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Best Way To Calculate Number Of Shots Per Stack?
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Jun 30, 2016 03:09:29   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
So, continuing my endeavours into macro photography I am now starting to use a focusing rail. It's the Cognysis Stackshot.

I have done a lot of reading to gain as much knowledge before I start and haven't been able to find much information on the best way to calculate the number of shots per stack.
The general consensus of opinion appears to be somewhere between 15-20 'slices' per inch of stack at an aperture around f/11-f/13.
That doesn't sound very many, (?), and having checked my DoF preview at 1:1 focusing distance with my Nikkor 105mm macro doesn't seem enough?

Do you experienced macro shooters use a DoF calculator or is it safe to just take a guess based on DoF preview and add some more so that there are plenty of overlaps?

Does it do the final image any harm if there are too many slices/shots captured in one stack?

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Jun 30, 2016 05:55:01   #
oldtigger Loc: Roanoke Virginia-USA
 
i get decent results when using 40-60% overlap of images

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Jun 30, 2016 21:13:05   #
Nikonian72 Loc: Chico CA
 
I suggest that you read a few Focus-Stacking articles near the bottom of this thread:
Frequently Asked Questions & Answers Concerning Macro-Photography at http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-36372-1.html

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Jun 30, 2016 22:13:10   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
Thank you Nikonian72,
I have been through all of these but will take another look.
Maybe I am missing the obvious!!! :)

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Jul 1, 2016 06:08:04   #
oldtigger Loc: Roanoke Virginia-USA
 
Try this site, they have lots of good tutorial material: www.zerenesystems.com/cms/stacker

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Jul 1, 2016 08:13:37   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
Nikonian72 - There is a great deal of information in those links and I have read through the focus-stacking articles you mention again but I dont see anything about calculating the number of slices/shots per stack...?
Am I missing something here?

Oldtigger - thank you for your lead... I will take a look at your suggested site.

I am also going though Michael Erlewine's tutorials online so will hopefully gather some info there too...

I tried some focus stacking today using a caterpillar as a model. I created a stacked set of 6 and then 12 images per stack over a depth of no more than half an inch.
Using PS6 I tried processing the set but the results were just a blurred mess!
Looking at my images individually, I could see the focus plane moving from front to back and all appeared well covered but the results in PS6 were useless.
The caterpillar was hairy and I have read these are not easy to deal with?
Perhaps I will try a simple subject like a pen tip tomorrow and get that working before moving forward...
Oh joy... I like a challenge!

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Jul 1, 2016 11:33:35   #
naturepics43 Loc: Hocking Co. Ohio - USA
 
Yes, I use the Zerene Stacker DOF (step size) chart, I use 70% of their step size. For the 105G @1:1 & f 11, you will need 134 "slices" per inch. Most all claculations use the metric system. The step (slice) size will be 0.189 mm. Too many images is better than too few! Be generous with the "start" & "stop" points. You don't have to use all of them for the stack.

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Jul 1, 2016 14:44:20   #
Nikonian72 Loc: Chico CA
 
"Topics matching your query."
http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/search-topic-list?q=focus-stack&sectnum=0&username=

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Jul 1, 2016 20:40:10   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
Hi naturepics43, I have had a look at Zerene and it looks interesting. So far I have only used PS6 for combining the stacks. It hasnt been too bad previously but my latest attempt with the hairy caterpillar was hopeless. I will have a look for the Zerene chart. Sounds like it is just what I have been looking for? The 134 slices per inch sounds more like it, not the 15-20 mentioned elsewhere. Thanks for your comments on the start and stop points. It is also good to know it is wise to shoot more than I need per stack.

Hello again Nikonian72, Thank you for the link. I will digest my way through all that. I have now watched all 24 tutorials, (quite a few hours!), from Michael Erlewine and still no mention about calculating the step distance per shot!
Will keep looking.

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Jul 1, 2016 22:50:58   #
naturepics43 Loc: Hocking Co. Ohio - USA
 
EnEs63 wrote:
still no mention about calculating the step distance per shot!
The tables at http://zerenesystems.com/cms/stacker/docs/tables/macromicrodof will give you all the info you need. For your Nikon 105G lens, use table 2-B. As an example, magnification of 1:1 & f 11, the table shows 0.27 mm for the step size which is a calculated minimum "step" distance. I want more overlap in my stacks so I use 70% of 0.27 mm ( 0.189 mm). If you have more questions, let me know.

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Jul 2, 2016 08:18:32   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
Naturepics43, This is just what I have been looking for. Thank you.
Zerene Stacker looks pretty good also and having read through some of the tutorials I may well give it a try.
PS6 has served ok in the past for stacking but perhaps I need the greater flexibility and power of a dedicated software?
I note that ZS does not work with raw files. Maybe I will have to revert back to JPG for stacking projects.
Thank you again and once I can get this under my belt I'll post some results!

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Jul 2, 2016 09:15:38   #
naturepics43 Loc: Hocking Co. Ohio - USA
 
EnEs63 wrote:
I note that ZS does not work with raw files. Maybe I will have to revert back to JPG for stacking projects.
I highly recommend Zerene Stacker. Zerene does accept .TIF files (which is all I use for stacking), so all you need to do is convert the .NEF files to .TIFF (can be done in Nikon ViewNX2) . There is a subtle difference between .jpg & .tif stacks. I did a quick test a while back, see http://www.uglyhedgehog.com/t-360343-1.html
Have fun.

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Jul 2, 2016 09:23:04   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
Yes, I read that .tif is an option. Big files sizes though!

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Jul 2, 2016 09:27:58   #
mawyatt Loc: Clearwater, Florida
 
Zerene can use TIFF files, which is what I use. Some cameras (Nikon D800, D500) can produce TIFF directly, if your camera can not, then you can convert the RAW files to TIFF in LR. This is what I did until I realized the camera could produce TIFF images directly. Make sure you have a large memory card as the TIFF files are larger than RAW. For example, on the D800 they are 110MB each, while the RAW files are 50~60MB. I use 64GB cards which limit my stacks to about 580 in one session, with a 128GB card you could do over 1000.
BTW, Zerene is excellent software for stacking IMO, specifically designed for such.

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Jul 2, 2016 09:47:12   #
EnEs63 Loc: Asia
 
I have the D300s, D700 and D3s which can all produce .Tiffs. I have never done this though as I have got into the habit of working with RAW only. Maybe time to change?!
Yes, Zerene Stacker gets good reviews. I have also been looking at Helicon Focus and that receives good reviews too.
At the moment HF does have two advantages for me - the Lightroom plugin is available even in the 'lite' version where as you have to pay for the 'pro' package in ZS for the same feature.
Secondly, HF accepts RAW where as ZS does not. Maybe this will allow me to continue my current workflow that I am used to? Oh, so may choices!

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