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Copyrighted Rodeo?
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May 20, 2019 14:19:10   #
ppage Loc: Pittsburg, (San Francisco area)
 
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association Rodeo yesterday for some action shots. They were real sticklers about cameras - no lens longer that 6" and lots of other rules that all started with "no"
One person in charge said the whole event is copyrighted, trying to impress upon me that anything I might photograph was copyrighted. They only give photog passes to real phtogs from real journalism orgs. After we explained we we were only using the images for our local club competitions they relaxed a bit.

Can a public event like this be copyrighted?

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May 20, 2019 14:28:25   #
Toment Loc: FL, IL
 
I guess so...

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May 20, 2019 14:35:34   #
davesit Loc: Lansing, New York
 
In events such as a rodeo, the organizer owns all rights to the event, including displays, images and videos etc.. They generally would let non-commercial photographers take pics, but not for any commercial exploitation (e.g. selling a photo to a newspaper) without permission. These events are not really "public" events per se, even though the public is in attendance.

A side note of this is that anyone attending an event should not think that he or she has the right to privacy. If you have the organizer's permission to shoot pictures at the event, you have the right to shoot any one in attendance, albeit it's always good to ask first.

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May 20, 2019 14:36:01   #
krl48 Loc: NY, PA now SC
 
It's their event and, reading their Media Guidelines, it appears they exercise near total control of any images taken there.

http://prorodeo.com/prorodeo/media/media-guidelines-for-rodeo-coverage

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May 20, 2019 14:39:02   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
ppage wrote:
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association Rodeo yesterday for some action shots. They were real sticklers about cameras - no lens longer that 6" and lots of other rules that all started with "no"
One person in charge said the whole event is copyrighted, trying to impress upon me that anything I might photograph was copyrighted. They only give photog passes to real phtogs from real journalism orgs. After we explained we we were only using the images for our local club competitions they relaxed a bit.

Can a public event like this be copyrighted?
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Asso... (show quote)


It's not that the event is copyrighted - I am pretty sure the copyright can't be applied BEFORE it takes place. But you definitely need permission, since it is not on public property/an event that is organized by a promoter/they want to safeguard the privacy rights of the cowboys, etc. What they don't want is to end up in court bringing an unauthorized use suit against a photographer. Not to mention the obvious conflict when an authorized and credentialed press photographer has to knock you down and smash your camera because you are standing in the primo space to get a shot. Bottom line, it's their house and you need to play by their rules.

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May 20, 2019 14:39:27   #
Soul Dr. Loc: Beautiful Shenandoah Valley
 
If you pays to get in, It's not a public event, It's a private event.
Then you have to abide by their rules.

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May 20, 2019 14:44:03   #
Longshadow Loc: Audubon, PA, United States
 
Soul Dr. wrote:
If you pays to get in, It's not a public event, It's a private event.
Then you have to abide by their rules.


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May 20, 2019 14:46:56   #
davesit Loc: Lansing, New York
 
Soul Dr. wrote:
If you pays to get in, It's not a public event, It's a private event.
Then you have to abide by their rules.


Even if the event is free, the organizer still retains the rights to the event. It's up to them to give out the rights to the attendees.

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May 20, 2019 14:47:18   #
Dirtmama834 Loc: Hurricane, Utah
 
Soul Dr. wrote:
If you pays to get in, It's not a public event, It's a private event.
Then you have to abide by their rules.


What a perfect way to explain things. Thank you.

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May 20, 2019 14:51:09   #
ppage Loc: Pittsburg, (San Francisco area)
 
Thanks everyone. Understood.

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May 20, 2019 14:58:00   #
Scruples Loc: Brooklyn, New York
 
ppage wrote:
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association Rodeo yesterday for some action shots. They were real sticklers about cameras - no lens longer that 6" and lots of other rules that all started with "no"
One person in charge said the whole event is copyrighted, trying to impress upon me that anything I might photograph was copyrighted. They only give photog passes to real phtogs from real journalism orgs. After we explained we we were only using the images for our local club competitions they relaxed a bit.

Can a public event like this be copyrighted?
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Asso... (show quote)



I'm not sure if an event can be copyrighted. From some experience, the event promoters may hire a photographer or photo crew for exclusive photographs. That means they have control and will give it to whom they see fit. Any outsiders coming with a DSLR may be frowned upon if not thrown out. Also consider that these professionals are working and making money for the promotors. You may also be physically in the way, and be asked to leave or escorted out. Basically you have to play by their rules. If the event promoter allows it, you may be able to take some shots during rehearsal. But, I doubt it. In all, it is good practice to ask before releasing the shutter. After I finish this post, I will check out my copy of, "The Copyright Zone: A Legal Guide for Photographers and Artists in the Digital Age by Greenberg and Reznicki. "
Just remember, I'm not an attorney. But I have navigated through this veritable quagmire of issues. And, let me tell you from experience I was asked to put the camera away NOW!
Good Luck!
Happy Shooting!

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May 20, 2019 16:01:18   #
Photocraig
 
ppage wrote:
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association Rodeo yesterday for some action shots. They were real sticklers about cameras - no lens longer that 6" and lots of other rules that all started with "no"
One person in charge said the whole event is copyrighted, trying to impress upon me that anything I might photograph was copyrighted. They only give photog passes to real phtogs from real journalism orgs. After we explained we we were only using the images for our local club competitions they relaxed a bit.

Can a public event like this be copyrighted?
I went to a PRCA - Professional Rodeo Cowboys Asso... (show quote)


Hint: If they charge admission, they get to name the terms. So, while open to the public, it isn't a Public Event like a parade or town picnic. The Reno Rodeo and other events have similar restrictions. I believe this is to control the images as much as it is to protect a copyright.

Rodeo has been subject to Animal Activists making images of alleged cruelty public to the determent of the PCRA and the Rodeo Associations nationwide. They also want the images of their productions to be good ones and those that reflect positively on that production. And they don't want to relinquish publication rights for images they don't control. Simple, good business.

I HATE that I can't take my DSLR and 70-300 to the Rodeo. I, therefore, don't attend and pay my money, either even though it is one of the best Rodeo's in the country. I go to my local Aces AAA game instead.

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May 21, 2019 07:47:33   #
Resqu2 Loc: SW Va
 
I’d look at this the same way my theatre works, as the director says before each show, no cameras of any type allowed when the show starts but you can take all the pics of me that you want. We have to buy rights to each show we produce and they ask that even cell phones be shut off before the show. They say it’s because the show is protected by International copyright laws. We have one photographer that takes promotional stuff during dress runs and that’s it for the run of the show.

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May 21, 2019 08:02:18   #
Scruples Loc: Brooklyn, New York
 
I am not an attorney! With that being written, the use of the word "copyright" is correct for the purpose intended. A better term would be "photographer exclusivity contract or clause." But that would be a mouthful. So that is why the word "copyright" is used liberally. An event promoter wants to control ALL aspects of the event. They have that right. Besides, having a newbie behind a professional is downright disruptive. I would hate to be in the way of another photographer. A good rule of thumb is to ask beforehand.
I can recall my daughter performing in Carnegie Hall in New York City. I was told that there will be no cameras or flash photography during the performance. So I asked if I could take photographs during rehearsal before the performance. No problem. As for a photograph of the Hall itself,I purchased some postcards and other souvenirs.
As for rodeos, I'm not very fond of these events. Regardless of whether it be animal abuse or not, I'm not really interested. That is a discussion for some other time. Yes, I will go horseback riding when I want something fun to do. I only patronize a stable that takes good care of these majestic creatures. The horses all recognize me because I always bring apple slices rinsed with diluted lemon juice.
Happy Shooting!

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May 21, 2019 09:47:17   #
fetzler Loc: North West PA
 
My panasonic 100-300mm is 6 in long when collapsed.

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