tenny52 Loc: San Francisco

I came across some super detailed photo on-line and they were per Phase One IQ180 which was professional grade and very expensive.
But on KEH, Phase One 645 DF Medium Format Camera Body sells for $792 and can use Mamiya 645AF series lenses which are very reasonable priced.
Phase One is a Danish company and now owns Mamiya according to on-line report.
So with $1500, one can already buy a Phase One camera with about 3-4 lenses for travelling and party.
The question is: Does anyone have experience with such gears and how are they compared to similar priced N & C brands?

SharpShooter Loc: NorCal

Phase one is one of the preferred high end cameras of any MF pro. Joey L shoots with one. He’s one of my heroes!!
What you’re looking at must be an empty film body with no back. A phase one digital back is extremely expensive.
I would buy one in a heartbeat if I had the money!!!
SS

letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.

Does this camera also need the Digital Back?

tenny52 Loc: San Francisco

Phase one can easily cost more than a new Camry.
It doesn't seems to be a film camera selling for $792
https://www.keh.com/shop/phase-one-645-df-medium-format-camera-body-676360.html?m=Grouped&prod_id=1132662&aid=1132662&rmatt=tsid:|cid:843697358|agid:42901506677|tid:pla-300416081410|crid:198141512877|nw:g|rnd:973751258424296454|dvc:c|adp:1o1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIlrrO67Wa2QIVTp7ACh35WAfCEAQYASABEgKUrfD_BwE

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

Yes. At $792 there is no back, no lens. A P45+ back, 39mp, with a low shutter count will cost around $3700.

letmedance Loc: Walnut, Ca.

I had looked at Phase One a few years back and remembered that a digital back was required.
Thanks.

tenny52 Loc: San Francisco

Well, I learned something new. What is digital back of a camera? Is it like a cpu/sensor which can be used for different model of cameras.

Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)

Pretty much. But it also gives you the ability to select anything from 20mp to 80 mp or even higher. You just need a checkbook or a credit card with a very high limit . . .

ELNikkor

If you want to take pictures with it, (!), it will cost around $4,000.00 with a back and 1 lens.

BobHartung Loc: Bettendorf, IA

The digital back replaces the film holder of old. It houses the sensor and all the supporting electronics, switches to control the back, house the memory card, etc.

Phase One backs go to the Stratosphere in price. Look them up online although their website is a maze.

rmalarz Loc: Tempe, Arizona

I've read some negative reviews of the Phase One cameras regarding reliability. This was a couple of years ago. The author stated that it'd be best to buy three of them to make sure you had a working one with you while the others were being repaired. That review caused me to rethink my path to medium digital.
--Bob

SharpShooter Loc: NorCal

Yes, there are digital backs.
In fact at least one company made a digital back that fit the Mamiya film cameras and many product Pros went that route and continued to use their Mamiya film kits at the start of digital and beyond. Back in the 2000’s a 20mp back was about $20K. A friend of mine used one untill about 2010 until the back had sooo many dead pixels that he could no longer easily clone them in. He replaced it with a Nikon D800 when the 800 came out.
SS

BobHartung Loc: Bettendorf, IA

Same here ended up with X1D.

amfoto1 Loc: San Jose, Calif. USA

Phase One is primarily a maker of digital backs for many different medium format cameras, as well as offering some software (Capture One).

Their digital backs have ranged in size from 16MP to 80MP. Earlier ones used CCD sensors, but they were one of the first medium format back makers to convert to better CMOS.

The 645 DF were a 2009 model jointly produced with Mamiya (the same camera sells under that brand, too). I am not certain which of the backs it's able to use. It was superseded by the DF+, not sure exactly when or the differences between them, but that model has since been superseded by the current XF models using "IQ" backs with up to 100MP sensors (approx. 2.5X larger than "full frame" DSLR sensors). Again, I'm not sure of the differences. But the collaboration with Mamiya means that you can likely use a lot of their vintage lenses. Some of the modern lenses are being made in collaboration with Shneider-Kreuznach and feature leaf shutters (one advantage of which is very high flash sync speeds are possible).

I'd wager that 645 DF at KEH for $792 is the body only... no back.

Leaf is another medium format digital back manufacturer that's made backs for the Mamiya cameras. I think Phase One and Leaf have now merged.. and products are selling under both name brands.

I couldn't find a Phase One 645 DF for sale with or without a back....

But a brand new Mamiya Leaf Credo 80MP Digital Back (CCD!) in kit with 645DF Medium Format DSLR and 80mm f/2.8 LS D Lens is selling for $28,495!

Or, brand new Mamiya 645 DF+ body without back but with 80mm lens is selling for $8000. A 50MP Leaf Credo back for it costs $19,995. Aside from the included 80mm, there are eight other lenses available for it (one zoom, seven primes) ranging in price from $2990 to $5490.

In their used dept. B&H has a Mamiya Leaf Credo 40MP Digital Back (only) in Mamiya 645DF mount for $9425. That's for the back alone!

Possibly the "best deal" in MF digital right now is probably the Fuji GFX 50S... a 50MP CMOS mirrorless model with "modern" range of ISOs and 3 frames per second shooting speeds, for $6500 without lens. The back isn't interchangeable and there's fairly few lenses for it yet (one zoom and four primes costing $1500 to $2600 approx.), but I think it can utilize some earlier lenses via adapters (probably manual focus only).

The Pentax 645Z is similar price, specification and design: 51MP, 3 frames per second, non-interchangeable back... except it's NOT mirrorless, uses an optical viewfinder... on sale at both B&H and Adorama for under $5500 right now ($1500 discount). Fifteen Pentax "FA" lenses are available for it (six zooms, nine primes) ranging in price from about $700 (75mm) to nearly $5000 (300mm f/4).

The next least expensive MF digital at B&H is the Hasselblad X1D 50C (also 50MP CMOS, mirrorless, non-interchangeable back) on sale right now for $11,395 with wide angle 45mm f/3.5 lens. Three other XCD lenses for it sell for between $3200 and $4500 apiece. I don't know if other lenses are adaptable to it.

Notice that the least expensive models are all fixed-back. The modular MF such as the 645 DF, in more modern specification offering much higher ISO capability, better image quality, improved AF and frame rates, are A LOT more expensive.

In other words, I think you're dreamin', if you hope to put together a MF digital capable of those incredible images for $1500! You might find some older, low resolution CCD back for little money and fit it to one of the earlier cameras and use them with a vintage, manual focus lens that doesn't cost a fortune. But you'd probably see better overall performance and image quality with a modern full frame DSLR that costs about the same... such as a Canon 6D (older 20MP model) w/24-105mm STM lens is selling for $1700.

tenny52 Loc: San Francisco

I use a Nikon D610 with a walk-around 24-85mm lens for about $1300
Yes, I was dreaming to owe a Phase One for $1500 with lens, which will definitely promote me at least one level higher of my photo skill.
Now I know they are untouchables. Bit I still have a dream that one day our pictures will be judged by our artistic talents and limited not by the quality of our gears.