and New Hampshire
 
OK Boomers....

Andy

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Dec 2, 2019 19:15:33   #
FiddleMaker Loc: Merrimac, MA
 
Gene51 wrote:
To answer your question, the raw editor in Lr and Ps are exactly the same, and all of the adjustments in Lr are available in Ps. The big advantage of Lr over Ps is the fast and well-organized user interface, and the seamless transition between Library and Develop modules. You should be able to work in either and get the exact same results. One way to see this is to write your changes in Lr to xmp, then open the same file in Ps ACR and see that all of your adjustments and settings are there, and vice versa. The sliders have a different "feel" to them, but they do the exact same things.
To answer your question, the raw editor in Lr and ... (show quote)

Thanks for your reply. Makes me feel better about using Lr and Ps.
Do I need to tell Lr to write changes to the associated xmp file or does it do this automatically ? I think it is something that I need to toggle ON but not sure. I did notice similar sliders when I was unintentially using ACR while in Ps. But so far I am happy with using only Lr Classic CC. I guess if I wanted to take a politician's head and affix it to a donkey's body then Ps would be what I want but I don't see the need for this right now. Again, thanks for your input. It is always very helpful. ~FiddleMaker

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Dec 2, 2019 19:35:03   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
FiddleMaker wrote:
Thanks for your reply. Makes me feel better about using Lr and Ps.
Do I need to tell Lr to write changes to the associated xmp file or does it do this automatically ? I think it is something that I need to toggle ON but not sure. I did notice similar sliders when I was unintentially using ACR while in Ps. But so far I am happy with using only Lr Classic CC. I guess if I wanted to take a politician's head and affix it to a donkey's body then Ps would be what I want but I don't see the need for this right now. Again, thanks for your input. It is always very helpful. ~FiddleMaker
Thanks for your reply. Makes me feel better abou... (show quote)


With the Library module open, pick Edit->Catalog Settings and open the Metadata tab. IN the editing section of the dialog you will see a checkbox for Automatically write changes into XMP. I keep mine checked. If you check it - Lr will course through your entire Library and do this retroactively. It's a good thing to do in the event you want to use other software that can read xmp.

I would like you to see one of more amazing - and not that difficult - uses for Photoshop. Something that would be absolutely impossible to do in Lr. This is just one of 100,000 examples of where Lr falls short.

https://fstoppers.com/post-production/awesome-video-how-retouch-shiny-skin-1523

Here is another link, a site that has tons of ways to do stuff to improve images.

https://www.retouchpro.com/

Be careful - you may get bitten by the bug once you see what you've been missing.

The biggest issue with learning Ps is learning the scope and depth of what it can do.

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Dec 2, 2019 19:40:57   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Blenheim Orange wrote:
You keep missing the point. Of course $10 a month is affordable for most people. An optional annual upgrade priced at $120 that did not require you to allow Adobe access to your machine would eliminate my criticism of their marketing strategy. Of course, Adobe would then need to make some actual substantial improvements to the product if people had a choice about whether or not to "upgrade" and send them money.

It is completely in Adobe's hands going forward what the pricing will be, whether or not you will see any improvements, whether or not the software will be stable, how much of your computer's resources will be hogged by their software, and whether or not your machine will be adequate for running their software. I understand that it is not easy to get away from them should you choose to do that, as well.

Mike
You keep missing the point. Of course $10 a month ... (show quote)


When does Adobe access an enduser's machine other than when you call in for support and they enter a remote control support console to work their magic on your computer? But this is a legitimate software/hardware support tool used by many companies. This is not just a feature of Adobe CC. You should check your information before posting.

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Dec 2, 2019 19:45:45   #
FiddleMaker Loc: Merrimac, MA
 
Gene51 wrote:
With the Library module open, pick Edit->Catalog Settings and open the Metadata tab. IN the editing section of the dialog you will see a checkbox for Automatically write changes into XMP. I keep mine checked. If you check it - Lr will course through your entire Library and do this retroactively. It's a good thing to do in the event you want to use other software that can read xmp.

I would like you to see one of more amazing - and not that difficult - uses for Photoshop. Something that would be absolutely impossible to do in Lr. This is just one of 100,000 examples of where Lr falls short.

https://fstoppers.com/post-production/awesome-video-how-retouch-shiny-skin-1523

Here is another link, a site that has tons of ways to do stuff to improve images.

https://www.retouchpro.com/

Be careful - you may get bitten by the bug once you see what you've been missing.

The biggest issue with learning Ps is learning the scope and depth of what it can do.
With the Library module open, pick Edit->Catalo... (show quote)

Thanks much, Gene. Your input is much appreciated at my end. My problem is that I am rapidly approaching 80 and my learning years are very limited. Yeah, that "light at the end of the tunnel" is getting dimmer by the day !!! Well...…...I think I will make it a goal this year to learn Ps so that I can affix that politician's head to the donkey. Just not sure which end of the donkey I will use !!! (Just joking of course). And thanks for those links. Will take a peek at those shortly.

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Dec 2, 2019 19:55:00   #
hookedupin2005 Loc: Northwestern New Mexico
 
bsprague wrote:
It's the "principle" of it, not the cost of it. It's a big, even giant, multinational corporation that invented a way to steal from you monthly. If enough people make it painful on the world wide web, the burglars will go back to the old way.

It's like Amazon. I (should) refuse to buy from them because it is their fault that the local retailer with the high list prices and weak inventory went out of business.


You are wrong about Amazon(or B&H, or any big online store of today). It is ultimately our own fault. Amazon, or whomever put together this huge "store", and offered it to the public....Lower prices, and(at that time)no taxes. We were hooked; We could not resist. We are the "cause of death" of our own local brick and mortar stores.

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