Teaching Creationism not Good for Children (Page 16): The chemistry in a crystal is far too simple to be considered life (always with the "as we know it" proviso) and their growth is...

ngc1514 Loc: Atlanta, Ga., Lancaster, Oh. and Stuart, Fl.

The chemistry in a crystal is far too simple to be considered life (always with the "as we know it" proviso) and their growth is simply based on molecular structure.

glennkrewson

I have read with regard to virus, and virion, that

some have dna mostly animal targeted virion.

Some have rna, mostly plant activated virion.

and some have both,

and some start out with rna and then when transistioning from a virion to an active virus.convert to having dna. I am not sure but, I think this what the HIV virus does.

This is an interesting subject to me. I took a lot of life sciences and biology when going to school as this is one of my favorite subjects.

And yes, I was taught by teachers and professors who ascribed to and taught the theory of evolution to bring this subject back full circle, I just happen to disagree with them on this for reasons already stated.

As it has been quoted by Einstein (This time with reference to quantum mechanics) ... an inner voice tells me that it is not yet the real thing. The theory says a lot, but does not really bring us any closer to the secret of the "old one." I, at any rate, am convinced that He (that is God)does not throw dice. in a letter to Max Born (4 December 1926)...

Einstein said variants of this quote many times during his life. In 1943, for instance, conversation with William Hermanns he said once again; "As I have said so many times, God doesn't play dice with the world."

This kind of summarizes my thoughts as to evolution.

Nature tends to go from order to disorder and not the other way around. Entropy;

I think it would be far more likely for an explosion in a printing factory to create an up to date encyclopedia than for all the complexities of know life to have merely come about by chance. And to top this off for the varied life forms to be able to reproduce so as to propagate their different 'kinds' successfully.

There are many posits regarding chaos, heat and energy losses, entropy and etc, to justify what I am saying.

Case in point, there are vast deposits of lead which is the result of uranium, half lifing itself, depleting itself over probably millions of years. This argues successfully for the earth being a lot older than a few thousands of years.

Does uranium to lead argue against creation? According to the Bible?

No way, since the Bible starts off the creation process, prior to the 6 'days' or 6 time periods, by saying the heavens and the earth were already existing in Gen 1: "In the beginning (that is before the start of these creative days) God created the heavens and the earth..." and then it goes onto describe the 6 time periods many mistakenly conclude as being 6 literal 24 hour days. In Genesis 2:4; . . .This is a history of the heavens and the earth in the time of their being created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and heaven. Here those creative days or time periods are spoken of as being done in one day, not plural as in days. So the word day in the Bible is here used as we sometimes use in English "In my day... this or that"

glennkrewson

I totally agree with you on this, but, I have read of arguments to the contrary. To me, it would makes as much sense to ascribe fire to be a living entity. And I am sure both of agree fire is not, it is nothing but, rapid oxidation, in most cases.

Hey, we agree on something

ngc1514 Loc: Atlanta, Ga., Lancaster, Oh. and Stuart, Fl.

Unfortunately, Einstein was wrong about the dice and Heisenberg correct.

Not only does God play dice, He throws them where we cannot see them.

-- Stephen Hawking

Uncertainty stands.

Zero_Equals_Infinity Loc: Canada

Hal said:

Quote:

Ok Jesus over turned their tables and threw them out of the temple for doing what they were doing in the house of the loard. Why do you ask? I thjough you knew the Bible I guess not. Why dont you sit down and read it for your self. And dont take anything out of context. Like a lot of so called religons do.

Though definitely not a Christian, I have to agree with Hal on his interpretation. Exchanging money was not the issue, it was doing so in the house of God. Another supporting scripture is Matthew 22:21 -- "Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's."

This separation between the religious and secular was and is essential to the communities of the religious and those who stand outside of their communities. The state should be indifferent in matters of religion, though not immune to the moral suasion brought by any person, without regard to their religion.

The blending of the religious right and the GOP should be anethema to everyone, whether religious or not: It certainly would have been so to Jefferson and Franklin.

Nikonnorm Loc: East Gwillimbury Ont.

sinatraman wrote:

How sad and totally wrong! I was raised an atheist by my folks and was denied a relationship with Jesus for 38 years, That was a very costly form of child abuse. I don't think that God's word is true, I don't believe that God's word is true,I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT EVERYTHING IN THE BIBLE IS 100% TRUE.

I have felt the presence of Jesus both inside my soul as well as at church and as well as looking out at the ocean or looking at a magnificent florida sunset. I have seen miracles happen, had both my knees cartilage healed and arthritis in my left knee disappear. I have felt the Holy Ghost and have spoken in an unknown tongue. atheism is evil and leads down the road to Hitler, Stalin, pol pot, idi Armin and Mao. Bill Nye is heading for a very rude awakening when he dies and is face to face with Jesus who tells him " I did not come from an ape" of course by then it will be too late.

Had I been raised to know Jesus and to understand that He has my back, my life would have turned out much differently. I would not have made allot of my mistakes would have finished law school and gone on to be a prosecutor. By denying me a relationship with the Lord, my parents deprived me of a very valuable resource for dealing with the problems of life. If I knew at 18 that Jesus was real and thus Adam and Eve were real, i would have avoided harmful behaviors such as fornication, adultery, drunkenness, drug use, theft, and other sins I am guilty of committing.

Thankfully Jesus never gave up on me, and eventually I heard his call and responded positively. Having a relationship with Jesus and making Him number one in my life has allowed me to escape the prison of materialism, I focus on what's most important A strong relationship with God, which gives me the self confidence, patience and discipline to face boldly whatever life throws at me. In addition, I have no doubts that when the rapture of the church occurs (much sooner then people think) I Will be with my Lord and Saviour in Heaven and not on earth when all hell breaks loose literally.

Trusting in God and his word in the bible also has allowed me to overcome despair, depression and suicidal thoughts. You may choose to think your ancestors were primates, I choose to believe that my ancestor was made of the dust of the earth in God's own image. Man is not an animal, he was created to have dominion over the animals.

I realize that nothing I write will change your mind, so this answer and my testimony are for those who are honestly seeking to know if God exists and what is he like. My heart is troubled and burdened for atheists as I know where they WILL be spending eternity if they don't get right with Jesus. If anyone has serious questions ( not just looking for an argument) send me a pm. would be more then happy to share more of my testimony with anyone. God bless you all and God bless America

How sad and totally wrong! I was raised an athei... (show quote)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

jthomas Loc: Lancaster, PA

Blurryeyed wrote:

greymule wrote:

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Scientist and children's television personality Bill Nye, in a newly released online video, panned biblical creationism and implored American parents who reject the scientific theory of evolution not to teach their beliefs to their youngsters.

"I say to the grownups, 'If you want to deny evolution and live in your world that's completely inconsistent with everything we've observed in the universe that's fine. But don't make your kids do it,'" said Nye, best known as host of the educational TV series "Bill Nye the Science Guy."

The video, titled "Creationism Is Not Appropriate for Children," was posted on Thursday by the online knowledge forum Big Think to YouTube and had netted more than 1.3 million views as of Monday.

In it Nye said widespread public doubt in the scientific concept of evolution -- which holds that human beings and all other forms of life developed from a process of random genetic mutation and natural selection -- would hinder a country long renowned for its innovation, intellectual capital and a general grasp of science.

"When you have a portion of the population that doesn't believe in (evolution) it holds everybody back, really," he said.

According to a Gallup poll that surveyed 1,012 adults in May, 46 percent of Americans can be described as creationists for believing that God created humans in their present form at some point within the last 10,000 years.

Education advocates have argued for decades over what children should be taught in public schools in regard to the formation of the universe, life and humans.

The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in 1987 that requiring biblical creation to be taught in public schools alongside evolution was unconstitutional as a violation of the First Amendment separation between church and state.

In April, a law was passed that protects teachers in Tennessee who wish to critique or analyze what they view as the scientific weaknesses of evolution, making it the second state, after Louisiana, to enable teachers to more easily espouse alternatives to evolution in the classroom.

Nye said that while many adults may believe in creationism, children should be taught evolution in order to understand science. Absent a grasp of evolution, he said, "You're just not going to get the right answers." And he called evolution the "fundamental idea in all of life science, in all of biology."

Teaching children the building blocks of science is essential for the country's future, he added, saying, "We need them. We need scientifically literate voters and taxpayers for the future."

Nye's popular show, produced by Disney's Buena Vista Television, aired from September 1993 to June 1998 on PBS and was also syndicated to local television stations.

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Scientist and children's tele... (show quote)

Irrelevant Post... I know plenty of religious people, and I have actually discussed this topic with them, I don't remember even one who did not believe in evolution...

quote=greymule NEW YORK (Reuters) - Scientist and... (show quote)

I guess I'm the first one then but I don't.

jthomas Loc: Lancaster, PA

Nikonnorm wrote:

sinatraman wrote:

How sad and totally wrong! I was raised an atheist by my folks and was denied a relationship with Jesus for 38 years, That was a very costly form of child abuse. I don't think that God's word is true, I don't believe that God's word is true,I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT EVERYTHING IN THE BIBLE IS 100% TRUE.

I have felt the presence of Jesus both inside my soul as well as at church and as well as looking out at the ocean or looking at a magnificent florida sunset. I have seen miracles happen, had both my knees cartilage healed and arthritis in my left knee disappear. I have felt the Holy Ghost and have spoken in an unknown tongue. atheism is evil and leads down the road to Hitler, Stalin, pol pot, idi Armin and Mao. Bill Nye is heading for a very rude awakening when he dies and is face to face with Jesus who tells him " I did not come from an ape" of course by then it will be too late.

Had I been raised to know Jesus and to understand that He has my back, my life would have turned out much differently. I would not have made allot of my mistakes would have finished law school and gone on to be a prosecutor. By denying me a relationship with the Lord, my parents deprived me of a very valuable resource for dealing with the problems of life. If I knew at 18 that Jesus was real and thus Adam and Eve were real, i would have avoided harmful behaviors such as fornication, adultery, drunkenness, drug use, theft, and other sins I am guilty of committing.

Thankfully Jesus never gave up on me, and eventually I heard his call and responded positively. Having a relationship with Jesus and making Him number one in my life has allowed me to escape the prison of materialism, I focus on what's most important A strong relationship with God, which gives me the self confidence, patience and discipline to face boldly whatever life throws at me. In addition, I have no doubts that when the rapture of the church occurs (much sooner then people think) I Will be with my Lord and Saviour in Heaven and not on earth when all hell breaks loose literally.

Trusting in God and his word in the bible also has allowed me to overcome despair, depression and suicidal thoughts. You may choose to think your ancestors were primates, I choose to believe that my ancestor was made of the dust of the earth in God's own image. Man is not an animal, he was created to have dominion over the animals.

I realize that nothing I write will change your mind, so this answer and my testimony are for those who are honestly seeking to know if God exists and what is he like. My heart is troubled and burdened for atheists as I know where they WILL be spending eternity if they don't get right with Jesus. If anyone has serious questions ( not just looking for an argument) send me a pm. would be more then happy to share more of my testimony with anyone. God bless you all and God bless America

How sad and totally wrong! I was raised an athei... (show quote)

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

quote=sinatraman How sad and totally wrong! I w... (show quote)

I'm on-board w/ you, sinatraman. Accepting Christ as my Lord & Savior has changed me for the better in so many ways; ways that those still in the fog of disbelief can't see or imagine. The Bible's teaching that "the preaching of the cross is foolishness to them who don't believe" is so evident in our world today. Unfortunately, as unbelievers will one day realize, their disbelief didn't change its (Bible's) truth nor their unfortunate eternal outcome.

RixPix Loc: Miami, Florida

donrent wrote:

To teach Bibical Thoughts as factual happenings is absolutly assinine... A scientific proven fact overules ANY belief thought that there is......

You tell 'em Don.

Nikonnorm Loc: East Gwillimbury Ont.

RixPix wrote:

donrent wrote:

To teach Bibical Thoughts as factual happenings is absolutly assinine... A scientific proven fact overules ANY belief thought that there is......

You tell 'em Don.

Just because you don't believe in the Bible dose not make it false.
Will keep you in my prayers

ngc1514 Loc: Atlanta, Ga., Lancaster, Oh. and Stuart, Fl.

jthomas wrote:

Blurryeyed wrote:

Irrelevant Post... I know plenty of religious people, and I have actually discussed this topic with them, I don't remember even one who did not believe in evolution...

I guess I'm the first one then but I don't.

Probably should have pointed this out when Blurryeyed made his post. I didn't, so will do so know. Evolution and the theory of evolution are scientific concepts and no one - at least among those who have even the slightest grasp of the philosophy of science - believe in the theory of evolution. They accept that evolution is true because it's observed in labs and nature every day. Not "believing" in the change in allele frequency of a gene over time is like saying you don't believe the earth orbits the sun.

The theories of evolution are, like all scientific theories, tentative, problematic and incomplete. Science does not believe in any of its theories, but uses them as long as they provide the best explanation of the world around us. Let a better theory come along that offers better explanations of the data and a theory is dropped or modified to fit the new data.

The last major theory that was discarded in our lifetimes was the Steady State theory of cosmology. It was replaced by Big Bang cosmology when some of the predictions made by the BB theory were shown to be accurate. Science has progressed to the point where most extant theories are pretty good explanations. Some of the theories may be modified, but I'm not aware of any that are on a shaky foundation.

No matter what the Young Earthers claim...

Zero_Equals_Infinity Loc: Canada

Birthers,
Young Earthers,
They are all quite insane.
Taken together, totally inane.

Apocalypse yearning,
The "Left Behind" burning.
With nothing to show,
'cause their minds are too slow.

ngc1514 Loc: Atlanta, Ga., Lancaster, Oh. and Stuart, Fl.

The meek will inherit the Earth. The rest of us are going to the stars.

silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.

sinatraman wrote:

How sad and totally wrong! I was raised an atheist by my folks and was denied a relationship with Jesus for 38 years, That was a very costly form of child abuse. I don't think that God's word is true, I don't believe that God's word is true,I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT EVERYTHING IN THE BIBLE IS 100% TRUE.

I have felt the presence of Jesus both inside my soul as well as at church and as well as looking out at the ocean or looking at a magnificent florida sunset. I have seen miracles happen, had both my knees cartilage healed and arthritis in my left knee disappear. I have felt the Holy Ghost and have spoken in an unknown tongue. atheism is evil and leads down the road to Hitler, Stalin, pol pot, idi Armin and Mao. Bill Nye is heading for a very rude awakening when he dies and is face to face with Jesus who tells him " I did not come from an ape" of course by then it will be too late.

Had I been raised to know Jesus and to understand that He has my back, my life would have turned out much differently. I would not have made allot of my mistakes would have finished law school and gone on to be a prosecutor. By denying me a relationship with the Lord, my parents deprived me of a very valuable resource for dealing with the problems of life. If I knew at 18 that Jesus was real and thus Adam and Eve were real, i would have avoided harmful behaviors such as fornication, adultery, drunkenness, drug use, theft, and other sins I am guilty of committing.

Thankfully Jesus never gave up on me, and eventually I heard his call and responded positively. Having a relationship with Jesus and making Him number one in my life has allowed me to escape the prison of materialism, I focus on what's most important A strong relationship with God, which gives me the self confidence, patience and discipline to face boldly whatever life throws at me. In addition, I have no doubts that when the rapture of the church occurs (much sooner then people think) I Will be with my Lord and Saviour in Heaven and not on earth when all hell breaks loose literally.

Trusting in God and his word in the bible also has allowed me to overcome despair, depression and suicidal thoughts. You may choose to think your ancestors were primates, I choose to believe that my ancestor was made of the dust of the earth in God's own image. Man is not an animal, he was created to have dominion over the animals.

I realize that nothing I write will change your mind, so this answer and my testimony are for those who are honestly seeking to know if God exists and what is he like. My heart is troubled and burdened for atheists as I know where they WILL be spending eternity if they don't get right with Jesus. If anyone has serious questions ( not just looking for an argument) send me a pm. would be more then happy to share more of my testimony with anyone. God bless you all and God bless America

How sad and totally wrong! I was raised an athei... (show quote)

Everything in the bible is true? Well, explain this. How could there be days when there was no sun or moon. I am sure that the bible says something about what was created on the first day, and the second and the third days but wasnt it until the forth day when the sun and moon were created? If this is the case then how could there be days? Hmmm, curious. Doesnt make sense.

ngc1514 Loc: Atlanta, Ga., Lancaster, Oh. and Stuart, Fl.

silver wrote:

Everything in the bible is true? Well, explain this. How could there be days when there was no sun or moon. I am sure that the bible says something about what was created on the first day, and the second and the third days but wasnt it until the forth day when the sun and moon were created? If this is the case then how could there be days? Hmmm, curious. Doesnt make sense.

It makes perfect sense if you consider who it was written by and who it was written for. Unlike other Near Eastern cultures. the Hebrews have left no examples of the sophistication of their science or math other than the one found in Genesis.

The Babylonians started astronomy with their astrological tradition. The Egyptians knew geometry and surveying as well as some positional astronomy. They worked in metals and glass as well, of course, in stone.

The Hebrews could imagine day and night without the sun.