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Bridge camera vs. mirrorless with a long lens
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Apr 22, 2018 17:48:28   #
Deanie1113
 
I'm a little confused about sensor size. I'm looking at a Sony RX 10 IV that has a "1.0 CMOS sensor" having 20.1 mp and also the OM-D E-MI 11 having a "high speed 20 mp Live MOS sensor." What is the difference here? To me the main things that matter are light weight and image quality. The Oly is a bit more expensive and I get that I can put different lenses on it, but I really just want this camera for birding and sports action and would buy the 75-300 zoom and leave it on always. I have my Nikon dslr for everything else. Can someone clear this up for me? Thank you!

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Apr 23, 2018 02:14:51   #
wdross Loc: Castle Rock, Colorado
 
Deanie1113 wrote:
I'm a little confused about sensor size. I'm looking at a Sony RX 10 IV that has a "1.0 CMOS sensor" having 20.1 mp and also the OM-D E-MI 11 having a "high speed 20 mp Live MOS sensor." What is the difference here? To me the main things that matter are light weight and image quality. The Oly is a bit more expensive and I get that I can put different lenses on it, but I really just want this camera for birding and sports action and would buy the 75-300 zoom and leave it on always. I have my Nikon dslr for everything else. Can someone clear this up for me? Thank you!
I'm a little confused about sensor size. I'm looki... (show quote)


If you are always shooting in daylight, it may not make a lot of difference. But as soon as the light levels start to drop, this is when a larger sensor starts to make a difference. Also, it can make a slight difference with the aspect ratio of the sensors. 4/3rds was chosen by manufacturers for the fact it was the best compromise between all possible common print ratios. In other words, less cropping.

The Olympus E-M1mrII can be used for birding especially with the abilities of the the better tracking sensor, but it is still not quite up to the levels of the full frame cameras as a birding camera. But it can be used for birding. Also, the 75-300 is an acceptably sharp lense, but is a slower lens and not as sharp than the prime 300 f4, with it's image stabilization, at 300mm. The 75-300 will be lighter, a little slower, and less costly than the 300mm. But the 300 mm will be the sharper and better stabilized of the two.

One more thing you might consider as making a difference. The frames for Olympus Pro Capture is now 36 frames and the frame rate of a full 20mp RAW images are at 60 images per second. The Sony RX 10 IV I don't believe can do that. This may allow a capture rather than relying on a single press of the button.

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Apr 23, 2018 03:00:19   #
tdekany Loc: Oregon
 
https://www.mu-43.com/threads/a-day-in-the-bay-with-the-lowly-em1-1-and-the-lowlier-75-300.98065/

Look at what that combo is capable of doing

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Apr 23, 2018 05:54:08   #
Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI
 
tdekany wrote:
https://www.mu-43.com/threads/a-day-in-the-bay-with-the-lowly-em1-1-and-the-lowlier-75-300.98065/

Look at what that combo is capable of doing


And that was with the mk1...it’ll be even better with the mk2.

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Apr 23, 2018 06:04:26   #
Deanie1113
 
OMG! If I could get these shots I'd be so happy! The main reason I am not interested in the 300 prime is because I've sometimes had birds land RIGHT next to me while out in the woods and I'm afraid the 300 would be too close. So out of the two cameras I mentioned, are you saying the one sensor is larger than the other? If so, which one?

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Apr 23, 2018 06:10:36   #
Deanie1113
 
Do you know why my question is not on the "main photography discussion page"? I don't think anyone else can see it hmmm. I posted the question last night.

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Apr 23, 2018 06:36:42   #
pecohen Loc: Central Maine
 
wdross wrote:
If you are always shooting in daylight, it may not make a lot of difference. But as soon as the light levels start to drop, this is when a larger sensor starts to make a difference. Also, it can make a slight difference with the aspect ratio of the sensors. 4/3rds was chosen by manufacturers for the fact it was the best compromise between all possible common print ratios. In other words, less cropping.

The Olympus E-M1mrII can be used for birding especially with the abilities of the the better tracking sensor, but it is still not quite up to the levels of the full frame cameras as a birding camera. But it can be used for birding. Also, the 75-300 is an acceptably sharp lense, but is a slower lens and not as sharp than the prime 300 f4, with it's image stabilization, at 300mm. The 75-300 will be lighter, a little slower, and less costly than the 300mm. But the 300 mm will be the sharper and better stabilized of the two.

One more thing you might consider as making a difference. The frames for Olympus Pro Capture is now 36 frames and the frame rate of a full 20mp RAW images are at 60 images per second. The Sony RX 10 IV I don't believe can do that. This may allow a capture rather than relying on a single press of the button.
If you are always shooting in daylight, it may not... (show quote)

It would seem to me that a big advantage of a large sensor for action shots is that for a given length lens the field of view is larger. That allows a greater margin for error when aiming.

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Apr 23, 2018 07:35:31   #
Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI
 
Deanie1113 wrote:
Do you know why my question is not on the "main photography discussion page"? I don't think anyone else can see it hmmm. I posted the question last night.


It’s there...otherwise we wouldn’t have posted.

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Apr 23, 2018 07:59:14   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
tdekany wrote:
https://www.mu-43.com/threads/a-day-in-the-bay-with-the-lowly-em1-1-and-the-lowlier-75-300.98065/

Look at what that combo is capable of doing


Just like my pots, fry pans and professional range make an amazing dinner -

The reality is that in Alaska, it's not hard to get close to eagles and other animals - and with a kayak it's even easier. Down-sampling an image from 16 mp to 1.9 mp also helps with noise and overall image quality. But putting aside the technical aspects, he is a great photographer, which is the main reason he gets these shots.

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Apr 23, 2018 08:06:57   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
pecohen wrote:
It would seem to me that a big advantage of a large sensor for action shots is that for a given length lens the field of view is larger. That allows a greater margin for error when aiming.


That isn't necessarily true. If you use the same focal length, yes, you are correct. But the big advantages are that you don't have to magnify the image as much for prints and the bigger sensors often, but not always have larger photosites (pixels) and provide less noise.

What is interesting is that the M4/3 cameras have some extremely high quality lenses available. Keep in mind that a 300mm lens on an M4/3 is the same field of view as a 600mm lens on a full frame camera. And the Sony RX10M4 Zeiss lens is 8.8-220mm - for a field of view equivalent to a 24mm to 600mm on a full frame camera.

I shoot with the Sony and a Nikon D810, and 600mm lenses when I go out for birds and wildlife. The field of view is certainly not any larger. The Sony's lens is F4 at max zoom, equivalent to my 600mm F4. Using a shorter focal length does improve getting the critter in the shot, but at the expense of image quality when you crop. The Sony's images are ok with modest cropping, the full frame D810 I can crop from 36mp to 5 mp and the shots will still look better than those I take with the Sony uncropped.

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Apr 23, 2018 08:25:46   #
Gene51 Loc: Yonkers, NY, now in LSD (LowerSlowerDelaware)
 
Deanie1113 wrote:
I'm a little confused about sensor size. I'm looking at a Sony RX 10 IV that has a "1.0 CMOS sensor" having 20.1 mp and also the OM-D E-MI 11 having a "high speed 20 mp Live MOS sensor." What is the difference here? To me the main things that matter are light weight and image quality. The Oly is a bit more expensive and I get that I can put different lenses on it, but I really just want this camera for birding and sports action and would buy the 75-300 zoom and leave it on always. I have my Nikon dslr for everything else. Can someone clear this up for me? Thank you!
I'm a little confused about sensor size. I'm looki... (show quote)


The Olympus you are considering is a great camera. But once you get done getting the lenses that will do it justice, you will have spent some $$$. The Sony is the best and lightest camera I have come across that can be used for birding and wildlife. These images were taken when I had had only a couple of weeks with the camera in December, and I was still trying to navigate it's menu and features. Autofocus is the fastest on acquisition that I have ever used, including the OM-D E-MI II. I just wish the Sony had a bigger sensor, but then everything else would be bigger. And it would weigh more than 2.5 lbs.

Sony RX10M3
Sony RX10M3...
(Download)

Sony RX10M4
Sony RX10M4...
(Download)

Sony RX10M4
Sony RX10M4...
(Download)

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Apr 23, 2018 08:30:46   #
Linda From Maine Loc: Yakima, Washington
 
Deanie1113 wrote:
Do you know why my question is not on the "main photography discussion page"? I don't think anyone else can see it hmmm. I posted the question last night.
The daily digest email is just a sampling of all that's posted to UHH. As mentioned, your topic is here; otherwise we wouldn't be able to reply

If you have lots and lots of free time, a better way to browse UHH is with the "newest topics" link at top of every page. Before doing that, scroll to "all sections" at bottom of page and subscribe to all that might interest you. You can also unsubscribe to ones that don't (I got rid of general chit-chat years ago).

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Apr 23, 2018 08:39:21   #
Deanie1113
 
Thanks for providing these image samples. They are great, but do they look a little soft? Or maybe it's just that it's an upload. Has uploading softened them up or were they looking just like this?

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Apr 23, 2018 09:42:11   #
suntouched Loc: Sierra Vista AZ
 
tdekany wrote:
https://www.mu-43.com/threads/a-day-in-the-bay-with-the-lowly-em1-1-and-the-lowlier-75-300.98065/

Look at what that combo is capable of doing


Thanks for posting! Nice images.

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Apr 23, 2018 10:26:56   #
Cdouthitt Loc: Traverse City, MI
 
Deanie1113 wrote:
Thanks for providing these image samples. They are great, but do they look a little soft? Or maybe it's just that it's an upload. Has uploading softened them up or were they looking just like this?


Just curious...how good are your post processing skills? I do find that to get the most out of m4/3 images, you’re going to want to shoot RAW.

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