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Why We Don't Look Like Chimps
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Oct 5, 2015 11:57:47   #
James Shaw
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Just another scientific evidence for Creation from God.

"Let's consider just one part of the transition that would be required -- to go from an ape-like face to a human one. The portraits of our supposed ancestors are in museums everywhere, and on the web pages of National Geographic -- the latest one, H. naledi, can be found there now. But whether or not that reconstructed face is a part of our history, the question remains: Is there enough time for us to have acquired by purely, Darwinian natural processes the differences that make us look human as opposed to ape-like?" NO

So let's ask the question. Could naturalistic processes guided only by natural selection have accomplished any of this? Changes to the expression of one gene or another can affect morphology -- changing the expression of the gene ALX1 affects the size and shape of finch beaks, for example. Getting one regulatory change to an enhancer is not impossible. But there are multiple enhancers controlling multiple genes involved in facial morphology (see the paper in Nature by Lamichhaney et al.), and to get coordinated regulation of multiple genes, multiple enhancers must have changed in a coordinated fashion.

Is that possible? Durrett and Schmidt published a paper examining how long it would take to have two coordinated mutations (one inactivating and the other activating) take place in an evolving hominin population. They found it would require in excess of 100 million years. Obviously, the hominin population did not have that long to wait for regulatory change. We supposedly diverged from chimps six million years ago.

Nowhere in this paper is it demonstrated that anything like this regulatory network could have evolved step by step in the time available. All it establishes is that our faces are different from chimps because we have different regulatory sequences. In fact, I don't know of anywhere it has been demonstrated that regulatory changes on this scale could be the product of evolution.

In the meantime, we do know something that can coordinate change on this scale. It's called intelligence.

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2015/10/why_we_dont_loo099831.html
Just another scientific evidence for Creation from... (show quote)

No evidence of creation whatsoever in this video, from a God or anything else. Clown's false propaganda, once again. Video unreal.

This clown was bashed badly on his last post, so he is tries to escape by posting another one.

No evidence of a God-Creation at all. Ridiculous post.

_____________
The epitome of stupidity.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 11:58:06   #
Wellhiem Loc: Sunny England.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Just another scientific evidence for Creation from God.

"Let's consider just one part of the transition that would be required -- to go from an ape-like face to a human one. The portraits of our supposed ancestors are in museums everywhere, and on the web pages of National Geographic -- the latest one, H. naledi, can be found there now. But whether or not that reconstructed face is a part of our history, the question remains: Is there enough time for us to have acquired by purely, Darwinian natural processes the differences that make us look human as opposed to ape-like?" NO

So let's ask the question. Could naturalistic processes guided only by natural selection have accomplished any of this? Changes to the expression of one gene or another can affect morphology -- changing the expression of the gene ALX1 affects the size and shape of finch beaks, for example. Getting one regulatory change to an enhancer is not impossible. But there are multiple enhancers controlling multiple genes involved in facial morphology (see the paper in Nature by Lamichhaney et al.), and to get coordinated regulation of multiple genes, multiple enhancers must have changed in a coordinated fashion.

Is that possible? Durrett and Schmidt published a paper examining how long it would take to have two coordinated mutations (one inactivating and the other activating) take place in an evolving hominin population. They found it would require in excess of 100 million years. Obviously, the hominin population did not have that long to wait for regulatory change. We supposedly diverged from chimps six million years ago.

Nowhere in this paper is it demonstrated that anything like this regulatory network could have evolved step by step in the time available. All it establishes is that our faces are different from chimps because we have different regulatory sequences. In fact, I don't know of anywhere it has been demonstrated that regulatory changes on this scale could be the product of evolution.

In the meantime, we do know something that can coordinate change on this scale. It's called intelligence.

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2015/10/why_we_dont_loo099831.html
Just another scientific evidence for Creation from... (show quote)


Given the alternative that creationism would suggest, if we all descended from Adam and Eve, all humans should be similar. We're not. Next argument.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 13:50:40   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Wellhiem wrote:
Given the alternative that creationism would suggest, if we all descended from Adam and Eve, all humans should be similar. We're not. Next argument.


You just made a horrible argument, all humans are similar..we all don't look exactly alike but we all look human.

Reply
 
 
Oct 5, 2015 13:52:08   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Wellhiem wrote:
Given the alternative that creationism would suggest, if we all descended from Adam and Eve, all humans should be similar. We're not. Next argument.


By the way, all of you are missing an important fact..which is...>>

Is that possible? Durrett and Schmidt published a paper examining how long it would take to have two coordinated mutations (one inactivating and the other activating) take place in an evolving hominin population. They found it would require in excess of 100 million years. Obviously, the hominin population did not have that long to wait for regulatory change. We supposedly diverged from chimps six million years ago.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 16:17:40   #
silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
By the way, all of you are missing an important fact..which is...>>

Is that possible? Durrett and Schmidt published a paper examining how long it would take to have two coordinated mutations (one inactivating and the other activating) take place in an evolving hominin population. They found it would require in excess of 100 million years. Obviously, the hominin population did not have that long to wait for regulatory change. We supposedly diverged from chimps six million years ago.
By the way, all of you are missing an important fa... (show quote)


You are truly an idiot. Humans did not diverge from chimps, both have a common ancestor. You are really nuts.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 16:37:15   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Diverge verb (used without object), diverged, diverging.
1.
to move, lie, or extend in different directions from a common point; branch off. also, to claim we came from a common ancestor of ape like creatures is pure speculation...it is not based on observable scientific evidence.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 16:41:00   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Wellhiem wrote:
Given the alternative that creationism would suggest, if we all descended from Adam and Eve, all humans should be similar. We're not. Next argument.


Adam and Eve were different genders and did not look exactly alike. Tell me, who came first..the male of female gender? just curious.

Reply
 
 
Oct 5, 2015 16:41:01   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Wellhiem wrote:
Given the alternative that creationism would suggest, if we all descended from Adam and Eve, all humans should be similar. We're not. Next argument.


Adam and Eve were different genders and did not look exactly alike. Tell me, who came first..the male of female gender? just curious.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 17:02:09   #
silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Adam and Eve were different genders and did not look exactly alike. Tell me, who came first..the male of female gender? just curious.


First you have to believe the silly stories in the bible. It never happened.

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 17:03:19   #
silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Diverge verb (used without object), diverged, diverging.
1.
to move, lie, or extend in different directions from a common point; branch off. also, to claim we came from a common ancestor of ape like creatures is pure speculation...it is not based on observable scientific evidence.


http://www.phy.duke.edu/~rgb/Philosophy/axioms/axioms/node47.html

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 17:04:36   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
Before any of the militant atheists comment in here again with vitriol and insults, maybe you should listen to this message about Dr William Provine. You may learn something from this good man, may the Lord be with his soul I pray.

Nelson, Luskin Share Memories of Will Provine
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2015/10/listen_nelson_l099801.html

Reply
 
 
Oct 5, 2015 17:37:44   #
silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Before any of the militant atheists comment in here again with vitriol and insults, maybe you should listen to this message about Dr William Provine. You may learn something from this good man, may the Lord be with his soul I pray.

Nelson, Luskin Share Memories of Will Provine
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2015/10/listen_nelson_l099801.html


http://www.phy.duke.edu/~rgb/Philosophy/axioms/axioms/node47.html

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 17:42:12   #
slocumeddie Loc: Inside your head, again
 
Racmanaz wrote:
http://vimeo.com/102354414

Chimp DNA
The piece is just word salad from ICR..........98% still stands..........You cannot redefine the genome to fit your point of view..........

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 17:47:03   #
slocumeddie Loc: Inside your head, again
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Before any of the militant atheists comment in here again with vitriol and insults, maybe you should listen to this message about Dr William Provine. You may learn something from this good man, may the Lord be with his soul I pray.

Nelson, Luskin Share Memories of Will Provine
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2015/10/listen_nelson_l099801.html
A simple but blatant diversion.....nothing more..........

Reply
Oct 5, 2015 18:32:51   #
OldDoc Loc: New York
 
Racmanaz wrote:
Just another scientific evidence for Creation from God.

"Let's consider just one part of the transition that would be required -- to go from an ape-like face to a human one. The portraits of our supposed ancestors are in museums everywhere, and on the web pages of National Geographic -- the latest one, H. naledi, can be found there now. But whether or not that reconstructed face is a part of our history, the question remains: Is there enough time for us to have acquired by purely, Darwinian natural processes the differences that make us look human as opposed to ape-like?" NO

So let's ask the question. Could naturalistic processes guided only by natural selection have accomplished any of this? Changes to the expression of one gene or another can affect morphology -- changing the expression of the gene ALX1 affects the size and shape of finch beaks, for example. Getting one regulatory change to an enhancer is not impossible. But there are multiple enhancers controlling multiple genes involved in facial morphology (see the paper in Nature by Lamichhaney et al.), and to get coordinated regulation of multiple genes, multiple enhancers must have changed in a coordinated fashion.

Is that possible? Durrett and Schmidt published a paper examining how long it would take to have two coordinated mutations (one inactivating and the other activating) take place in an evolving hominin population. They found it would require in excess of 100 million years. Obviously, the hominin population did not have that long to wait for regulatory change. We supposedly diverged from chimps six million years ago.

Nowhere in this paper is it demonstrated that anything like this regulatory network could have evolved step by step in the time available. All it establishes is that our faces are different from chimps because we have different regulatory sequences. In fact, I don't know of anywhere it has been demonstrated that regulatory changes on this scale could be the product of evolution.

In the meantime, we do know something that can coordinate change on this scale. It's called intelligence.

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2015/10/why_we_dont_loo099831.html
Just another scientific evidence for Creation from... (show quote)

Please go and read the Durrett and Schmidt paper instead of the classic comic slanted summary. They do say that under some conditions that are not realistic it could take 100 million years, but using realistic boundaries, the time required is more in the very few hundreds of thousand years-very practicable for evolution. In fact, their paper is a direct disputation of Behe's nonsense.

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