Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

Bob ... thanks for your input ... and I'm sorry you felt let down by your Canon EOS Rebel T6 purchase. To be fair, it is (or was, until recently) the newest Canon beginner camera, and - although it's not for everyone - it does get you into the fantastic and comprehensive Canon system, at a neat and low price. I began, in the Digital DSLR world, with the earlier Canon EOS Rebel T3 ... a fantastic camera (shown in my icon) and am still wowed by the pics I get from it - even now ... some eight years later ... but much of that fascination is probably due to the A-Depth setting, which I always use, on it. It's a shame that the T3 is the last camera Canon made which featured that setting. The EOS 50D was also a fine camera, in its day - and quite elaborate, but it's a bit heavy, and overly-complicated for a beginner, I think. I have the EOS 60D ... which is in the same ball park. I think Canon realized they over simplified the T5/T6 models, and this is why they introduced the EOS Rebel SL series - the latest SL2 also incorporates the flip-out touch screen of the Rebel i-models, and the EOS 70D / 77D / 80D models, so - it is definitely in serious contention. Just wondering, though, whether she might be better able to handle the menus on the Pentax model - most intuitive, of all DSLRs, IMHO, or the education aspects of the Nikon D3000 series ... btw, the D5100 you have is a fine camera ... bit more advanced than the D3000 series ones ... I have the D5300 - love it - especially the built-in GPS !!!!

I did rush, Bob ... when I was more capable of doing so ... bought a dozen DSLRs in just under six years - about two a year, for a while. At the end of all that, I had three cameras of each of the BIG THREE - one beginner model, one intermediate model, and one Semi-Pro model - with a Pentax, and a couple of other Nikons, thrown in the mix - the D5500 (for the Touch Screen) and the D7100 - for its ability to use every Nikon lens out there!!!!

I think I'm going to chuck the T7 idea ... just try to weigh up the best, between the K-70, the SL2 and the D3500 ... see what pops!!! ... Thanks, again!

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

I don't know much about the Nikon D3400 or the Pentax K-70...

Between the two Canon models, I'd definitely go with the SL2 over the T7.... The T7 is the most entry level Canon of all and lacks a lot of things. The SL2 is the world's second smallest and lightest DSLR (only because the preceding SL1 is slightly smaller and lighter), but in spite of that the SL2 has more features than the T7. In fact, the T7 is nearly identical to its predecessor.... it got a sensor upgrade (18MP to 24MP), but otherwise is pretty much the same as the T6. It even uses the same old Digic 4 processor (Canon is now putting 2 and 3 generation newer processors in their other cameras). The SL2 has a three generation newer Digic 7 processor that allows for much better performance in a number of ways. In fact, the T7 is very difficult to find... I couldn't find it at Amazon, B&H, Adorama, Costco or Walmart. The only place I see it offered is at the Canon USA website.

SL2 has an articulated, 1 million dot, Touch Screen LCD.... T7's is fixed, 920K dot, and is not a Touch Screen.

SL2 has ISO 100-25600 range (expandable to 51200).... T7 has the same ISO 100-6400 (expand: 12800) range as its predecessor.

SL2 can shoot continuously at 5 frames per second.... T7 can only shoot at 3 frames per second.

SL2 can take advantage of higher performance UHS-1 SD cards.... T7 can use them, but doesn't support UHS-1.

Both cameras have built-in WiFi, but SL2's is Bluetooth/Smartphone capable while T7's is not.

SL2 is rated for 30% more shots per battery charge.

SL2 has a self-cleaning sensor, like most Canon DSLRs.... T7 is one of the few that doesn't. (I will never own another DSLR without this feature.)

SL2 has Dual Pixel AF in Live View (" DPAF" was introduced on the 70D and is on most Canon ever since... T7 is one of the last Canon that's still using much slower contrast detection AF in Live View.

Both cameras use essentially the same 24MP sensor.

Both cameras use a similar 9 point AF system with a single, higher performance "cross type" point at the center. The rest of the points are single axis, a mix of vertical and horizontal.

Neither camera has option to fit a battery grip to be able to use a 2nd battery or give vertical controls.

When bought in 2 lens kit, SL2 is usually bundled with EF-S 18-55mm IS STM and EF-S 55-250mm IS STM lenses.... This bundle is currently on sale many places for $750.

I only found T7 bundled with EF-S 18-55mm IS II lens, which is a little cheaper, slower and noisier focusing than the STM version. Predecessors were also often bundled with Canon's cheapest tele-zoom, the EF 75-300mm "III". The EF-S 55-250mm IS STM is a bit more expensive but a MUCH better lens in all respects: It's got noticeably better image quality than the 75-300 III. It also is closer focusing, faster focusing, quieter focusing. And the 55-250mm is image stabilized, which the 75-300 III lacks. Watch out for the 75-300 III bundled with other Canon cameras, and avoid it if at all possible.

Speaking of which, you might want to consider some other Canon models. For example, the T6i and T6s are both also 24MP and more up-scale than either SL2 or T7.... and are widely available at good prices. T6i/T6s have a better 19-point, all cross type AF system (much like the 70D's). These models can be found significantly discounted, because they have been superseded by T7i and 77D (45-point AF system, similar to 80D's). The T6i/T6s both can optionally be fitted with BG-E18 battery grip (no grip has been offered for the newer models). The T6i/T6s do not have DPAF, but have most of the other features of SL2, and more.

Canon USA sells refurbished cameras directly from their website. These have the same warranty as new... and buyers report are often little different from new. Right now they have refurbished T6i bundled with EF-S 18-55mm IS STM and EF-S 55-250mm IS STM lenses for $629 (plus sales tax... free shipping). Or, T6s is available with the same lenses for $729. (The main differences between T6i and T6s are primarily that the latter has more buttons and dials for direct control of various functions, plus has additional display on its right hand shoulder that shows most camera settings at a glance.)

You can do general comparison of cameras pretty easily using this website:
https://cameradecision.com/compare/Canon-EOS-Rebel-T7-vs-Canon-EOS-Rebel-SL2
https://cameradecision.com/compare/Canon-EOS-Rebel-T6i-vs-Canon-EOS-Rebel-SL2
https://cameradecision.com/compare/Canon-EOS-Rebel-T6i-vs-Nikon-D3400
https://cameradecision.com/compare/Pentax-K-70-vs-Nikon-D3400

There are a couple other websites that do similar comparisons... Google them if you wish.

While I don't know a great deal about those specific Nikon and Pentax models, I can tell you that Canon and Nikon offer considerably larger selection of lenses and accessories than Pentax. Both Nikon and Pentax have some backward compatibility with their respective earlier, manual focus lenses.... but both vintage Nikon F-mount and Pentax K-mount can also be used on Canon cameras via simple, inexpensive adapters.

Canon and Nikon use in-lens image stabilization. Pentax uses in-camera stabilization, which has advantage that any and all lenses used on the camera benefit from it. OTOH, with DSLRs like these, in-lens stabilization also serves to stabilize what's seen in the viewfinder. That's not the case with in-camera stabilization like the Pentax use.

In general, I've noticed with the initial purchase that Nikon camera & lens kits tend to be a little less expensive than comparable Canon. However, after that you will find that any Nikon lenses and accessories you might want to add in the future tend to be a little to a lot more expensive than comparable Canon items. I haven't compared the cost of Pentax kits or separate items.

If ever needed, Canon's warranty repair and customer service usually get very high marks. Nikon is pretty good, too.... though they are much more restrictive. They control all the costs and won't sell parts to anyone outside their own network of licensed repairers, which is about 20 shops nationwide in the U.S. In comparison, anyone can call up Canon and purchase a part from them, if needed for repair. That means there are literally hundreds of shops that can perform work on Canon gear, if needed. I have no idea how Pentax compares.

If possible, go handle the cameras in a store to see if you have any preference. Hopefully you'll be able to turn the camera on and explore the menu, too.... see if it seems easy and intuitive to navigate. Canon menus generally are considered among the easiest... but I haven't compared them personally and I'm sure any of them can be learned. I've heard more complaints about Sony menus... not much at all, one way or another, about Pentax.

Worldwide, during the first part of 2018 interchangeable lens system camera (combining DSLRs and mirrorless) market share was reported August 1: 49.1% Canon, 24.9% Nikon, 13.3% Sony. Those top three have 87.3% of the market. The rest of the manufacturers (Pentax, Olympus, Leica, Panasonic, Fujifilm, etc.) split the remaining 12.7% among them.

Have fun shopping!

Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

You chose very wisely, Tonal ... Canon is an excellent choice. And, the T3i - was the first Canon camera to feature the flip-out screen - a wonderful innovation ... which has been incorporated on every i-series Rebel, since ... and has now graduated to the EOS models, AND the new 6D Mk. II.
Yes, and Canon has an almost exhaustive complement of EOS lenses - the largest assortment of AF lenses, on the planet, in fact. No, they are not cheap, by any means ... the longer ones will probably cost more than your HOUSE! ... But, still ... there's one for EVERY known purpose!!!

Yes, I agree with you about the EOS 77D ... probably, at $650 - the best DSLR deal out there. It's the one I'll probably get for myself, when I can ....
The beginner camera I wish to get for my friend, though ... is more likely to be the SL2, or the K-70, or the new Nikon D3500 ... we'll see, soon ...

Thanks, again - for your input, Tonal ... congratulations on your choice of Canon ...

Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

Meyer ... yes, I know ... actually, dropped my K-50 ... rolled off the cart, I put it on, in its bag ... and didn't get damaged, AT ALL! ...

Of course - the black-out of the highlights in the Review Screen - has never been the same, since ...

... but, I'll tell you this ... when it rains - and I still want or need - to shoot ... it's the first one I go to ...

The K-70, though (the latest, in the line) is smaller than the K-50, and I'm not sure if it employs the aluminum frame, like that model ...

Thanks for your input, Meyer ....

Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

Rider ... so, I see ... the camps are pretty evenly divided ... Nikon, Sony, Canon, Pentax, Olympus ... no Fuji, as yet ... or Panasonic ...

But the Topic Title is focused on DSLRs anyway ... which leaves out some ...

I'll tell you this, Rider ... the most comfortable camera in my hand, I own - is the Pentax K-50 ... plenty of heft, yet - nice and light ...

But, it might not work so well for the lady in question ... you know?

wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado

Even the E-M10s I mentioned are not weatherproof like the Pentax. One has to step up one more notch to the E-M5 for that.

roger55 Loc: Tampa Bay Florida

Good day all. Looked to Pentax when I first started shopping. My local camera store said he had problems getting parts and service from Pentax. I looked at Nikon and Canon . Both had the features I wanted. Canon felt best in my hands.

Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

Good idea, Mizzee ... I shall mull that over ... will see if she agrees, anyway ...

Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

Duane ... the only problem with the D3400 - that I see - is they left out the Auto-Clean Sensor mechanism ... have to see if they put it back in the D3500!

Me, too ... actually, began with Nikon cameras in 1970 ... so, I guess that's a little more ... what - 48 years, now ...

Thanks for your recommendation, Duane ...

Chris T Loc: from England across the pond to New England

Well, thanks, Tim ... hey!!! ... that's quite a package ... latest model Nikon ... and two very recent lenses as well ... hey! ... thanks for the tip, Tim ....

And all at the right price!!! ... That's neat, Tim ... thanks a lot ....

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

Yes, the original question was about DSLRs... Not mirrorless, which tend to be more expensive and have far less selection of native lenses.

That eliminates Fuji, Panasonic and Olympus... who only make mirrorless now. It also largely rules out Sony, who have few DSLRs remaining in their line-up. (I haven't looked lately... do they have any?)

WayneL Loc: Baltimore Md

I've had Nikons, Canons and Sonys but now use Pentax and think they give the best value for your money. I think the K70 is weather sealed, you won't get that in the other low end cameras.

shangyrhee Loc: Nashville TN to Sacramento CA

I vote for Pentax K70 which is solidly built and has features you need. If you attach Sigma or Tamron 18-300mm that will cover pretty much every thing form wide angle to tele ie wild life shots. The camera body is water & dust resistant.I have been sooting for 3years with no issue. Good luck. Shang

cambriaman Loc: Central CA Coast

You mentioned DSLR but if I was just starting I would give the mirrorless cameras with interchangeable lenses a look before I decided.

SFPete

I prefer Pentax. In body optical stabilization means a vast array of older lenses available for experimentation.