Afraid of history (Page 2): And much easier to edit.

phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO

chrisscholbe wrote:

History books are fine, because they portray,history....hopefully, what actually happened.

We can/should learn from history books.

This is very different from erecting monuments.

And much easier to edit.

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

boberic wrote:

Many in the south want the removal of many statues... (show quote)

The statues are, of course, history, as were lynching, other examples of treason, s***ery itself, suffering in Civil War POW camps, etc. History is, in fact, a record of everything that ever happened, good, bad, or indifferent.

The issue you address is this: Which of these should be commemorated, expecially which should be commemorated using tax dollars? Is it appropriate, reasonable and meaningful to spend tax dollars to commemorate Treason?

Would it be reasonable, for example, to spend tax dollars to commemorate Machine Gun Kelly and his various adventures, or Jesse James, or the abuse of Chinese workers in building the railroads out West, or Al Capone, or The Boston Strangler, or Julius and Ethel Rosenberg?

I don't mind in the least some redneck who wants to wear a confederate f**g on his tee shirt, or hang one from his truck; self-announced idiocy is acceptable. Somewhere there must be someone wearing a tee shirt commemorating the Cubs throwing the World Series.

But for officialdom of government spending tax dollars to commemorate these things just doesn't seem appropriate.

We have books, TV shows and movies dealing with all of these, but books, TV shows and movies aren't tax-supported and officially recognized commemorations. If one wanted to commercialize a scandalous red light district as a tourist attraction, or the city of Tombstone and the OK Corral, or a private gangster museum (we have one in Hot Springs) that's fine. We also have a club in Hot Springs, funded in 1905, that was a speakeasy and worse during prohibition (pretending to be a cigar store then) that still functions, and--privately--glorifies gangsters and gangsterism, and by implication glorifies prostitution, illegal gambling, and the violence that goes with all of these--but we don't use tax dollars and public adoration to enhance its history and their meaning; Memphis has bars and more on Main Street which are rich in history and infamous, but they suffer along on private money, monuments to man's shortcomings, errors and violence, and are not enobled by official acclaim and tax support.

The Civil War, which is usually what we are talking about, was Treason in support of the Very Worst of
Humanity and its failings, and its toll was incalculable violence, suffering, with a goal of destroying this nation.

Surely the perpetrators of this deserve no official commemoration, official respect, or emulation.

user47602 Loc: ip 304.0.0.33.32

phcaan wrote:

Yup, destroy, label, forget. Sort of like the Taliban destroying ancient building and monuments, you guys teach them, or learn from them?

wait...

are you seriously comparing religious monuments erected to the glory of our creator that have stood for thousands of years to 150 year-old statues honoring a t*****r to the republic and the institution of s***ery?

...most people would see a connection with the Taliban and w***e s*********ts...hehe.

phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO

Twardlow wrote:

The statues are, of course, history, as were lynching, other examples of treason, s***ery itself, suffering in Civil War POW camps, etc. History is, in fact, a record of everything that ever happened, good, bad, or indifferent.

The issue you address is this: Which of these should be commemorated, expecially which should be commemorated using tax dollars? Is it appropriate, reasonable and meaningful to spend tax dollars to commemorate Treason?

Would it be reasonable, for example, to spend tax dollars to commemorate Machine Gun Kelly and his various adventures, or Jesse James, or the abuse of Chinese workers in building the railroads out West, or Al Capone, or The Boston Strangler, or Julius and Ethel Rosenberg?

I don't mind in the least some redneck who wants to wear a confederate f**g on his tee shirt, or hang one from his truck; self-announced idiocy is acceptable. Somewhere there must be someone wearing a tee shirt commemorating the Cubs throwing the World Series.

But for officialdom of government spending tax dollars to commemorate these things just doesn't seem appropriate.

We have books, TV shows and movies dealing with all of these, but books, TV shows and movies aren't tax-supported and officially recognized commemorations. If one wanted to commercialize a scandalous red light district as a tourist attraction, or the city of Tombstone and the OK Corral, or a private gangster museum (we have one in Hot Springs) that's fine. We also have a club in Hot Springs, funded in 1905, that was a speakeasy and worse during prohibition (pretending to be a cigar store then) that still functions, and--privately--glorifies gangsters and gangsterism, and by implication glorifies prostitution, illegal gambling, and the violence that goes with all of these--but we don't use tax dollars and public adoration to enhance its history and their meaning; Memphis has bars and more on Main Street which are rich in history and infamous, but they suffer along on private money, monuments to man's shortcomings, errors and violence, and are not enobled by official acclaim and tax support.

The Civil War, which is usually what we are talking about, was Treason in support of the Very Worst of
Humanity and its failings, and its toll was incalculable violence, suffering, with a goal of destroying this nation.

Surely the perpetrators of this deserve no official commemoration, official respect, or emulation.

The statues are, of course, history, as were lynch... (show quote)

Cry me a river tward.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

phcaan wrote:

Yup, destroy, label, forget. Sort of like the Taliban destroying ancient building and monuments, you guys teach them, or learn from them?

The statue was erected in 1924 for god's sake. It isn't ancient, although you were probably quite young at the time.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

user47602 wrote:

wait...

are you seriously comparing religious monuments erected to the glory of our creator that have stood for thousands of years to 150 year-old statues honoring a t*****r to the republic and the institution of s***ery?

...most people would see a connection with the Taliban and w***e s*********ts...hehe.

How about less than 100 years old.

idaholover Loc: Nampa ID

Rab-Eye wrote:

I cannot speak for others, but perhaps they think it wrong to honor those who represent the worst moral stain in American history.

It is also wrong to break the law and we are not a nation of men but laws.

idaholover Loc: Nampa ID

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/15/criminal-charges-sought-for-protesters-who-toppled-confederate-statue-in-north-carolina.html

Twardlow Loc: Arkansas

phcaan wrote:

Cry me a river tward.

This is the pathetic best you can do.

You have nothing to say, no contribution to add to the conversation, to further the dialogue and increase understanding, to illuminate, but you just have to say something, like "Look At Me, Look At Me!," with an empty mind, a loud voice, and a pronounced fear of not being noticed.

And your failing isn't even appropriate, witty or humorous.

Moron.

idaholover Loc: Nampa ID

Twardlow wrote:

The statues are, of course, history, as were lynching, other examples of treason, s***ery itself, suffering in Civil War POW camps, etc. History is, in fact, a record of everything that ever happened, good, bad, or indifferent.

The issue you address is this: Which of these should be commemorated, expecially which should be commemorated using tax dollars? Is it appropriate, reasonable and meaningful to spend tax dollars to commemorate Treason?

Would it be reasonable, for example, to spend tax dollars to commemorate Machine Gun Kelly and his various adventures, or Jesse James, or the abuse of Chinese workers in building the railroads out West, or Al Capone, or The Boston Strangler, or Julius and Ethel Rosenberg?

I don't mind in the least some redneck who wants to wear a confederate f**g on his tee shirt, or hang one from his truck; self-announced idiocy is acceptable. Somewhere there must be someone wearing a tee shirt commemorating the Cubs throwing the World Series.

But for officialdom of government spending tax dollars to commemorate these things just doesn't seem appropriate.

We have books, TV shows and movies dealing with all of these, but books, TV shows and movies aren't tax-supported and officially recognized commemorations. If one wanted to commercialize a scandalous red light district as a tourist attraction, or the city of Tombstone and the OK Corral, or a private gangster museum (we have one in Hot Springs) that's fine. We also have a club in Hot Springs, funded in 1905, that was a speakeasy and worse during prohibition (pretending to be a cigar store then) that still functions, and--privately--glorifies gangsters and gangsterism, and by implication glorifies prostitution, illegal gambling, and the violence that goes with all of these--but we don't use tax dollars and public adoration to enhance its history and their meaning; Memphis has bars and more on Main Street which are rich in history and infamous, but they suffer along on private money, monuments to man's shortcomings, errors and violence, and are not enobled by official acclaim and tax support.

The Civil War, which is usually what we are talking about, was Treason in support of the Very Worst of
Humanity and its failings, and its toll was incalculable violence, suffering, with a goal of destroying this nation.

Surely the perpetrators of this deserve no official commemoration, official respect, or emulation.

The statues are, of course, history, as were lynch... (show quote)

It wasn't the "Very Worst", maybe your book, but it should be added to the collection. What Obama's ISIS JV team is doing right now may trump the civil war. BTW, yes, at the end of the day, the Civil War was about s***ery but selective memory won't fix that. If you are going to shine the light of t***h on history you had better be willing to look at all of it even if it goes against your/our prejudiced preconceptions. You have failed miserably on here on that account.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

idaholover wrote:

It is also wrong to break the law and we are not a nation of men but laws.

The city decided to remove the statue after considerable deliberation. Removing the statue was not an act of vigilantism.

idaholover Loc: Nampa ID

thom w wrote:

The city decided to remove the statue after considerable deliberation. Removing the statue was not an act of vigilantism.

Really?
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/15/criminal-charges-sought-for-protesters-who-toppled-confederate-statue-in-north-carolina.html

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

idaholover wrote:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/15/criminal-charges-sought-for-protesters-who-toppled-confederate-statue-in-north-carolina.html

Don't know enough about this occurrence to know who is right. Charlottesville was a very different situation.

phcaan Loc: Willow Springs, MO

thom w wrote:

The statue was erected in 1924 for god's sake. It isn't ancient, although you were probably quite young at the time.

And you would destroy anything that does not promote you progressive agenda, I thought so.

thom w Loc: San Jose, CA

idaholover wrote:

Really?
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/08/15/criminal-charges-sought-for-protesters-who-toppled-confederate-statue-in-north-carolina.html

Really, learn to read s**t before linking to it. Different place, different statue.