I need some help....PLEASE! (Page 3): For future reference, you can click on the 'watch' tab at the top left of each page to achieve your goal.

steve_stoneblossom Loc: Rhode Island, USA

BboH wrote:

Nothing to add - just posting so I'll get the follow up posts as they are added. This is quite fascinating.

For future reference, you can click on the 'watch' tab at the top left of each page to achieve your goal.

RicknJude Loc: Quebec, Canada

Thanks for that info Steve.

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

nikonshooter wrote:

jimberton wrote:

quote=Nikonian72 To increase DoF, have you consid... (show quote)

Whoa whoa whoa, focus stacking does not take time.....no more than the time to move your focus ring and fire off 20 plus shots. Then you can use the best aperture offering your 24x70 has, I would guess around F/11 or F/8.

When done, just load the images into Helicon Focus (stacking software) this software does the rest. It is more time consuming if done in PS but if this is how your are making a living, I can't imagine your not already using this. There are other good FS software programs, Helicon is excellent.

I have attached a photo that was stacked - 35 pictures in all. Took 10 minutes to arrange the strobes, fire the images, import into Lightroom, export into Helicon, click the render button and view.

It's easier to add a link than to add a attachment with Firefox, try these two links for more focus stacking using Helicon software.

http://www.edoverstreet.com/2011photos/jaeo/slides/Eoverstreet_150.html

http://www.edoverstreet.com/2011photos/jaeo/slides/Eoverstreet_115.html

I might also add, I can count the times I have stopped down to F22 on one hand......I have the 24x70 lens, I would not use it for a product shot but I clearly would not shoot it at F/22. I have some good glass but all of it loses IQ when headed in the direction of F/22

quote=jimberton quote=Nikonian72 To increase DoF... (show quote)

i have never shot at f22 before. the instructor wrote his settings on a blackboard and talked about them and made reference to f22 a number of times. it's not that i care if i shoot at f22, but it is disturbing me that my shots look like crap at the same aperture. alot of the smaller products i shoot at 5.6 and when the models are wearing the coats and vests, i shoot at f8 or f11. it has all been fine.......but the clarity and sharpness of his print blows me away.

thanks for the info on helicon. i will look into it. sounds interesting!

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

wowbmw wrote:

Maybe he meant the highest possible aperture it the sense of how open it could be to capture the product. Sometimes this language gets confusing.

he wrote his settings on a blackboard before he got started.

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

mafadecay wrote:

jimberton wrote:

i went to a live seminar a few weeks ago on produc... (show quote)

I also mainly cover product photography and am also a Canon shooter. I shoot mostly around the F/8 sweet spot on the same lens as you or I might use the 50mm F/1.4 prime or 100mm macro. If it is a group of products making up a kit I might have to open up to maybe F/11 to F/14 but never F/22 and never F/2.8 for sharp products. I can not get straight out of camera results and always use a tripod.

I shoot RAW but mainly for white balance reasons. I do not do much sharpening in Adobe RAW I tend to PS unsharp mask just a little tweak. They are nearly there straight out of camera but not quite. I always tweak my levels also.

Nikons are different and seem more capable of straight out of camera results. I would not necessarily say Nikons are better but they are different. I think it is what you do with your kit that counts and if F/10 works for you then so be it with mild PP.

Question: do you shoot full manual or AV? Manual will yeild same results for every shot where as AV will adjust shutter speed and vary results depending on what subject your meter can see.

Once I am set up on manual and balanced my lights etc I can fire away regardless of what product I put on the bench (mostly).

quote=jimberton i went to a live seminar a few we... (show quote)

i'm with you on all points. i shoot only in manual. i shoot all raw.

now that brings up an interesting point.....i don't know if the instructor shot in raw or jpg. if he shot in jpg...he could have had some auto processing going on....if it was some kind of nikon auto processing on a jpg........it was amazing.

just about all my product shots are at 5.6 or 8, sometimes 10 or 11, but that's as far as i have went. my f8 and f10 shots are very sharp. i would never shoot a product at 2.8.

once i set my lights (i use a sekonic flash meter) i do not have to make any other adjustments. i usually have 15-20 products at a time to shoot.

Blurryeyed Loc: NC Mountains.

Nikonian72 wrote:

This phenomenon is known as circular aperture diffraction, aka lens diffraction. This is a problem with all lasers, and with digital photography through small apertures (usually noticeable at f/22). Associated terms: Airy's Disc & circle of confusion.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/phyopt/cirapp.html
http://www.bobatkins.com/photography/technical/diffraction.html
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/u-diffraction.shtml

Good information, Thanks for posting those links.

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

Zero_Equals_Infinity wrote:

As already discussed it is not a hardware issue, b... (show quote)

i agree.........but why was his shots excellent at f22?...and they were still a tad better than mine at f10. mine were very close, but still not as good....and i used a tripod with wireless shutter control and he hand held his.

for a printer..he just had a little HP photo printer that could only print out 4x6 size.

the clarity of his shots were awesome. my shots were very good at f10, but his was definitely a step better.

maybe i am going too far on this....but i cannot get it out of my mind. that level of clarity is my goal. i want that.

but sometimes...maybe more than not...do we always get what we want.

Jeff Smith 1 Loc: Pocono Mountains, PA

It might be interesting to contact the instructor and see how he responds to the issue you are raising. Perhaps he thought he was at f/22.

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

hey guys...thanks for all your help, ideas and recommendations. that's the exact reason why this forum is so great.

my wife tells me i am going tooooo nuts on this..but she can see the difference on this photo.

i will have the d7000 and 24-70 2.8 nikon stuff on monday or tuesday and i will test it out.

i just read an article from an internet search and it said we should never shoot over f16............to me this is crazy, why do they go to f22 if you are not supposed to use it?

i don't know...it's making me crazy. too late, i think i'm already there.

i did some product shots here at work this morning at f8 and they came out so awesome......but i am saving some of the products to shoot when i get the d7000. i am almost afraid to see the results!!!

oh...and thanks for all the help and all was very constructive.....not the "nikon is better..or canon is better stuff"

i will keep you informed.

thanks again!!!

danielle_andrassy Loc: Ontario, Canada

Thanks for that tip.

steve_stoneblossom wrote:

BboH wrote:

Nothing to add - just posting so I'll get the follow up posts as they are added. This is quite fascinating.

For future reference, you can click on the 'watch' tab at the top left of each page to achieve your goal.

mafadecay Loc: Wales UK

RicknJude wrote:

I'm only replying so I get to know the outcome. Thanks.

Don't ask me where as im on my phone at moment trying to keep it from getting rained on and i do not see all the options but there's a link somewhere to add a topic to watched list. Just means what you just said is not required. You get the updates all the same.

derek dirty knees

I think there is another possibility for the great results shown by that guy. As he was demonstrating while explaning the use of his set-up, there is a possibility that he wanted to make sure the images would be great without having to spend time to make a carefull set-up. He could have faked the results by already having images recorded on the SD card which were made with carefully controled procedures. And he would say he used f22 to cover his lack of care with his focusing.

allen finley photography Loc: Sunshine State.

Jim, as far as the lens goes the Canon 24-70 2.8 is sharpest at f5.6. Check your in camera settings for sharpness as to how the camera processes your photo. Nikon cameras can use a whole bunch of in camera processing before the pic comes out. So to be fair you are not always looking at apples to apples when you make comparisons like that. Perhaps one of the Nikonian experts can better explain the in camera processing on a D7000.

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

derek dirty knees wrote:

I think there is another possibility for the great results shown by that guy. As he was demonstrating while explaning the use of his set-up, there is a possibility that he wanted to make sure the images would be great without having to spend time to make a carefull set-up. He could have faked the results by already having images recorded on the SD card which were made with carefully controled procedures. And he would say he used f22 to cover his lack of care with his focusing.

the instructor was having a problem when he started with reading the card. he opened a brand new sandisk and formatted it and used that. i don't believe there were any smoke and mirrors. we were in a hotel conference room and he came in almost late. and for the product shots, we grabbed stuff that was in the room or the hotel lobby...and a couple were camera bags that a few of the other students brought.

jimberton Loc: Michigan's Upper Peninsula

allen finley photography wrote:

Jim, as far as the lens goes the Canon 24-70 2.8 is sharpest at f5.6. Check your in camera settings for sharpness as to how the camera processes your photo. Nikon cameras can use a whole bunch of in camera processing before the pic comes out. So to be fair you are not always looking at apples to apples when you make comparisons like that. Perhaps one of the Nikonian experts can better explain the in camera processing on a D7000.

thanks for the info at 5.6.........i appreciate it. i know from one brand to another you are never comparing apples to apples...and i gues the thing is.......with my own eyeballs...am i seeing that nikon does put out a photo a step above canon?

i have lots of other canon and nikon buddies and we compare photos all the time and most of the time..mine are somewhat better...and most of the time, if you printed all the photos from all our cameras and lenses...they are pretty much the same.

but this one photo is different.

i just found out that this guy is a local from marquette, michigan. that's about 2.5 hours from here. i am going to try to contact him and try to meet him for coffee or something.

i really need to know!!!