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Michael Behe Hasn't Been Refuted on the Flagellum
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Oct 25, 2015 20:44:49   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
This is to set the record straight on the deceptive argument that the bacterial flagellum has been debunked or refuted as being an irreducible complexity organism, it has not at this period of time.


[m]“It is indeed true that natural selection cannot build any feature in which intermediate steps do not confer a net benefit on the organism.”[/b] (Jerry Coyne, "The Great Mutator," The New Republic (June 14, 2007).)

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2011/03/michael_behe_hasnt_been_refute044801.html

"According to Lyle's principal the best explanation is the one that invokes a cause which we know from our experience which can produce the effect we are trying to explain."- Stephen Meyer.

"There is only one known cause for information, that is Intelligence"- Stephen Meyer

Too specified and complex required to have happened by natural selection + mutations
Too specified and complex required to have happene...


(Download)

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Oct 25, 2015 21:36:01   #
James Shaw
 
Racmanaz wrote:
This is to set the record straight on the deceptive argument that the bacterial flagellum has been debunked or refuted as being an irreducible complexity organism, it has not at this period of time.
[m]“It is indeed true that natural selection cannot build any feature in which intermediate steps do not confer a net benefit on the organism.”[/b] (Jerry Coyne, "The Great Mutator," The New Republic (June 14, 2007).)
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2011/03/michael_behe_hasnt_been_refute044801.html
"According to Lyle's principal the best explanation is the one that invokes a cause which we know from our experience which can produce the effect we are trying to explain."- Stephen Meyer.
"There is only one known cause for information, that is Intelligence"- Stephen Meyer
This is to set the record straight on the deceptiv... (show quote)


___________________________________________________________________________________________________
Beware:
The Clown posting the above nonsense was so ridiculed on his earlier fraudulent and intentionally misleading thread that he willingly gave it up and left.

Now, this Clown's is posting very similar nonsense again here (see above). The conclusions made here are no more valid than on earlier posts. They are not based on science. The are pseudoscience. They are from the Discovery Institute that continuously attempts to confuse science with superstition.

This clown cannot be trusted. He is a fraud. He pretends to know science to make himself look like a big-shot but he is very much science-ignorant. Rational minds are not easily fooled by this clown.

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Oct 25, 2015 23:17:43   #
green Loc: 22.1749611,-159.646704,20
 
ken hubert wrote:
Like we would believe your rants over his.
ken... You need to stay out of these Intelligent Design vs Evolution threads... I know the name-calling is particularly enticing, but trust me, everyone of these goes to 27 pages of pseudo-science and stupid-science.... you will lose 3 IQ points for every one of these you participate in.

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Oct 26, 2015 00:25:13   #
slocumeddie Loc: Inside your head, again
 
Racmanaz wrote:
This is to set the record straight on the deceptive argument that the bacterial flagellum has been debunked or refuted as being an irreducible complexity organism, it has not at this period of time.

“It is indeed true that natural selection cannot build any feature in which intermediate steps do not confer a net benefit on the organism.” (Jerry Coyne, "The Great Mutator," The New Republic (June 14, 2007).)
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2011/03/michael_behe_hasnt_been_refute044801.html

"According to Lyle's principal the best explanation is the one that invokes a cause which we know from our experience which can produce the effect we are trying to explain."- Stephen Meyer.

"There is only one known cause for information, that is Intelligence"- Stephen Meyer
This is to set the record straight on the deceptiv... (show quote)
The word "evolution" carries many associations. Usually it means common descent -- the idea that all organisms living and dead are related by common ancestry.

I have no quarrel with the idea of common descent, and continue to think it explains similarities among species.

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Oct 26, 2015 01:32:32   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
"According to Lyle's principal the best explanation is the one that invokes a cause which we know from our experience which can produce the effect we are trying to explain."- Stephen Meyer.

"There is only one known cause for information, that is Intelligence"- Stephen Meyer[/quote]

This biological molecular machine cannot be produced by unguilded processes such as mutations or natural selection.
This biological molecular machine cannot be produc...

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Oct 26, 2015 01:35:15   #
Racmanaz Loc: Sunny Tucson!
 
ken hubert wrote:
My,all these pseudo-science experts. Where ever do they come from?


They evolved from an ape like creatures remember?

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Oct 26, 2015 01:49:08   #
slocumeddie Loc: Inside your head, again
 
Racmanaz wrote:
They evolved from an ape like creatures remember?
The word "evolution" carries many associations. Usually it means common descent -- the idea that all organisms living and dead are related by common ancestry.

I have no quarrel with the idea of common descent, and continue to think it explains similarities among species.

Reply
 
 
Oct 26, 2015 03:50:03   #
silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
This is to set the record straight on the deceptive argument that the bacterial flagellum has been debunked or refuted as being an irreducible complexity organism, it has not at this period of time.


[m]“It is indeed true that natural selection cannot build any feature in which intermediate steps do not confer a net benefit on the organism.”[/b] (Jerry Coyne, "The Great Mutator," The New Republic (June 14, 2007).)

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2011/03/michael_behe_hasnt_been_refute044801.html

"According to Lyle's principal the best explanation is the one that invokes a cause which we know from our experience which can produce the effect we are trying to explain."- Stephen Meyer.

"There is only one known cause for information, that is Intelligence"- Stephen Meyer
This is to set the record straight on the deceptiv... (show quote)


This is just more bullshit from an ultra conservative bunch of people desperately trying to validate their ridiculous unintelligent design so called theory. Just an absolute waste of time.

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Oct 26, 2015 03:51:23   #
silver Loc: Santa Monica Ca.
 
Racmanaz wrote:
This is to set the record straight on the deceptive argument that the bacterial flagellum has been debunked or refuted as being an irreducible complexity organism, it has not at this period of time.


[m]“It is indeed true that natural selection cannot build any feature in which intermediate steps do not confer a net benefit on the organism.”[/b] (Jerry Coyne, "The Great Mutator," The New Republic (June 14, 2007).)

http://www.evolutionnews.org/2011/03/michael_behe_hasnt_been_refute044801.html

"According to Lyle's principal the best explanation is the one that invokes a cause which we know from our experience which can produce the effect we are trying to explain."- Stephen Meyer.

"There is only one known cause for information, that is Intelligence"- Stephen Meyer
This is to set the record straight on the deceptiv... (show quote)


This is just more bullshit from an ultra conservative bunch of people desperately trying to validate their ridiculous unintelligent design so called theory. Just an absolute waste of time. http://doubtfulnews.com/2013/04/intelligent-design-the-stupid-that-keeps-bobbing-to-the-surface/

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Oct 26, 2015 05:42:33   #
mwalsh Loc: Houston
 
Joust on good fellows.

Windmills abound on both sides !!

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Oct 26, 2015 10:36:39   #
OldDoc Loc: New York
 
Behe has been refuted on this issue. See http://www.nature.com/nrmicro/journal/v4/n10/full/nrmicro1493.html for an explanation. Briefly, the components of the bacterial flagellum existed/exist in simpler forms playing other roles, mostly secretory. Occasionally, even today, these simpler units are seen to aggregate, and even rotate. The key idea here is that the flagellum is reducible to components that carry out other tasks. Similarly, Behe insists that blood clotting is irreducibly complex, whereas it is not. Whales use only a fraction of the units used in other mammals to produce blood clotting. Furthermore, many of the components of the clotting cascade are proteases that, in other species carry out protein degradation, but not (yet) clotting.

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Oct 26, 2015 11:09:49   #
slocumeddie Loc: Inside your head, again
 
Invest 10 minutes watching this video..........then give it some thought.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_5FToP_mMY

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Oct 26, 2015 14:38:34   #
James Shaw
 
Quote:
ken hubert wrote:
My,all these pseudo-science experts. Where ever do they come from?
Racmanaz wrote:
They evolved from an ape like creatures remember?

Wake up man, so many of the pseudoscience "experts" dwell at the Clown's temple of worship, called the "Discovery" Institute.

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Oct 26, 2015 15:01:08   #
James Shaw
 
slocumeddie wrote:
Invest 10 minutes watching this video..........then give it some thought.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_5FToP_mMY

Good video. Video conclusion: Irreducible complexity falls apart.

Moreover, the "injection device" used by Yersinia pestis to cause the horrible disease called the black plague, that eradicated 2/3 of the population of England in the 1300's, was a product of evolution.

The Clown and advocates would have others believe that the syringe of Yersinia pestis was "intelligently designed" and that it did not evolve. Anyone believing this should have their head examined.

Intelligent design is just another myth prepretrated by the clown and others who are paid by the D. Institute. ID has been discredited by science time and again. Even Behe's institution (Department) does not stand by him on these ridiculous notions. Being rational individuals, they know better.
_________
The Clown is science-ignorant, and he chooses to remain that way when knowledge surrounds him. He could be helped by the National Academy of Sciences on line, but he refuses to read and educated himself with what those experts have to say.

If one, like the Clown, insists on remaining ignorant, when knowledge surrounds him, then there is little another can do to help him. The thrust must then be to expose him for what he is and for his intentional fraudulent maneuvers.

He is a frightened little Clown.

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Oct 28, 2015 08:00:18   #
slocumeddie Loc: Inside your head, again
 
Rac wrote:
Michael Behe Hasn't Been Refuted on the Flagellum
Of course he has.....it is a matter of record..........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_5FToP_mMY

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